offsides#76FredSmerlas Posted March 20, 2017 Posted March 20, 2017 Whaley and Nix didn't whiff. They had to take a QB. They all sucked. If they didn't take a shot on one of them that year the fans would of went nuts. Most QBs that get drafted even in the first round are busts. Do you hear all the fans even this year saying we need to draft a QB, but as soon as they do and it doesn't work out, they all scream for Whaley's head. Getting a QB worth a crap is like shooting darts blind folded. Most GM's get it wrong.
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted March 20, 2017 Posted March 20, 2017 Whaley and Nix didn't whiff. They had to take a QB. They all sucked. If they didn't take a shot on one of them that year the fans would of went nuts. Most QBs that get drafted even in the first round are busts. Do you hear all the fans even this year saying we need to draft a QB, but as soon as they do and it doesn't work out, they all scream for Whaley's head. Getting a QB worth a crap is like shooting darts blind folded. Most GM's get it wrong. ...pretty much IT in a nutshell...........look at the 1st round QB Landscape over the last decade....other than Luck, Rodgers, Alex Smith and possibly Inconsistent Cam (if you want, throw in Flacco at #21 but...), the rest never would have been UDFA's yesteryear.....Ponder?...Gabbert?....Brady Quinn waiting in the Green Room?.....waffling about taking Jimmy Pickle or Bradley?....even Sancheese with 11 collegiate starts going at #5........
Rico Posted March 20, 2017 Posted March 20, 2017 Whaley and Nix didn't whiff. They had to take a QB. They all sucked. If they didn't take a shot on one of them that year the fans would of went nuts. Most QBs that get drafted even in the first round are busts. Do you hear all the fans even this year saying we need to draft a QB, but as soon as they do and it doesn't work out, they all scream for Whaley's head. Getting a QB worth a crap is like shooting darts blind folded. Most GM's get it wrong. Good GMs acknowledge their mistakes, cut their losses in a timely manner, and move on. Only a chump would' keep EJ on the team after London, let alone finish the 4th year of his contract.
offsides#76FredSmerlas Posted March 20, 2017 Posted March 20, 2017 (edited) He played through his rookie contract. You have an issue with that? We paid nothing for him and gave him his rookie contract worth of time to get better. It didn't happen and they released him. I hope they do the same with Cardale. That's just being smart with your draft pick and your money situation. Edited March 20, 2017 by offsides#76FredSmerlas
Billy Zabka Posted March 20, 2017 Posted March 20, 2017 Whaley and Nix didn't whiff. They had to take a QB. They all sucked. If they didn't take a shot on one of them that year the fans would of went nuts. Most QBs that get drafted even in the first round are busts. Do you hear all the fans even this year saying we need to draft a QB, but as soon as they do and it doesn't work out, they all scream for Whaley's head. Getting a QB worth a crap is like shooting darts blind folded. Most GM's get it wrong. Nix and Whaley did whiff on Manuel, there is no disputing this. Lots of teams do whiff on QB's though, but Whaley compounded the mistake by being unable to admit his mistake early enough, doubling down on EJ with the Watkins trade, and trying to shove EJ down the throat of two seperate coaching staffs that didn't want him. I didn't want any of the QB's from that draft early on and many other fans didn't either. If Nix/Whaley just came out and said that there were no QB's in this draft worthy of a high selection and that they would still be looking for that future franchise QB through free agency, trade, and next year's draft, I think the fans would have been fine with it. Saying the fans forced them into this is a ridiculous excuse in a post full of them.
jrober38 Posted March 20, 2017 Posted March 20, 2017 Whaley and Nix didn't whiff. They had to take a QB. They all sucked. If they didn't take a shot on one of them that year the fans would of went nuts. Most QBs that get drafted even in the first round are busts. Do you hear all the fans even this year saying we need to draft a QB, but as soon as they do and it doesn't work out, they all scream for Whaley's head. Getting a QB worth a crap is like shooting darts blind folded. Most GM's get it wrong. They didn't have to take a QB. If was their choice to cut Fitzpatrick and leave us with a roster without any NFL calibre QBs.
