Coach Tuesday Posted April 30, 2017 Posted April 30, 2017 Some of those show he had plenty of arm. Pretty sure you'll come to find that Peterman can make every one of those throws. But anyhow this is a silly argument. There is a difference between functional arm strength and actual arm strength. The former is much more important and depends primarily on the lower body mechanics. Peterman has enough arm to play in the NFL now, and with better programming he could improve in that area.
Kelly the Dog Posted April 30, 2017 Posted April 30, 2017 Pretty sure you'll come to find that Peterman can make every one of those throws. But anyhow this is a silly argument. There is a difference between functional arm strength and actual arm strength. The former is much more important and depends primarily on the lower body mechanics. Peterman has enough arm to play in the NFL now, and with better programming he could improve in that area. Yep. If Peterman can make all those throws then I think he can be a good starter. I fear he can't because guy's like Mayock say he's a career backup, and with all his other very good qualities, of which there are many, there seems to be no reason he lasts to the fifth. Guys like that get overdrafted not underdrafted. It was the same thing IMO with Rob Johnson. He had ALL of the tools that scouts love. Big arm, big stats, big school, could run, legendary high school coach as dad, pro offense. Except for some reason the scouts knew he wasn't a good QB, and he fell in the draft to the fourth round. Those guys always move up not down.
Wayne Cubed Posted April 30, 2017 Posted April 30, 2017 Yeah, when I say no chance I mean no chance of being a top level NFL starter for years let alone franchise guy. Not that he has no chance winning a job or winning a few games. I will admit, I didn't see a lot of Peterman. I have watched a lot of clips and didn't see what I think is requisite arm strength. If he has Kirk Cousins arm strength his ceiling is Kirk Cousins, which I think is slightly less than franchise guy. Some fans are fine with a Kirk Cousins, and I understand that. I am not. I don't think he can win it all. There are all just opinions. I said it in this thread above that the reason IMO that Peterman actually went lower in the draft than expected, even though he has two dozen things going for him in his favor, is because scouts and GMs knew he could never do it. Mayock, my favorite of the pundits, said he has a good chance to be a long time number two. That's a valuable commodity in the NFL, backup QB. But that's not the same as a guy who can be your man. If he's Frank Reich, great. But we want a Jim Kelly. And actually, I'm not sure why this gets said, but Kirks Cousins arm strength was never a knock against him. Scouts and draft pundits said he had plenty, just not a canon. That's different than saying a QB has a weak arm. So for me, Kirk Cousins is not an example.
Kelly the Dog Posted April 30, 2017 Posted April 30, 2017 And actually, I'm not sure why this gets said, but Kirks Cousins arm strength was never a knock against him. Scouts and draft pundits said he had plenty, just not a canon. That's different than saying a QB has a weak arm. So for me, Kirk Cousins is not an example. Funny you say that but for me, Cousins just barely has enough. The reason I don't think he can be elite is because he can't get the ball there quick or hard enough on some throws. I understand that it's believed he has enough. But that's kind of my point with Peterman. If you don't even have Kirk Cousins strength, which is thought to be strong enough, you can't succeed at a top level. That's my worry. And that's why he's thought of as a career backup.
YoloinOhio Posted April 30, 2017 Author Posted April 30, 2017 That's Brady's scouting report, not Peterman's. I think it was supposed to be a comparison? They do have pretty similar scouting reports. I saw a rumor on here that Yates will retire from football after training camp and immediately be hired as a QB coach in Buffalo, if I'm remembering correctly. He has connections to Dennison and ran his offense for several years, so it could be true. interesting on Yates if true. Our QB coach is a longtime NFL WR coach and could see Yates being his assistant.
Wayne Cubed Posted April 30, 2017 Posted April 30, 2017 (edited) Funny you say that but for me, Cousins just barely has enough. The reason I don't think he can be elite is because he can't get the ball there quick or hard enough on some throws. I understand that it's believed he has enough. But that's kind of my point with Peterman. If you don't even have Kirk Cousins strength, which is thought to be strong enough, you can't succeed at a top level. That's my worry. And that's why he's thought of as a career backup.That's kind of what I mean. Kirk Cousins, according to scouts and draft pundits, has enough arm strength. Nate Peterman, according to scouts and draft experts, does not have a strong arm. I just don't think you can compare the two and say, "Well hey look Kirk Cousins is doing ok". Edited April 30, 2017 by Wayne Cubed
starrymessenger Posted April 30, 2017 Posted April 30, 2017 Did not follow Peterman but wonder whether or how much of his tape (and the reactions to it) can be explained by the short game I gather was favoured by 'Cuse. Or maybe that was a reflection of perceived QB limitations?
HappyDays Posted April 30, 2017 Posted April 30, 2017 interesting on Yates if true. Our QB coach is a longtime NFL WR coach and could see Yates being his assistant. Normally I wouldn't trust rumors but rumors on here have a tendency to come true.
BuffAlone Posted April 30, 2017 Posted April 30, 2017 I knew this thread would pass the 1st round thread!
