transplantbillsfan Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 Cruuuuuuuu Saaaaaaade ! Agreed... Old School needs to stop with his stupid "but WRs were always open" crusade Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transplantbillsfan Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 Why did our WR's have one of the lowest drop percentages in the league then? I can't see how both can be accurate. More importantly, TT almost always had Sammy, Woods or Clay to throw to every game and that trio of receivers who are assuredly starter quality or higher always received the lion's share of targets. Seriously? You can't see how both can be accurate? Tell ya what... Fahey ranks Taylor as having the 4th most "failed receptions" (meaning the WR should have caught the ball but didn't. Since you assume drops are apparently 100% accurate, go watch the 2nd Patriots game again. 8:15 in the 2nd quarter Taylor throws probably a 50 yard bomb to Charles Clay who's covered fairly well but the ball is so accurate it literally hits Clay's right hand, but because Clay doesn't have very good deep ball tracking skills, the fact that the ball hit his right hand was almost incidental because Clay never even tries to grab it with his right. It happened exactly that way. They even replayed it in slow motion. I have stills on my computer and could post them for you if I knew how on this message board. In NFL's official breakdown of that play, it was called an overthrow. It wasn't. Drops aren't very meticulously tracked. Lol, and more of the same from your condescending bullying tone, paper tiger! Provide you with proof, who are you again? It is obvious and everyone does know it, it's been said and proven here many times. I'm not playing your childish game, you find it. You come in here guns blazing from day one telling everyone their wrong about everything and you expect respect. Naw, you do the legwork, it's there! More names... Just sad. Pity you can't partake in some legitimate football discussion. hard to accomplish, sure. unrealistic, probably never happened before. Russell Wilson says hello, btw. Russell Wilson was a legitimate 1st round prospect if not for his height. Peterman... not so much... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 Jay Skurski (@JaySkurski) 4/29/17, 2:47 PM Sean McDermott says every quarterback on the roster will compete for the starting job -- it won't be handed to Tyrod Taylor. #Bills You would think not, that he wouldn't be handed it. The odds on him winning it will be very high indeed, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transplantbillsfan Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 sorry but... aint. gonna. happen. Unless it does I never said we did. You'd be hard pressed to find players who aren't battling some kind of nagging something every year. The Robert Woods groin smells like revisionist history. Bills had their #1 and #2 WRs missing more games than all but a few teams in the NFL, none of whom made the playoffs, either... so.... there's that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 (edited) Seriously? You can't see how both can be accurate? Tell ya what... Fahey ranks Taylor as having the 4th most "failed receptions" (meaning the WR should have caught the ball but didn't. Since you assume drops are apparently 100% accurate, go watch the 2nd Patriots game again. 8:15 in the 2nd quarter Taylor throws probably a 50 yard bomb to Charles Clay who's covered fairly well but the ball is so accurate it literally hits Clay's right hand, but because Clay doesn't have very good deep ball tracking skills, the fact that the ball hit his right hand was almost incidental because Clay never even tries to grab it with his right. It happened exactly that way. They even replayed it in slow motion. I have stills on my computer and could post them for you if I knew how on this message board. In NFL's official breakdown of that play, it was called an overthrow. It wasn't. Drops aren't very meticulously tracked. More names... Just sad. Pity you can't partake in some legitimate football discussion. Russell Wilson was a legitimate 1st round prospect if not for his height. Peterman... not so much... I know you don't see it, but your description there of that throw to Clay at 8:15 in the Pats game is very questionable. It's a bang-bang play, it's terrific coverage at the end, McCourty makes slight contact with Clay's lower body as he starts to extend and dive an instant before the catch which makes it a very difficult one. And yeah I guess you could say it hit his hand, but what actually happened is that it grazed his pinky. I just went back and watched it a number of times, both on the standard view and the replay and in the All-22, and that play is at best questionable. And while it wasn't a bad throw, it sure wasn't as good as it could've been. McCourty was coming from the inside, from safety, and Tyrod's throw instead of leading Clay further outside and away, pulled him slightly back towards McCourty allowing McCourty to catch up to Clay and make contact with him. The contact causes his body to slightly revolve and seems to make it impossible for him to get his right hand in, though it's very questionable whether he'd have been able to reach it anyway. Further outside and a bit shorter and it would've had a better chance. Calling it an overthrow is a reasonable interpretation, as with the contact, slight though it was, and the ball's distance it's in an extremely difficult position Clay is in. It would have been an incredible catch if he'd made it. That could reasonably be called several ways. He had to twist his body so awkwardly to make the try that he came down awkwardly and injured himself. As for Peterman not being a legitimate 1st round prospect, neither was Brady. That means nothing. Guys have outperformed their