Rico Posted March 20, 2017 Posted March 20, 2017 He played through his rookie contract. You have an issue with that? We paid nothing for him and gave him his rookie contract worth of time to get better. It didn't happen and they released him. I hope they do the same with Cardale. That's just being smart with your draft pick and your money situation. There's nothing smart at all about keeping such a garbage QB on the team as backup, especially when considering TT's style of play (ie. possibility of season-ending injury). Belichick would've cut him the bye week after London. Burning a 1st-round pick on a MAJOR project QB was not very smart for a team going 10+ years without the playoffs; absolutely ZERO sense of urgency at all. Other than that though, picking him wasn't nearly as big of a problem as shoving him down 2 coaching staff's throats after it was pretty clear they wanted nothing to do with him. Nix and Whaley did whiff on Manuel, there is no disputing this. Lots of teams do whiff on QB's though, but Whaley compounded the mistake by being unable to admit his mistake early enough, doubling down on EJ with the Watkins trade, and trying to shove EJ down the throat of two seperate coaching staffs that didn't want him. I didn't want any of the QB's from that draft early on and many other fans didn't either. If Nix/Whaley just came out and said that there were no QB's in this draft worthy of a high selection and that they would still be looking for that future franchise QB through free agency, trade, and next year's draft, I think the fans would have been fine with it. Saying the fans forced them into this is a ridiculous excuse in a post full of them. Exactly.
offsides#76FredSmerlas Posted March 21, 2017 Posted March 21, 2017 Nix and Whaley did whiff on Manuel, there is no disputing this. Lots of teams do whiff on QB's though, but Whaley compounded the mistake by being unable to admit his mistake early enough, doubling down on EJ with the Watkins trade, and trying to shove EJ down the throat of two seperate coaching staffs that didn't want him. I didn't want any of the QB's from that draft early on and many other fans didn't either. If Nix/Whaley just came out and said that there were no QB's in this draft worthy of a high selection and that they would still be looking for that future franchise QB through free agency, trade, and next year's draft, I think the fans would have been fine with it. Saying the fans forced them into this is a ridiculous excuse in a post full of them. I said the fans would have went nuts. I didn't say the fans forced their decisions, that would he rediculous.
YoloinOhio Posted March 21, 2017 Posted March 21, 2017 @johnkryk On #Raiders conf call I asked @EJManuel3 about being benched by #Bills in Year2. "I had to humble myself ... and just keep fighting." ... "I'm just like wow. Sometimes young guys continue to get a chance to grow & fight thru those growing pains. I just wasn't afforded that opportunity" "I knew i was the starter & I was assuming like, 'Hey, this is my team' ... and obviously the chair kind of got pulled up behind me."
Steve Billieve Posted March 21, 2017 Posted March 21, 2017 There's nothing smart at all about keeping such a garbage QB on the team as backup, especially when considering TT's style of play (ie. possibility of season-ending injury). Belichick would've cut him the bye week after London. Burning a 1st-round pick on a MAJOR project QB was not very smart for a team going 10+ years without the playoffs; absolutely ZERO sense of urgency at all. Other than that though, picking him wasn't nearly as big of a problem as shoving him down 2 coaching staff's throats after it was pretty clear they wanted nothing to do with him. Exactly. Wasn't his contract completely guaranteed? Why would you cut him then?
Rico Posted March 21, 2017 Posted March 21, 2017 Wasn't his contract completely guaranteed? Why would you cut him then? To get him OFF the team.
bills7834 Posted March 21, 2017 Posted March 21, 2017 Good luck to him. Hope he does well. Good luck to him. Hope he does well. You can say that again.You can say that again.
offsides#76FredSmerlas Posted March 21, 2017 Posted March 21, 2017 There's nothing smart at all about keeping such a garbage QB on the team as backup, especially when considering TT's style of play (ie. possibility of season-ending injury). Belichick would've cut him the bye week after London. Burning a 1st-round pick on a MAJOR project QB was not very smart for a team going 10+ years without the playoffs; absolutely ZERO sense of urgency at all. Other than that though, picking him wasn't nearly as big of a problem as shoving him down 2 coaching staff's throats after it was pretty clear they wanted nothing to do with him. Exactly. It was pretty clear the coaching staffs didn't want EJ, hmmmm because the media talks like they know so much. We know that's a bunch of crap. We get fed more lies than truths. They speculate and make things up half the time. Rex went overboard about how much he liked EJ.
Gugny Posted March 21, 2017 Posted March 21, 2017 You can say that again. You can say that again. I'm gonna get the papers, get the papers. Good GMs acknowledge their mistakes, cut their losses in a timely manner, and move on. Only a chump would' keep EJ on the team after London, let alone finish the 4th year of his contract. Would only a chump keep Sam Watson after London? At least EJ didn't quit on the team.
BillsFan4 Posted March 21, 2017 Posted March 21, 2017 it's hard staying out of the EJ argument but sometimes it's needed. I'll go back to one comment that said EJ crumbles under pressure yet the Jags game you mentioned was proof that the posters comments were completely off base. As to the last game of the season who knows why it was such a bad game. Did EJ suck, did the play calling suck or did the team just not care? If EJ sucks for losing the Jags game. What does that say about Taylor and the offenses output against that same bad team? EJ was horrible. All you had to do was watch the game to see that... lol. I don't even see how it's up for discussion. Anthony Lynn basically even said after the game that EJ sucked. He said he didn't expect him to play so bad and didn't have any choice but to pull him (or something like that).
