thebandit27 Posted March 18, 2017 Posted March 18, 2017 When it's brought up he is given credit for rushing yards. It's the CoT that says passing yards or lack thereof are irrelevant, but his rushing yards, well, they really matter and significantly add to the rushing attack. Can't have it both ways dude! TT lack of passing yards matters and matters a lot. His lack of passing yards is more significant to this team than his addition of rush yards. IMO, of course. Serious question: can you show me a single post where someone says that passing yards don't matter at all? I've seen many that say that they'd like the passing yards to be more substantial, but that they're okay as long as the team keeps scoring like a top-10 offense.
Foxx Posted March 18, 2017 Posted March 18, 2017 I believe I remember him repeatedly saying that TT would not be back on the original contract and that if they cut the contract he would be back. Look Crusher and you are on two opposite ends of a line with the truth planted firmly in between. TT does some good things and many things that he needs to improve. Those things that you and Thurm argue over and over about are prime examples - they are things that the GM, both former HCs and both former OC's said he needed to improve on and he did not. Now those things matter very little because we have a new staff and a new game plan. What do I expect - I think there are going to be plays where they roll TT out and he makes some plays, but there are also going to be way to many times that he struggles in the pocket. What I love about the deal is they have created a new lower priced 1 year deal and the ability if TT either improves or his athletic ability is good enough to push the offense they can bring him back for year 2 and work on a new contract. The fact that the contract automatically voids after year 2 means that no matter what this is a 1-2 year plan with the Bills looking to draft or develop for the future. Look I expected TT to be back and I am not surprised, but I am so glad they got the deal reduced significantly. He is an amazing athlete, but he is not a very good QB. What draws me to that conclusion is what happened after they eliminated Roman - Lynn came on the local radio stations and talked about how he was going to work week after week with TT and find and call plays that TT was comfortable with and what we saw was a change back to a huge percentage of sideline out patterns and comeback/stop routes with little Yards after Catch. Throws that a QB can make because he can see the WR is wide open. Roman was trying to grow and develop TT - you saw at at the end of 2015 with the patterns and throws after the Bills were eliminated. He was trying to open the offense up and in 2016 the offense did not function against Baltimore and although it produced against NYJ - it was enough that Rex moved on. The route tree and the throws were simplified and TT had some good games and some bad games, but nothing that screams long term starter. thank you for this, RF. no way to add to your rep unfortunately.
CardinalScotts Posted March 18, 2017 Posted March 18, 2017 are you the board troll? I only ask because I've followed some of your posts and they fit well in that category. don't mean to step on toes or anything, just calling it as I see it. good contract from the bills side for sure and TT can be rewarded more with better play this season, which I believe he does have a better year than 2016? yes he's unhappy with his life, which screams you know what. I wish him luck in finding that someone special
Maury Ballstein Posted March 18, 2017 Posted March 18, 2017 yes he's unhappy with his life, which screams you know what. I wish him luck in finding that someone special Are you a psychologist too ? Is this how the old guys trashtalk ? I find someone special in Costa Rica for 50.00 4x a day. I didn't realize disliking a bad qb carried over to my love life.
John from Riverside Posted March 18, 2017 Posted March 18, 2017 When it's brought up he is given credit for rushing yards. It's the CoT that says passing yards or lack thereof are irrelevant, but his rushing yards, well, they really matter and significantly add to the rushing attack. Can't have it both ways dude! TT lack of passing yards matters and matters a lot. His lack of passing yards is more significant to this team than his addition of rush yards. IMO, of course. Its not that the passing yards are irrelevent....it is just that it is one of the least important stats....... Now....if this team was passing a ton and NOT the 6th most scoring points in the NFL it WOULD be important because it would mean the offense was not efficient They are efficient at what they do.....what needs to improve is the timing of the points in big games
Rochesterfan Posted March 18, 2017 Posted March 18, 2017 Weird. Maybe we just see what we want to see because what I saw from Lynn was an inclusion of more of your standard shallow and deep crossing patterns over the middle, not less, and I saw Taylor execute those plays with greater efficiency than he did with Roman. Taylor's numbers "over the middle" (via PFF and ESPN) seem to indicate that as well. Oh I saw the comeback and sideline routes, too, but it's interesting that you think those increased rather than decreased with Lynn. If I remember correctly you were all over the work Roman was doing at the end of 2015. You must of made 7-8 posts before the start of last season talking exactly about the same stuff you had in this thread and the advancement TT made throughout the year and the way Roman was grooming him. I know you felt Lynn did a ton to help TT, but by the Pittsburgh game you were even ready to move on. It was not Lynn and play calling it was that TT was not good enough. Then you even went so far as to ask (in another TT thread you started) about what it would take in the last 4 games for people to get back on board. Once he lost in Pittsburgh and they were essentially eliminated - there should have been nothing that changes your opinion from ready to move on after Pittsburgh to the gushing you went to after Miami. It makes no sense to me that games against Cleveland and Miami would impact your decision so much after everything we have seen leading up to those 2 games. Look good for you - I am hoping having a real coaching staff and an actual OC that can call plays will make for an improvement, but I am not going so far as to look at anything TT has done in 2015 or 2016 and think it was good enough. He is the starting QB and the we will root for him all day and every day and I actually think with a new coaching staff the entire team has chance to improve and as to the things Taylor did that kept him around - those were not things done on the field - as other posters have pointed out - what kept TT in Buffalo for 2017 was a 10 million dollar pay cut and the ability to cut him after this year with a smaller cap hit and a void for years 3-5.
