Tom Brady-The Greatest of His Era, Not All-Time

[Maury Ballstein]

Goat. Not era.

[Success]

if your going that route. Todays AFC championship game would be the same as the nfl championship game. Otto went to 10. Brady has been to 11.

 

Seriously? You post here too?

[Chicken Boo]

Montana is still the greatest to me. I may even venture to put Elway ahead of Tom Brady, but Tommy Boy is definitely in my top 3.

[Figster]

I realize the NFL has evolved over the years making it harder to make a fair determination.

 

What puts Brady a little higher in my mind is his ability to operate at such a high level with average for the most part players on the receiving end of Tom Bradys passes.

 

The guy makes everyone around him better and has continued to do so throughout his career.

 

My vote goes for Tom Brady as the greatest QB all time.

 

thanks OP

[Mr. WEO]

It's debatable for sure. But this board isn't going to have a fair discussion about Tom because we all hate him

 

If you are now stating that there are not rules in place dictating how and where you can hit a QB you are more delusional than usual.

 

 

The delusion is with guys like you who are under the impression that any rule has protected today's QB's from taking huge hits--or that any rule would prevent any player from tee-ing off on an unprotected QB.

 

The hits are as "brutal" as they were and they are being delivered by much stronger guys at every position on the defense, using defensive schemes that are harder to defend against than those of 30 years ago. Montana was tiny--6'2" and 200 lbs----and yet he was some sort of iron man who took hits todays bigger QBs can't or don't! That's a joke!

 

Your thinking, like the others making the same "you can't breath on the QB these days" argument, is weak thinking. Repeating the same clichés over and over.

[cd1]

The delusion is with guys like you who are under the impression that any rule has protected today's QB's from taking huge hits--or that any rule would prevent any player from tee-ing off on an unprotected QB.

 

The hits are as "brutal" as they were and they are being delivered by much stronger guys at every position on the defense, using defensive schemes that are harder to defend against than those of 30 years ago. Montana was tiny--6'2" and 200 lbs----and yet he was some sort of iron man who took hits todays bigger QBs can't or don't! That's a joke!

 

Your thinking, like the others making the same "you can't breath on the QB these days" argument, is weak thinking. Repeating the same clichés over and over.

Sorry, I understand your passion, but you are simply mistaken.

 

Do QBs today get hit? You betcha. Thing is years ago, tackler did not have to hold up or think to not hit to high or hit too low. QBs were hit just as hard as any other player on the team.

Just ask Joe Namath about his knees.

 

Another thing is the equipment players wore was no where near as sophisticated as they are equipted today.

 

You really can't compare the players between eras. (NO matter how adamant you are about it).

Edited March 14, 2017 by cd1

[bills_fan_in_raleigh]

i have been spouting this for years...i will never call Tom Brady the GOAT....those other QBs played in eras where you could rip their heads off and not get a flag...in todays NFL Brady tears his knee and all of a sudden the NFL changes the rules that you can't hit a QB below the knees...it's ridiculous...you can't even compare it to the old school guys...Bradshaw would walk off the field with a bloody face and keep playing...Brady plays in the "powder puff" era...He could win 10 more superbowls and I still wouldn't call him the GOAT...and anyone who does so does it without anyone knowledge of the history of the game.

agreed he plays in an era were WR can push off, pick and cant get hit, an era QBs are protected fro big hits and below waist etc.

[Augie]

Sorry, I understand your passion, but you are simply mistaken.

Do QBs today get hit? You betcha. Thing is years ago, tackler did not have to hold up or think to not hit to high or hit too low. QBs were hit just as hard as any other player on the team.[/b]

Just ask Joe Namath about his knees.

Another thing is the equipment players wore was no where near as sophisticated as they are equipted today.

You really can't compare the players between eras. (NO matter how adament you are about it).

It must take serious effort to deny the rule changes affecting QB's. The game has changed. They still do get hit, but it's not the same. The GAME is not the same either, so there will be no correct answer here other than: comparing different eras is pointless. There are stars of every era, I'll leave it at that.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

Ultimately I think it's just too hard to compare Montana/Brady. Totally different eras, you can make a reasonable case for either one of them.

 

I never get ceased to be amazed how Brady was just a forgotten 6th round pick though. If he didn't play under Belichick's regime would he have had this success? I mean back in the day the Browns fans all hated Belichick for cutting Kosar since his skills didn't fit his coaching.

...LOL....Bernie would drink to that..............

[mjd1001]

I go back and forth on this one. Greatest of all time for his team? I have to say yes.

 

Greatest in all aspects of the game? No.

 

Basically, if you were to Plug Tom Brady into each and every NFL team to 'try him out' in different situations, and then do the same with Peyton Manning...I think Manning would be more successful overall across the board.

 

Brady has won more though.

[Matt_In_NH]

 

 

But athletes take much better care of themselves now than they did years ago...these guys now have nutritionist etc...back in the 70's guys were probably smoking cigarettes and having beers in the locker room....today, they treat their bodies as their main investment...it's completely different...

