Bills want "success" before building new stadium

[cd1]

For the Bills to be more competitve in keeping up with $$$ the owners share every week.

 

We as fans go the watch an event (football game). It is a product that makes a handful of men wealthy.

 

After every game, each stadium forks over proceeds from ticket sales to a general pot and that money is shared by the team owners. I think club owner gets to keep suite $$$.

 

Buffalo's share of the pot is dwarfed by MANY of the other teams contributions. I am certain Terry is being pressured to find a way to make a LARGER contribution to the pot.

 

The above is a gross generalization. I am sure others will know the exact details.

 

I had the idea that Terry is holding off the other owners with the "we got to win first" notion. Afterall, we are doing great selling tickets to the perenial losers - but those same fans will not want to pay a lot more money for the same old - same old.

 

In a different thread someone remarked that is was such a shame that finally, the Raiders get a QB and start to win and the team moves away on them.

 

Imaging, the BILLS start WINNING. They start getting not just to the wildcard but more...

 

The team moves to a new stadium down the road... After nearly 20 years of waiting, who is going to walk away?

 

Just asking...

Edited March 28, 2017 by cd1

[Samwell Tarly]

maybe we should start a swear jar to help?

 

!@#$ you.

Put swear jars in the parking lot at New Era and the new stadium will be paid for in cash by week 8....

[Drunken Pygmy Goat]

@ESPNNFL

 

Dolphins owner Stephen Ross says teams should pay for stadiums, not ask for public money. http://es.pn/2osgfX6

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not saying I disagree with the idea, but Ross and the Dolphins were singing a different tune, just over a year before the renovations to Hard Rock were approved.

 

On Friday, Miami lawmakers ended a 60-day legislative session without coming to an agreement over funding renovations to the stadium, reports The Miami Herald. The move could put future Super Bowls at the Dolphins Sun Life Stadium in doubt.

 

Dolphins owner Stephen Ross subsequently released a harshly worded statement, condemning Florida house speaker Will Weatherford, accusing him of dishonesty. Weatherford had rejected the pleas of lawmakers to consider a last-minute-amended version of a bill to finance the planned improvements to the stadium.

 

He put politics before the people and the 4,000 jobs this project would have created for Miami Dade, and that is just wrong, Ross said.

 

The rejection of the bill had immediate implications for both the Dolphins and across Florida. A vote which would have been held on May 14 for Miami-Dade County voters to give the referendum a thumbs up or down has been scrapped, at a cost to the Dolphins, themselves. Ongoing renovations to the stadium have been immediately halted, and the team says it has no plans to invest its own money into the 26-year-old facility.

 

We cannot do this without a private-public partnership, said team CEO Mike Dee.

 

Ross and the Dolphins eventually struck a deal with the county that doesn't include public funding, but the stadium owners (Ross owns 95%) will receive grant money from the county for each marquee event that the stadium hosts during the length of the stadium agreement, up to $5 million per year. The Super Bowl (they'll host in 2020, IIRC) and World Cup Finals will earn them $4 mil, and NCAA Championship games will earn them $3 mil. Other tier 2-3 events will provide a bit less. So while the stadium renovations may have been privately funded, the owners will still recoup some of that money. They will essentially end up not footing the entire bill.

Edited March 29, 2017 by Drunken Pygmy Goat

[teef]

Put swear jars in the parking lot at New Era and the new stadium will be paid for in cash by week 8....

outstanding...

[Mr. WEO]

This state has never cared about eliminating waste. Regardless of your opinion, NYS Medicaid is the 2nd most expensive in the nation. I'm not debating the merits of any program vs another. The point is, in a state that is known for bloated government spending, it's laughable to say there is no way to find any money to put towards a stadium in Buffalo.

 

I was stating fact, not opinion. As a NYS resident who pays a lot of NYS tax, I'm all for eliminating waste in government. But it makes no sense to say you would gut Medicaid because it's a money waster...and then say you would then spend that money on an NFL stadium---which is the biggest waste of money possible.

