GunnerBill Posted April 8, 2017 Posted April 8, 2017 (edited) Then you go to "Plan B", then "Plan C". Yes, there is that one player that you really want, but you have to have a back-up plan as well. You have to assess every player at every position that you need. Of course but what Jeff is saying, and he is right, is your plan C in 2018 (which might be the best you can get given draft position) might not be so different than taking your guy this year that is worth the year of waiting. Saying don't pick a Quarterback at #10 this year because Darnold might be can't miss next year makes no sense. If Darnold is can't miss he won't be a Bill. We will not finish last in the NFL. Edited April 8, 2017 by GunnerBill
Dragonborn10 Posted April 8, 2017 Posted April 8, 2017 You are very angry because the best talent is off the board. There is no QB worth a first round pick. That said I think two QBs will be taken and Watson probably lasts until the third round. As to the OP question, if Howard is there I would take him. If not I try to trade back anywhere from 3 to 15 spots. The further they go back the more I want them to pick up a second and a first next year. Maybe the Texans at 25 would be a good trade option. With any QB to choose from in this scenario, we give our #10 for their 25th, 57th, and first next year.
Dr. Who Posted April 8, 2017 Posted April 8, 2017 Zero chance Watson lasts until the third round. He will go in the first or early second.
rayray808 Posted April 8, 2017 Author Posted April 8, 2017 You are very angry because the best talent is off the board. There is no QB worth a first round pick. That said I think two QBs will be taken and Watson probably lasts until the third round. As to the OP question, if Howard is there I would take him. If not I try to trade back anywhere from 3 to 15 spots. The further they go back the more I want them to pick up a second and a first next year. Maybe the Texans at 25 would be a good trade option. With any QB to choose from in this scenario, we give our #10 for their 25th, 57th, and first next year. interesting thought: if we didnʻt blow those games agains the Jets/Dolphins and maybe even Seahawks we would have been drafting in the 20ʻs anyway so a trade down to that spot for a future first round pick isnʻt necessarily the end of the world if the QB you like is gone along with Howard/top WR on our board. having two first round picks in a draft is HUGE.
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted April 8, 2017 Posted April 8, 2017 interesting thought: if we didnʻt blow those games agains the Jets/Dolphins and maybe even Seahawks we would have been drafting in the 20ʻs anyway so a trade down to that spot for a future first round pick isnʻt necessarily the end of the world if the QB you like is gone along with Howard/top WR on our board. having two first round picks in a draft is HUGE. ...the chart gurus would have to do the math, but I think if you find a partner in the 20's, an extra 2018 1st is doable......maybe a 2nd or 3rd in 2017 as well.......I like building up the draft booty.....
BarleyNY Posted April 8, 2017 Posted April 8, 2017 The only reason why teams could trade up is because those QB's were not can't miss. You want can't miss? Then those teams will not let you have those picks. Sometimes teams talk themselves into believing in mirages. The Iggles look to have done this with Wentz.
jeffismagic Posted April 8, 2017 Posted April 8, 2017 Sometimes teams talk themselves into believing in mirages. The Iggles look to have done this with Wentz. Eagles gave up 2 1st rounders, a 2nd, a 3rd, and a 4th to draft their QB. I like Mahomes better than Wentz and we save a 1st, 2nd , 3rd, and 4th rounder!
John from Riverside Posted April 8, 2017 Posted April 8, 2017 Eagles gave up 2 1st rounders, a 2nd, a 3rd, and a 4th to draft their QB. I like Mahomes better than Wentz and we save a 1st, 2nd , 3rd, and 4th rounder! Wentz tailed off badly as the season went on......
jeffismagic Posted April 8, 2017 Posted April 8, 2017 Wentz tailed off badly as the season went on...... Still better than Tyrod.