FireChan Posted March 18, 2017 Posted March 18, 2017 Its not that the passing yards are irrelevent....it is just that it is one of the least important stats....... Now....if this team was passing a ton and NOT the 6th most scoring points in the NFL it WOULD be important because it would mean the offense was not efficient They are efficient at what they do.....what needs to improve is the timing of the points in big games Rank the QB stats by importance.
Big Gun Posted March 18, 2017 Posted March 18, 2017 Serious question: can you show me a single post where someone says that passing yards don't matter at all? I've seen many that say that they'd like the passing yards to be more substantial, but that they're okay as long as the team keeps scoring like a top-10 offense. Serious response: don't be ignorant! You know damn well that subject has been discussed at nauseam all over this place!
John from Riverside Posted March 18, 2017 Posted March 18, 2017 Rank the QB stats by importance. 3rd down conversions ball security points scored yards passing Serious response: don't be ignorant! You know damn well that subject has been discussed at nauseam all over this place! It has.....the pro TT's are saying its the least important stat and the TT hater's harp on it like it is the most important stat but I dont remember anybody saying it was irellevent
Maury Ballstein Posted March 18, 2017 Posted March 18, 2017 I know you felt Lynn did a ton to help TT, but by the Pittsburgh game you were even ready to move on. It was not Lynn and play calling it was that TT was not good enough. Then you even went so far as to ask (in another TT thread you started) about what it would take in the last 4 games for people to get back on board. Once he lost in Pittsburgh and they were essentially eliminated - there should have been nothing that changes your opinion from ready to move on after Pittsburgh to the gushing you went to after Miami. It makes no sense to me that games against Cleveland and Miami would impact your decision so much after everything we have seen leading up to those 2 games. . Holy moly. I thought you were talking about one of our posters. Every word of this applies to him as well.
FireChan Posted March 18, 2017 Posted March 18, 2017 (edited) 3rd down conversions ball security points scored yards passing It has.....the pro TT's are saying its the least important stat and the TT hater's harp on it like it is the most important stat but I dont remember anybody saying it was irellevent Only one of those are QB stats. Unless you mean points that the QB scored. Tyrod Taylor was 19th in touchdowns. Edited March 18, 2017 by FireChan
thebandit27 Posted March 18, 2017 Posted March 18, 2017 Serious response: don't be ignorant! You know damn well that subject has been discussed at nauseam all over this place! That's not a serious response; that's a cop out (though admittedly it's a rather predictable one). Oh, and it might be prudent not to call someone else ignorant when you cannot manage to properly use the phrase "ad nauseum" Now if you don't mind, any type of reference to someone saying that passing yards don't matter would be appreciated.
John from Riverside Posted March 18, 2017 Posted March 18, 2017 Only one of those are QB stats. Unless you mean points that the QB scored. Tyrod Taylor was 19th in touchdowns. kinda lumping in points that the qb scored directly along with touchdowns thrown That is one of the things that makes Tyrod special......his running ability is the best in the league
FireChan Posted March 18, 2017 Posted March 18, 2017 (edited) That's not a serious response; that's a cop out (though admittedly it's a rather predictable one). Oh, and it might be prudent not to call someone else ignorant when you cannot manage to properly use the phrase "ad nauseum" Now if you don't mind, any type of reference to someone saying that passing yards don't matter would be appreciated. I hate doing someone's homework for them but.... http://forums.twobillsdrive.com/topic/189190-buffalo-bills-rank-32-in-passing-yards-per-game/?p=4082220 It wasn't even from a no-namer. Kirby, bandit is gonna be so mad at you. kinda lumping in points that the qb scored directly along with touchdowns thrown That is one of the things that makes Tyrod special......his running ability is the best in the league Right. The 19th number was TOTAL TD's. Running and passing. So still, a ways below average. Edited March 18, 2017 by FireChan
John from Riverside Posted March 18, 2017 Posted March 18, 2017 I hate doing someone's homework for them but.... http://forums.twobillsdrive.com/topic/189190-buffalo-bills-rank-32-in-passing-yards-per-game/?p=4082220 Im gonna say that ends up being a response to folks who place way too much on passing yards and is reactionary Obviously it is a QB stat....obviously it should not be overlooked.