 

i worked in a hospital for a period of time, and i personally saw the incredible waste of medicaid money. i'm not sure if it's any different than any other state, but my lord was it abused. we even had patients that would come up to ny for a period of time just to have work done under the ny medicaid coding. we offered far more than any other state did. it was literally free work.

 

on top of that, the only out of pocket expense was a $3 copay. if they said they didn't have it, they still had to be seen. mind you someone would tell us they didn't have the money, yet would be wearing nice clothing, jewelry, cigarettes and drove themselves to the appt. the abuse is rampant.

 

Every state has abuse of Medicaid. Medicare is at least as bad. Any provider who accepts Medicaid reimbursement is providing nearly free care--that's how it works. You don't want to provide "free work", you don't accept Medicaid. Pretty simple. NYS, like others, require a "spend down" of certain assets before Medicaid benefits kick in. Those assets do not include home, furnishings and a car.

 

Also, Obamacare succeeded in covering more Americans not by getting them more affordable private insurance, but instead by just putting millions more on Medicaid. Single payer (government) insurer models will always be ripe for abuse because of the massive amounts of money and the fact that they are state or federal bureaucracies.

Not saying I disagree with the idea, but Ross and the Dolphins were singing a different tune, just over a year before the renovations to Hard Rock were approved.

 

On Friday, Miami lawmakers ended a 60-day legislative session without coming to an agreement over funding renovations to the stadium, reports The Miami Herald. The move could put future Super Bowls at the Dolphins Sun Life Stadium in doubt.

 

Dolphins owner Stephen Ross subsequently released a harshly worded statement, condemning Florida house speaker Will Weatherford, accusing him of dishonesty. Weatherford had rejected the pleas of lawmakers to consider a last-minute-amended version of a bill to finance the planned improvements to the stadium.

 

He put politics before the people and the 4,000 jobs this project would have created for Miami Dade, and that is just wrong, Ross said.

 

The rejection of the bill had immediate implications for both the Dolphins and across Florida. A vote which would have been held on May 14 for Miami-Dade County voters to give the referendum a thumbs up or down has been scrapped, at a cost to the Dolphins, themselves. Ongoing renovations to the stadium have been immediately halted, and the team says it has no plans to invest its own money into the 26-year-old facility.

 

We cannot do this without a private-public partnership, said team CEO Mike Dee.

 

Ross and the Dolphins eventually struck a deal with the county that doesn't include public funding, but the stadium owners (Ross owns 95%) will receive grant money from the county for each marquee event that the stadium hosts during the length of the stadium agreement, up to $5 million per year. The Super Bowl (they'll host in 2020, IIRC) and World Cup Finals will earn them $4 mil, and NCAA Championship games will earn them $3 mil. Other tier 2-3 events will provide a bit less. So while the stadium renovations may have been privately funded, the owners will still recoup some of that money. They will essentially end up not footing the entire bill.

 

That is public money. Up to 75 million, which all Ross coughed up out of pocket himself.

[PromoTheRobot]

https://brushback.wordpress.com/2017/03/30/a-plan-needs-to-be-in-place-sooner-than-later-for-the-bills-and-the-city-of-buffalo/

[Roger Goodell]

The NFL and ownership group are committed to providing the fans in Buffalo with the best possible game day experience.

Edited March 30, 2017 by Roger Goodell

[Boatdrinks]

I was stating fact, not opinion. As a NYS resident who pays a lot of NYS tax, I'm all for eliminating waste in government. But it makes no sense to say you would gut Medicaid because it's a money waster...and then say you would then spend that money on an NFL stadium---which is the biggest waste of money possible..

It makes plenty of sense. Assuming NYS is not going to stop wasting money any time soon( the past being a great predictor) , then Id prefer to see the Medicaid waste put to a different ( better ) use. Like a new football stadium. A much more enjoyable waste of my money.