Mark Vader Posted April 8, 2017 Posted April 8, 2017 Of course but what Jeff is saying, and he is right, is your plan C in 2018 (which might be the best you can get given draft position) might not be so different than taking your guy this year that is worth the year of waiting. Saying don't pick a Quarterback at #10 this year because Darnold might be can't miss next year makes no sense. If Darnold is can't miss he won't be a Bill. We will not finish last in the NFL. First of all, I did not single out Darnold. He could very well be the best QB in next year's draft, if he declares. However, there are a couple of other QB's in next year's draft that are also worthy of being taken in the first round that in my opinion are far better than the this years group of QB's. Which is my main point. The talent at QB in next years draft is greater than this year. I would be far more comfortable with Plan B, Plan C, Plan D, and Plan E at QB in next years draft than take a QB this year.
jeffismagic Posted April 9, 2017 Posted April 9, 2017 First of all, I did not single out Darnold. He could very well be the best QB in next year's draft, if he declares. However, there are a couple of other QB's in next year's draft that are also worthy of being taken in the first round that in my opinion are far better than the this years group of QB's. Which is my main point. The talent at QB in next years draft is greater than this year. I would be far more comfortable with Plan B, Plan C, Plan D, and Plan E at QB in next years draft than take a QB this year. Next year is my plan B. If Mahomes or Trubisky are there we can acquire them now and if they are busts we can fall back on our 2018 1st rounder. Which will be higher because we didn't spend another draft plugging holes in the roster. And that is crucial if we want a good player. 2004 was a better class than next year and we got ZERO out of it.
John from Riverside Posted April 9, 2017 Posted April 9, 2017 Still better than Tyrod. based on what? The individual qb numbers? passing yards? Most certainly was not total offensive production
Mark Vader Posted April 9, 2017 Posted April 9, 2017 Wentz tailed off badly as the season went on...... True. To be fair, Wentz was passing to WR's who were playing without any hands.
jeffismagic Posted April 9, 2017 Posted April 9, 2017 based on what? The individual qb numbers? passing yards? Most certainly was not total offensive production Based on no NFL team would rather have Tyrod than Carson Wentz.
mannc Posted April 9, 2017 Posted April 9, 2017 based on what? The individual qb numbers? passing yards? Most certainly was not total offensive production John, you're absolutely right, but wasting your time. If you look at the numbers, TT has better numbers than Jameis Winston the last two years, but it's ignored. They have about the same number of NFL starts, too. Based on no NFL team would rather have Tyrod than Carson Wentz. How do you know that?
BillsFan4 Posted April 9, 2017 Posted April 9, 2017 Still better than Tyrod. I think it's a bit early to be saying that. Does he have more potential/higher ceiling than Tyrod? Absolutely. But did he actually play better than Tyrod last season? Maybe the first few games. Based on no NFL team would rather have Tyrod than Carson Wentz. I bet if you asked NFL GM's if they'd rather have Tyrod and two 1st round picks + a 2nd, 3rd and 4th OR Wentz, there'd be a whole lot of GMs who would take Tyrod Taylor plus all hose draft picks... My opinion anyway.
jeffismagic Posted April 9, 2017 Posted April 9, 2017 I think it's a bit early to be saying that. Does he have more potential/higher ceiling than Tyrod? Absolutely. But did he actually play better than Tyrod last season? Maybe the first few games. I bet if you asked NFL GM's if they'd rather have Tyrod and two 1st round picks + a 2nd, 3rd and 4th OR Wentz, there'd be a whole lot of GMs who would take Tyrod Taylor plus all hose draft picks... My opinion anyway. That's not the right question. The Eagles investment is a sunk cost. How much could Wentz get? Minimum a 1st rounder? Tyrod? Maybe a 3rd or 4th rounder. I doubt even a 2nd.
BillsFan4 Posted April 9, 2017 Posted April 9, 2017 That's not the right question. The Eagles investment is a sunk cost. How much could Wentz get? Minimum a 1st rounder? Tyrod? Maybe a 3rd or 4th rounder. I doubt even a 2nd. IMO you absolutely have to factor in the cost it took to get Wentz. Eagles gave up two top 12 1st round draft picks, plus the 2nd, 3rd and 4th, plus the cost to move up in the 1st round last year with Miami. Wentz has a very long way to go to ever be worth everything given up to get him. I get what you're saying, but the cost to get Wentz is a very real factor.
jeffismagic Posted April 9, 2017 Posted April 9, 2017 (edited) IMO you absolutely have to factor in the cost it took to get Wentz. Eagles gave up two top 12 1st round draft picks, plus the 2nd, 3rd and 4th, plus the cost to move up in the 1st round last year with Miami. Wentz has a very long way to go to ever be worth everything given up to get him. I get what you're saying, but the cost to get Wentz is a very real factor. If I trade for Wentz today what the Eagles gave up is irrelevant. I pay what I want and don't care if they overpaid. Edited April 9, 2017 by jeffismagic
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