SoFFacet Posted April 30, 2017 Posted April 30, 2017 I knew this thread would pass the 1st round thread! QB hysteria out of control. For a healthy organization and un-traumatized fanbase, this would not be a significant pick. He's a developmental QB. If he pans out, great. If not, whatever. Any 5th rounder is a long-shot to make a difference.
mead107 Posted April 30, 2017 Posted April 30, 2017 Brady scouting report. Not a strong arm skinny http://www.ign.com/boards/threads/anyone-got-tom-bradys-pre-draft-scouting-report.77495994/
The Frankish Reich Posted April 30, 2017 Posted April 30, 2017 I think Kevin Hogan last year was in the same place as Peterman. And he had some moments last year, such that I haven't written him off yet as a potential starter.
Rochesterfan Posted April 30, 2017 Posted April 30, 2017 (edited) 1. Pennington is the only one to even be good since Montana. 2. Pennington only went so far and never really won anything. He wasn't a top ten QB. It depends because there are a ton of people on the list without numbers and guys like Brady came out and his know was his weak arm and he has done fine. What we know is that in the last 10 years - those QBs that we have numbers on and became successful were over 55. There are some successful QBs without numbers - so we do not know where exactly they fall. There is also a huge number of successful QBs that we do not have data on, but some that we suspect were successful and did not have high velocity arms and you mentioned 2. I will worry about this once we have a true cause and effect for velocity. I think it is one of many aspects that can make a QB successful, but I do not harbor at all the expectation that someone at 54 will not be successful strictly because of velocity. Edited April 30, 2017 by Rochesterfan
Bangarang Posted April 30, 2017 Posted April 30, 2017 (edited) Brady scouting report. Not a strong arm skinny http://www.ign.com/boards/threads/anyone-got-tom-bradys-pre-draft-scouting-report.77495994/ Most of the NFL passing game is short and intermediate stuff. Even the offense we're about to run with Dennison fits well with the things Peterman does well. I'm not worried about his arm. I'm glad we took a kid who is somewhat polished and has very good traits as opposed to someone who is tall with a big arm but has no idea how to play the position Edited April 30, 2017 by Bangarang
Rochesterfan Posted April 30, 2017 Posted April 30, 2017 They both had more than adequate arms. Gannon had a pretty good one. Easily far better than what I have seen from Peterman, who seems to be in the Colt McCoy, Kellen Moore category. Do you have their combine stats to prove that. The statement from others is that QBs increase their Arm strength in the NFL. Did they start out around Peterman and get a bit stronger. What was Brady's combine velocity - I can not find it, but his velocity was very bad early on in his career. There are a few examples, not many, of players whose arm strength noticeably increased over the years. Brady had decent arm strength (low end but just good enough) when he started. Over the years he got significantly stronger. Now he can gun it anywhere. Not a lot of examples of that. See above. He's one of very few. Not sure I can think of another. He went from barely enough to pretty strong. If Peterman is as strong as Brady I guess he has a chance. I haven't even seen that yet. What are your numbers that prove that. Coming out of the combine his arm strength and velocity I do not believe was any better than Peterman at all.
fansince88 Posted April 30, 2017 Posted April 30, 2017 (edited) I like him as the sleeper of the draft. I see him being our starter. This per Ryan Talbot: Nathan Peterman could be the pick of the draft in a few years, and that's another reason why this class is rated so high. I know there are questions about a guy with average arm strength going to a spot like Buffalo, where cold and wind comes into play. But arm strength can improve in the NFL. Just look at Tom Brady and Drew Brees. With Taylor taking a pay cut to stay, I wouldn't be surprised if Peterman is the starter in a year or two. Most of the NFL passing game is short and intermediate stuff. Even the offense we're about to run with Dennison fits well with the things Peterman does well. I'm not worried about his arm. I'm glad we took a kid who is somewhat polished and has very good traits as opposed to someone who is tall with a big arm but has no idea how to play the position Like the guy we took last year? I feel like he fits the bold above. Credit Mead for finding this one from 2005: http://www.ign.com/boards/threads/anyone-got-tom-bradys-pre-draft-scouting-report.77495994/ Edited April 30, 2017 by fansince88
BillsFan17 Posted April 30, 2017 Posted April 30, 2017 (edited) This is amazing. All this over a 5th round QB. Edited April 30, 2017 by BillsFan17
Saint Doug Posted April 30, 2017 Posted April 30, 2017 He hit a ton of wide open RBs/Slot WRs on basically RPOs where there were misreads by the defense. You know this is a Buffalo Bills message board, right? It would be a Bills fans' wet dream to have their QB hit a ton of wide open slot WRs.
jumbalaya Posted April 30, 2017 Posted April 30, 2017 Will Nathan Peterman = Frank Reich and Cardale Jones = Jim Kelly? Is that the thinking? TT just a one to two year stop gap? At the end of preseason, if Peterman shows promise & Cardale comes along ``we have to cut someone as few keep three let alone 4 QBs who gets cut first? Yates? Tyrod? Could be ugly.
KellyToughII Posted April 30, 2017 Posted April 30, 2017 Fans better start getting behind this kid, he will be starting for us sooner than later
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