[WildBills]

What part of WNY and the fans cant afford a new stadium is still being missed? How many Bills fans can afford a PSL and odds are a 25% increase in tickets and parking?

 

What companies are going to pay more for suites?

 

A lot of people. I can't wait until a new stadium is built and the drunk idiots are priced out of the stadium. There is more than enough people with money to afford more expensive tickets. Don't be dumb all of your life.

[Klaista2k]

So in other words we won't be getting a new stadium?

[May Day 10]

I think we will have a good pile of details and plans revealed in 2020... stadium opens in 2024.

 

Hopefully the bills find "success" by then but im not holding my breath

Edited March 30, 2017 by May Day 10

[ALF]

I think we will have a good pile of details and plans revealed in 2020... stadium opens in 2024.

 

Hopefully the bills find "success" by then but im not holding my breath

 

If the Bills become really good under McD , that would put Terry in a good mood about a new stadium with that timeline.

 

If the Bill's record stays poor another remodel job

[DriveFor1Outta5]

It makes plenty of sense. Assuming NYS is not going to stop wasting money any time soon( the past being a great predictor) , then Id prefer to see the Medicaid waste put to a different ( better ) use. Like a new football stadium. A much more enjoyable waste of my money.

Medicaid and government waste have nothing to do with building football stadiums. All governments and states waste tons of money. NY is a leader in wasteful. Although in a state now devoid of industry it creates millions of jobs. That's another conversation, and one that too many people don't understand. I laugh when I hear health care workers complain about Medicaid waste, or welfare workers complain about welfare. Half of these people wouldn't have careers if the government wasn't throwing money around. I will digress no longer though, and get to the point. No one wants to donate money to billionaires to build something that is completing unnecessary. It's as simple as that. Why doesn't the government write me a check to build a house? It's no different, and in fact are homes are more important than unnecessary new football stadiums. Edited March 30, 2017 by DriveFor1Outta5

[teef]

 

 

 

 

Every state has abuse of Medicaid. Medicare is at least as bad. Any provider who accepts Medicaid reimbursement is providing nearly free care--that's how it works. You don't want to provide "free work", you don't accept Medicaid. Pretty simple. NYS, like others, require a "spend down" of certain assets before Medicaid benefits kick in. Those assets do not include home, furnishings and a car.

 

Also, Obamacare succeeded in covering more Americans not by getting them more affordable private insurance, but instead by just putting millions more on Medicaid. Single payer (government) insurer models will always be ripe for abuse because of the massive amounts of money and the fact that they are state or federal bureaucracies.

 

i don't quite get the bolded. why should a clinician expect to provide "free care" if they accept medicaid? i personally don't accept medicaid because it's a complete train wreck. the reimbursement is low and the turn around for payment is awful. the patients get the free care so there's little value tied to an appointment. most of the time offices have to triple book appointments because people just don't show up.

 

those that have private practices that accept medicaid bill out per procedure which factors into yearly production. in no way is it "free work". it may be free to the patient, but hospitals and offices expect payment. (i may have misunderstood what you said, so i apologize if i did).

 

i'm sure abuse of it happens in every state, but ny seems to by more off the norm than other states. on top of that, services offered in ny are so above and beyond what should be offered it's not funny. it's a joke that someone can get work done on that level for "free" when it's pretty evident that they can afford at least a co-pay.

Edited March 30, 2017 by teef

[teef]

Medicaid and government waste have nothing to do with building football stadiums. All governments and states waste tons of money. NY is a leader in wasteful. Although in a state now devoid of industry it creates millions of jobs. That's another conversation, and one that too many people don't understand. I laugh when I hear health care workers complain about Medicaid waste, or welfare workers complain about welfare. Half of these people wouldn't have careers if the government wasn't throwing money around. I will digress no longer though, and get to the point. No one wants to donate money to billionaires to build something that is completing unnecessary. It's as simple as that. Why doesn't the government write me a check to build a house? It's no different, and in fact are homes are more important than unnecessary new football stadiums.

that's not true at all. the only way people would be out of a job is if the need for treatment suddenly disappeared. that will never happen. the thing that would change is the way the work is funded.