BillsFan4 Posted March 21, 2017 Posted March 21, 2017 Whaley and Nix didn't whiff. They had to take a QB. They all sucked. If they didn't take a shot on one of them that year the fans would of went nuts. Most QBs that get drafted even in the first round are busts. Do you hear all the fans even this year saying we need to draft a QB, but as soon as they do and it doesn't work out, they all scream for Whaley's head. Getting a QB worth a crap is like shooting darts blind folded. Most GM's get it wrong. There's groups of Bills fans that scream for a 1st round QB every year. It's never forced the Bills to draft a 1st round QB in other years... The Bills didn't have to draft a 1st round QB that year. The fans would still have come to games. They don't run the team, and if a GM is doing things because the fans would get mad if he didn't, that guy should not be a GM. Thats a horrible way to run an NFL team. It had nothing to do with the fans. The Bills backed themselves into a corner by ignoring the position for years and then cemented their need for a QB when they released Fitz before they had anyone to replace him with. I remember things differently when it comes to the fans and the 2013 draft though... I absolutely did not want any one of the 2013 QBs in the 1st round, or at all for that matter. At the time I said I'd be ok with taking a chance on one in a later round, but that's about it. Pretty much every Bills fan friend of mine I talked to IRL said the same thing, citing how weak the draft was considered. Also, just about every scout/GM/exec & well respected NFL analyst I read/seen quoted said that they didn't really see any franchise QBs in the 2013 draft. The only person I remember saying anything different was a Buddy Nix, who said "I don't agree with everyone saying that there is no franchise QBs in this draft. We see 3 or 4 potential franchise guys". I honestly think that Buddy Nix decided he was taking a 1st round QB before he even did any in depth scouting on that QB class, and then just convinced himself that there were franchise QBs available because he wanted there to be so badly.
GunnerBill Posted March 21, 2017 Posted March 21, 2017 They wanted in 2013 to be starting over.... that is why they cut Fitz and tied themselves into a Quarterback early. I had no issue with the EJ pick. It was a weak class and he was a reach but they needed to do something at the position. The real fault was not picking EJ or cutting Fitz it was failing to address the position in the 2011 and 2012 drafts which have produced a number of NFL starting Quarterbacks who didn't even require a 1st round pick.... Wilson, Dalton, Cousins.... I will never hammer them for swinging and missing even if they didn't pick the ideal year to do it. I will hammer them for standing pat at the position when they had a starter that they knew wasn't the answer - whether that is Fitzpatrick in 2012 or Taylor in 2017.
Thurman#1 Posted March 21, 2017 Posted March 21, 2017 (edited) Good luck EJ, stayed a true professional and never shot your mouth off here. We'll never know if a rubber mat and idiot coach didn't ruin your stay. Yeah...we will. We saw what he could/couldn't do when given the opportunity. He was handed the reins in year 1, which I would not say was the plan. The thing is that he wasn't tasked with running a complex offence. He didn't have a great OL, but he made about 1/4 of the plays you need from a starting QB. He just wasn't good. No ... we won't. Different courses of action often produce different results. Manuel was a guy who needed time to develop. He didn't get any because of the rubber mat. Perhaps he could have done what needed doing with him, a lot of which is still just grooving his mechanics a lot better. He still has bad feet, and some of that could easily be that instead of time to groove good footwork and get it down to the level of muscle memory he was instead forced to stop worrying about that and worry more about the things that would better help his immediate game. I doubt he'll ever be a franchise guy. But same as with Tyrod, there's a chance. Manuel's chance is probably smaller than Tyrod's. But a bunch more guys have achieved turnarounds after four full years than after six. As I say, I doubt it, but there's little doubt that he was hurt when he had to replace Kolb. Whaley and Nix didn't whiff. They had to take a QB. They all sucked. If they didn't take a shot on one of them that year the fans would of went nuts. Most QBs that get drafted even in the first round are busts. Do you hear all the fans even this year saying we need to draft a QB, but as soon as they do and it doesn't work out, they all scream for Whaley's head. Getting a QB worth a crap is like shooting darts blind folded. Most GM's get it wrong. They whiffed. A GM doing something because he's worried the fans might go nuts ... is a bad GM. They probably shouldn't have picked Manuel, but having done so, they should have had someone less brittle than Kolb to back him up, or even brought in a 3rd-stringer they wouldn't have minded seeing the field for a while. And yeah, a lot of GMs get QBs wrong ... which is also called whiffing. Edited March 21, 2017 by Thurman#1
Mr. WEO Posted March 21, 2017 Posted March 21, 2017 There was little chance that Kolb would have been the starter in EJ's rookie year. He was drafted to be the starter.
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