34-78-83 Posted March 18, 2017 Posted March 18, 2017 (edited) there is no QB stat that exists on it's own without being affected by the team he is on, so that should always be in the back of peoples minds. However, the most important stats historically for NFL Qb's as contributors to a team are - YPA and TD to INT ratio. Edited March 18, 2017 by 34-78-83
transplantbillsfan Posted March 18, 2017 Author Posted March 18, 2017 If I remember correctly you were all over the work Roman was doing at the end of 2015. You must of made 7-8 posts before the start of last season talking exactly about the same stuff you had in this thread and the advancement TT made throughout the year and the way Roman was grooming him. I know you felt Lynn did a ton to help TT, but by the Pittsburgh game you were even ready to move on. It was not Lynn and play calling it was that TT was not good enough. Then you even went so far as to ask (in another TT thread you started) about what it would take in the last 4 games for people to get back on board. Once he lost in Pittsburgh and they were essentially eliminated - there should have been nothing that changes your opinion from ready to move on after Pittsburgh to the gushing you went to after Miami. It makes no sense to me that games against Cleveland and Miami would impact your decision so much after everything we have seen leading up to those 2 games. Look good for you - I am hoping having a real coaching staff and an actual OC that can call plays will make for an improvement, but I am not going so far as to look at anything TT has done in 2015 or 2016 and think it was good enough. He is the starting QB and the we will root for him all day and every day and I actually think with a new coaching staff the entire team has chance to improve and as to the things Taylor did that kept him around - those were not things done on the field - as other posters have pointed out - what kept TT in Buffalo for 2017 was a 10 million dollar pay cut and the ability to cut him after this year with a smaller cap hit and a void for years 3-5. Why does it have to be that you're either "gushing over" Taylor or you think he sucks? You've had your mind made up on Taylor for a long time and you and many of your ilk view any changes in perspective on him as a bad thing. I'm sorry, this is the real world, not politics. If I want to change my perspective after seeing Taylor play probably his best game on the football field in his last game from "I don't think Taylor's maybe an NFL starter, but not good enough" after what was a bad 4 game stretch to "I still don't think Taylor's our long term answer, but he can capably be our starter for the time being and has the opportunity to prove he's more, but I want Whaley & Co to draft a QB high," then I'm going to do it. You remain admirably steadfast, that's fine by me. But if you think just because I started a thread about positive areas on the field for Taylor in 2016 while stating directly in the beginning I don't think he's the long term answer and view him as a Bridge QB that I'm gushing over Taylor... then whatever...
Big Gun Posted March 19, 2017 Posted March 19, 2017 Why does it have to be that you're either "gushing over" Taylor or you think he sucks? You've had your mind made up on Taylor for a long time and you and many of your ilk view any changes in perspective on him as a bad thing. I'm sorry, this is the real world, not politics. If I want to change my perspective after seeing Taylor play probably his best game on the football field in his last game from "I don't think Taylor's maybe an NFL starter, but not good enough" after what was a bad 4 game stretch to "I still don't think Taylor's our long term answer, but he can capably be our starter for the time being and has the opportunity to prove he's more, but I want Whaley & Co to draft a QB high," then I'm going to do it. You remain admirably steadfast, that's fine by me. But if you think just because I started a thread about positive areas on the field for Taylor in 2016 while stating directly in the beginning I don't think he's the long term answer and view him as a Bridge QB that I'm gushing over Taylor... then whatever... So in your world one good game outweighs 4 or more bad ones. Whatever!
John from Riverside Posted March 19, 2017 Posted March 19, 2017 So in your world one good game outweighs 4 or more bad ones. Whatever! that brings into question what is actually considered a "bad game" There were very few "bad games'
thebandit27 Posted March 19, 2017 Posted March 19, 2017 I hate doing someone's homework for them but.... http://forums.twobillsdrive.com/topic/189190-buffalo-bills-rank-32-in-passing-yards-per-game/?p=4082220 It wasn't even from a no-namer. Kirby, bandit is gonna be so mad at you. Right. The 19th number was TOTAL TD's. Running and passing. So still, a ways below average. Thanks Kirby's response was well-couched though--he said that the passing game is leaving plays on the field and needs to improve. Far cry from what old school is saying
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