[Drunken Pygmy Goat]

That is public money. Up to 75 million, which all Ross coughed up out of pocket himself.

I suppose that's correct, in a way, but the scenario isn't quite the same as the traditional public funding methods. It's backwards, but being in Miami, it's much more feasible than it would be in Buffalo.

 

In mamy cases of public funding, local municipalities will enforce things like hotel, car rental, and restaurant tax increases in order to pay off loaned money. In the case of Ross and the Dolphins, they paid upfront, and will be repaid a portion of the total. The money they will receive will be directly effected by the owners' efforts to secure marquee sporting events to the stadium. Those events will generate significant revenue for Dade county. This deal was a win for both sides. Instead of caving, the county stood their ground and didn't give in to the demands of the Dolphins, that would have required tax money from a current pool to be used to finance the renovation, for a team that was already over $200 mil in debt. The Dolphins avoided paying off bond money with interest. Instead, the "help" they will receive will be generated from money spent by visitors to the area, in town for marquee events, rather than increasing taxes to restaurants, affecting locals, (hotel and car rental taxes affect out-of-towners mostly), and not taking money that should be used in other, more important areas.

 

Basically, the stadium owners need to secure events that create economic boon to the area, in order to receive their "help" with money. It's a great method, that doesn't have any major effect on local residents. PBME (performance-based marquee events) grants will only be paid off by the county's portion of the Convention Development Tax funds. Those events will more than cover for those grants to be paid off.

Edited March 30, 2017 by Drunken Pygmy Goat

[DriveFor1Outta5]

that's not true at all. the only way people would be out of a job is if the need for treatment suddenly disappeared. that will never happen. the thing that would change is the way the work is funded.

I don't want to comment too much to derail this into a political discussion. As hated as social programs are they benefit the economy. This is why they exist. They don't exist because liberals are kind hearted ,and it's why conservatives have never eliminated them either. New football stadiums do little to benefit the economy. You're telling me you'll enjoy a game more at a new stadium?

[teef]

I don't want to comment too much to derail this into a political discussion. As hated as social programs are they benefit the economy. This is why they exist. They don't exist because liberals are kind hearted ,and it's why conservatives have never eliminated them either. New football stadiums do little to benefit the economy. You're telling me you'll enjoy a game more at a new stadium?

agreed. sorry to the op for doing so. i agree about the stadium too. on a personal level, i really don't "need" it as a fan. would it be nice? sure, but if it's to the point where it strains the economy, why bother?

[BadLandsMeanie]

The problem in my view is that we as a people are unable to find a way to make a stadium pay for itself. It is an inherently money losing proposition. And we allow the football business to inform us of their requirements for a stadium and to insist that we meet them.

 

 

If I may say so, that in itself isn't a that big of a problem. The bigger problem is that we as a people are not paying attention to the finances of our nation and government and are gouged in a multitude of gigantic ways just because we don't pay attention, trust that somebody will do it for us, and don't do arithmetic on the numbers that are a matter of public record.

 

Anyway, here's a stadium arithmetic example.

 

1 Billion dollar stadium seating 60,000 fans

 

 

1,000,000,000 divided by 60,000 = $16, 666.00 per seat. This seems expensive for a seat and 1 - sixty-thousandth of the cost of a football field.

 

 

Say each seat averages $200 per ticket per game. If we put every penny of the ticket price towards paying for the seat, how long to pay for it?

 

$16,666 divided by $200 = 83 games. At 10 games per year it would take 8.3 years to pay for the seat, not counting maintenance costs. By which time they might be calling for updates and renovations.

 

I wonder why a stadium costs so much money? And I think there just is no sensible way to pay for it, because there is no way to get all that money back out of it.

Edited March 30, 2017 by BadLandsMeanie

[Beast]

Well, I guess New Era Field will look like the Roman Coleseum before the Bills get a new stadium.