draft status before and will again. And rookies have beaten out vets (particularly unspectacular vets) before and will again. Yeah, it's certainly unlikely in this case, but not impossible. Cunningham beat out Jaworski, for instance and that was totally unexpected. Or Marino taking over for Woodley who had led the Fins to the SB the year before. And drops are very meticulously tracked, though in some cases it's simply an opinion. And that Clay play is an excellent example of that. That this comes down to opinion is the case for Fahey as much as it is for the Washington Post, the standard for that metric. http://stats.washingtonpost.com/fb/tmleaders.asp?range=NFL&rank=232&type=Receiving Agreed... Old School needs to stop with his stupid "but WRs were always open" crusade Yes, he should stop, though he's absolutely correct on that. I was astonished to see it on the All-22, but I watched nine full games, over and over again on the All-22. And there were very very few plays when Tyrod didn't have a guy significantly open. Edited May 15, 2017 by Thurman#1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 (edited) You're right. You have to think back to your high school sports experience, if you have one. I have several. What did the coach do in tryouts? First, he put his presumptive starters on the field or court and ran some plays, then a second group, then a third group. And he watched. Base on his observations, some guys moved up, some guys moved down. Eventually he made cuts. Then it continued in practice. If the presumed starters are doing their jobs well, they keep they're jobs. If a guy isn't doing his job well enough, or if his backup is lighting up, the backup starts getting some reps, and the coach watches. I can't imagine ti will be different for Taylor. It isn't good for the development of players to have a true open competition, sharing reps and all that. It's a new offense, Taylor's the presumed starter, he'll need all the reps he can get. If Yates, Jones or Peterman are really lighting it up through the spring and summer, sure, McDermott should look at the guy as a starter. But on day one, Taylor will be the starter and he'll continue to be the starter unless he can't execute or someone is looking really special. Ever see the comments on why Marino took over as QB so early? They said that they expected him to be the #2 that first year. And weren't surprised or overly impressed to see that he was leading the #1 offense to TDs against the #2 defense. But that he was also leading the #2 offense to TDs over the #1 defense. That changed their view. It wasn't that the starter was playing badly. It was just that Marino outplayed him. When a guy plays better that the other guy it's not hard to notice. There'll be a chance. No, I don't think it'll happen. And if they play roughly equal, that would be a win for Tyrod. But when you folks say you know what's going to happen, you're wrong. You know what's likely to happen. Those are very reasonable educated guesses, indeed by far the most probably outcomes. They are not facts. You have to listen in context. McD clearly was saying that no one is guaranteed a job and no one is guaranteed a starting slot. You have to earn it. And QB is no different. He also was saying that competition is good and everyone will be competing for his job all the time. But that doesn't mean that there are presumptive starters. When OTAs start, there has to be a first group, second group, third group. And the presumptive starters will be in the first group. Other guys, as they earn it, will work their way into first group reps. If they're good enough, they could take jobs from presumptive starters. So Beane didn't say something that contradicted McDermott. Beane was talking about who would line up at QB until someone took his job. McDermott was saying everyone would compete for jobs. That's true. This is it exactly. Edited May 15, 2017 by Thurman#1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overseas Bills Fan Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 Use TT like they use Cam. Let him develop more like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transplantbillsfan Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 (edited) I know you don't see it, but your description there of that throw to Clay at 8:15 in the Pats game is very questionable. It's a bang-bang play, it's terrific coverage at the end, McCourty makes slight contact with Clay's lower body as he starts to extend and dive an instant before the catch which makes it a very difficult one. And yeah I guess you could say it hit his hand, but what actually happened is that it grazed his pinky. I just went back and watched it a number of times, both on the standard view and the replay and in the All-22, and that play is at best questionable. And while it wasn't a bad throw, it sure wasn't as good as it could've been. McCourty was coming from the inside, from safety, and Tyrod's throw instead of leading Clay further outside and away, pulled him slightly back towards McCourty allowing McCourty to catch up to Clay and make contact with him. The contact causes his body to slightly revolve and seems to make it impossible for him to get his right hand in, though it's very questionable whether he'd have been able to reach it anyway. Further outside and a bit shorter and it would've had a better chance. Calling it an overthrow is a reasonable interpretation, as with the contact, slight though it was, and the ball's distance it's in an extremely difficult position Clay is in. It would have been an incredible catch if he'd made it. That could reasonably be called several ways. He had to twist his body so awkwardly to make the try that he came down awkwardly and injured himself. Wow... what an absolute joke disguised as a reasonable post, which is typically you. I'm sorry but is the pinky part of the hand? Better yet, would you call that a play where Clay was tracking the ball well at all? Was the ball placed so that Clay could have caught it without diving or slowing down if he had his hands in the right position? Thurm I don't care about these posts anymore from you because it's clear you're unable to engage in conversations where the strongest argument conflicts with your own rigid beliefs as you just end up running away when proven wrong, But... Anyone else I'll challenge to watch that play and tell me it's not a great throw by a QB and a missed catch that NFL players make consistently... Edited May 15, 2017 by transplantbillsfan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transplantbillsfan Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 I was astonished to see it on the All-22, but I watched nine full games, over and over again on the All-22. And there were very very few plays when Tyrod didn't have a guy significantly open. How many of those plays did Taylor have the opportunity to get those players the football due to factors like pressure, POV, or whether Taylor even looks the direction of that player because of where he is in his reads as was the case in the 1st pass play of the season he was so criticized for when Woods got wide open left but Taylor's 1st or 2nd read was clearly McCoy to the right who got open? And then did you watch All-22s of every other NFL QB in the NFL for a meaningful comparison? If not, your statement here (which, by the way, is incredibly vague) means very little... But when you folks say you know what's going to happen, you're wrong. You know what's likely to happen. Those are very reasonable educated guesses, indeed by far the most probably outcomes. They are not facts. Well, you should stop stating opinion as fact yourself if you're going to say stuff like this. You talk about Taylor missing wide open WRs on a consistent basis (so consistent that I think you said there were very very few plays he didn't have WRs running wide open that he should have and could have thrown to) as though it's a clear problem for Taylor that would need to be resolved before he could ever be considered the long term answer. Yet, you haven't bothered really examining how frequently or infrequently other better QBs have WRs doing the same... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 Unless he suffers an injury Tyrod Taylor will be the Bills starting Quarterback in week 1. What I do think this year is that the Bills will pull him out once the season is dead... I suspect we see some Peterman by the end of the year. You talk about Taylor missing wide open WRs on a consistent basis (so consistent that I think you said there were very very few plays he didn't have WRs running wide open that he should have and could have thrown to) as though it's a clear problem for Taylor that would need to be resolved before he could ever be considered the long term answer.Yet, you haven't bothered really examining how frequently or infrequently other better QBs have WRs doing the same... Well I have watched the all 22 on other Quarterbacks to compare and here are my conclusions: - he holds the ball too long; - he misses guys running open too often; - he bails clean pockets more than any of the other "running QBs" - I watched Newton, Wilson and Smith specifically. He can't be the long term answer. I put those chances at less than 1 in 10. Does that mean he sucks or isn't a top 20 / 22 Quarterback in the world? No it doesn't. But the contract reduction tells me the Bills don't believe he can be the long term answer either. It is right in the market for bridge contracts that Philly established last year when the retained Bradford. That is what the Bills think Tyrod is - a bridge - and he is a darn good bridge. But holding out hope that he is "our guy" is forlorn in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxx Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 (edited) Unless he suffers an injury Tyrod Taylor will be the Bills starting Quarterback in week 1. What I do think this year is that the Bills will pull him out once the season is dead... I suspect we see some Peterman by the end of the year. Well I have watched the all 22 on other Quarterbacks to compare and here are my conclusions: - he holds the ball too long; - he misses guys running open too often; - he bails clean pockets more than any of the other "running QBs" - I watched Newton, Wilson and Smith specifically. He can't be the long term answer. I put those chances at less than 1 in 10. Does that mean he sucks or isn't a top 20 / 22 Quarterback in the world? No it doesn't. But the contract reduction tells me the Bills don't believe he can be the long term answer either. It is right in the market for bridge contracts that Philly established last year when the retained Bradford. That is what the Bills think Tyrod is - a bridge - and he is a darn good bridge. But holding out hope that he is "our guy" is forlorn in my opinion. i can get on board with this perspective. Wel if he doesn't, we have 2 first round picks next year to go grab whoever Beane and company see as a potential franchise QB. This organization is in a great spot right now. agreed. they did what i said i wanted them to do all off season, get another first for next year. now.. if they could somehow obtain another first rounder for next year, i would feel totally comfortable that we could get whomever we wanted for QB. ... I have stills on my computer and could post them for you if I knew how on this message board. ... they do not host images on this site. in order to post an image here, you must post the image to another site that hosts and then paste the url for the hosted image in the image dialogue box here. Edited May 15, 2017 by Foxx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackOrton Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 Seriously? You can't see how both can be accurate? Tell ya what... Fahey ranks Taylor as having the 4th most "failed receptions" (meaning the WR should have caught the ball but didn't. Since you assume drops are apparently 100% accurate, go watch the 2nd Patriots game again. 8:15 in the 2nd quarter Taylor throws probably a 50 yard bomb to Charles Clay who's covered fairly well but the ball is so accurate it literally hits Clay's right hand, but because Clay doesn't have very good deep ball tracking skills, the fact that the ball hit his right hand was almost incidental because Clay never even tries to grab it with his right. It happened exactly that way. They even replayed it in slow motion. I have stills on my computer and could post them for you if I knew how on this message board. In NFL's official breakdown of that play, it was called an overthrow. It wasn't. Drops aren't very meticulously tracked. More names... Just sad. Pity you can't partake in some legitimate football discussion. Russell Wilson was a legitimate 1st round prospect if not for his height. Peterman... not so much... Oh, so my stat isn't 100% accurate, but the one that you like is. Gotcha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Gun Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 Yes, he should stop, though he's absolutely correct on that. I was astonished to see it on the All-22, but I watched nine full games, over and over again on the All-22. And there were very very few plays when Tyrod didn't have a guy significantly open. Doesn't fit paper tigers narrative so he resorts to condescension time and time again, but yeah i'm don with him. It is no longer about football with him, it is a mental game to win with him. It's all about being right and trying to prove everyone else wrong with differing views. Why do you think he is a teacher, can impose his views on kids and they have no recourse or voice, just how bullies like it. Who's got time for jerks like that. I'll stop the All-22 WR were open, it's been discussed and proven time and time again to be true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 @wgr550 Beane - If we walked out there today, I'd say Tyrod will be the starter. No one will be handed a position, we have a long way to go #Bills Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2020 Our Year For Sure Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 Cruuuuuuuu Saaaaaaade ! But deemed a pleasant crusade by the majority so it's fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusher Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 Doesn't fit paper tigers narrative so he resorts to condescension time and time again, but yeah i'm don with him. It is no longer about football with him, it is a mental game to win with him. It's all about being right and trying to prove everyone else wrong with differing views. Why do you think he is a teacher, can impose his views on kids and they have no recourse or voice, just how bullies like it. Who's got time for jerks like that. I'll stop the All-22 WR were open, it's been discussed and proven time and time again to be true. This is how everyone should view Transplant. He believes his POV is correct and condemns every one else and their opinions. And on top of that, he will blast others that do the same things he does, except that they are on the other side of the fence in that they don't believe in Tyrod. This guy is delusional, hypocritical, and so caught up in himself that it's impossible to legitimately discuss this topic with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan17 Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 Another disgruntled fan who is mad because our QB is not Tom Brady. Prepare yourself for a lifetime of disappointment friend. More misery in your future. Yet, the franchise shaved years off his deal. That's a fact! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangarang Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 @wgr550 Beane - If we walked out there today, I'd say Tyrod will be the starter. No one will be handed a position, we have a long way to go #Bills Not surprising really considering the alternatives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
transplantbillsfan Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 Oh, so my stat isn't 100% accurate, but the one that you like is. Gotcha. Where the hell did I say that? Doesn't fit paper tigers narrative so he resorts to condescension time and time again, but yeah i'm don with him. It is no longer about football with him, it is a mental game to win with him. It's all about being right and trying to prove everyone else wrong with differing views. Why do you think he is a teacher, can impose his views on kids and they have no recourse or voice, just how bullies like it. Who's got time for jerks like that. Now you're making this personal... don't know what the CoC exactly is over here, but being an intentional dick like this is usually not a good idea on a message board. This guy is delusional, hypocritical, and so caught up in himself that it's impossible to legitimately discuss this topic with him. Hmmm... sounds like someone you see in the mirror every day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusher Posted May 15, 2017 Share Posted May 15, 2017 Where the hell did I say that? Now you're making this personal... don't know what the CoC exactly is over here, but being an intentional dick like this is usually not a good idea on a message board. Hmmm... sounds like someone you see in the mirror every day You have made numerous posts on with the same tone on this board and the other one. Are you really this dense that you can't recognize it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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