 

Im comparing to the 90 not 70's or 80's. Sports science is always progressing but they had nutritionists and were very big strong and fast. There have been much larger changes in rules than there have been changes in nutrition. Other positions are not experiencing the same longer careers.

[CanadianFan]

His accomplishments are like steroid-era baseball numbers. Asterisked. #Spygate #deflategate #undiscoveredgate. Greatest of the cheatingest coach in history era.

[Mr. WEO]

Sorry, I understand your passion, but you are simply mistaken.

 

Do QBs today get hit? You betcha. Thing is years ago, tackler did not have to hold up or think to not hit to high or hit too low. QBs were hit just as hard as any other player on the team.

Just ask Joe Namath about his knees.

 

Another thing is the equipment players wore was no where near as sophisticated as they are equipted today.

 

You really can't compare the players between eras. (NO matter how adamant you are about it).

 

Ask Cam Newton about all of the "new rules" that "prevented" him from getting hit too high or too low last year alone.

 

Why would I have to ask Joe Namath about his knees? I can just ask Carr, who's leg was broken on a low tackle and ruined their playoffs. Or Tannehill, who tore his ACL on low hit. Those are just two examples from one month of this year alone. Or maybe we should give Tony Romo a call and ask him how soft the game has become.

 

Sophisticated? Joe wore knee pads, thigh pads, a rib pad wrap, giant shoulder pads, likely a cup and a helmet no worse at preventing concussions than the one that Brady wore. Today's QBs go out in yoga pants, tiny shoulder pads, maybe a flack rib device and their lid.

I go back and forth on this one. Greatest of all time for his team? I have to say yes.

 

Greatest in all aspects of the game? No.

 

Basically, if you were to Plug Tom Brady into each and every NFL team to 'try him out' in different situations, and then do the same with Peyton Manning...I think Manning would be more successful overall across the board.

 

Brady has won more though.

 

Look at Manning's playoff record on pretty good Colts teams his entire career there. Why would he do better on other teams without those HOF candidates?

 

Brady is essentially on a "new team" every 4 or 5 years the way his HC goes through rosters.

[cd1]

Ask Cam Newton about all of the "new rules" that "prevented" him from getting hit too high or too low last year alone.

 

Why would I have to ask Joe Namath about his knees? I can just ask Carr, who's leg was broken on a low tackle and ruined their playoffs. Or Tannehill, who tore his ACL on low hit. Those are just two examples from one month of this year alone. Or maybe we should give Tony Romo a call and ask him how soft the game has become.

 

Sophisticated? Joe wore knee pads, thigh pads, a rib pad wrap, giant shoulder pads, likely a cup and a helmet no worse at preventing concussions than the one that Brady wore. Today's QBs go out in yoga pants, tiny shoulder pads, maybe a flack rib device and their lid.

 

...

 

Like I said, You can't compare eras and just being more emphatic does not change anything.

[Success]

Brady is never out of a game.

 

Maybe we play him too much. But I never feel comfortable with any lead against him, and I always feel like he's going to score when he gets the ball.

 

No one else like that. I can't remember feeling that way watching Montana.

[mabden]

Agreed. TB cannot hold a candle to JM.

[Alphadawg7]

If Tom Brady were drafted in 1984, in a different era, where QB's weren't coddled, there is no way in hell that Brady would be in the shape, 16-17 years into his career that he is today. His body would have broken down at least some and he wouldn't be the player he is right now.

 

Joe Montana was 4-0 in Super Bowls and won 4 in 9 years. If he wasn't injured in the 1990 NFC Championship game against the 49ers, he probably would have been 5-0 with 5 in 10 years.

 

I know people were in a hurry to anoint Brady after the last Super Bowl, but if you take a step back and really look at the thing, there are QB's who have been just as impressive if not more with respect to their era. What would Dan Marino's career have looked like if he was drafted into the NFL in the year 2000?

 

Tom Brady is definitely one of the greatest QB's of all-time and the best of his era, but as far as I am concerned what Montana did in the era he played in was more impressive.

 

One thing you left out though is that Joe Montana played with one of the greatest collection of both defensive and offensive talents in history including the greatest WR in history, greatest S in history, and one of the greatest coaches in history. He played with elite players all over those rosters. Roger Craig was the Marshall Faulk of his time...Taylor, Clark, Waters, Jones, etc. Great OL too. Then you add the Haleys, Lott's, etc on the D and this roster was ELITE top to bottom and led by the one of the greatest football minds and coaches in history.

 

Brady has won 5 SB's with marginal or worse receivers and average RB's. The talent he's had to work with as weapons is a joke compared to what Montana had. Brady has done more with less than Montana had to work with. Brady won 3 SB's in 4 years with scrub weapons. Brady just won 2 SB's in last 3 years with marginal WR weapons again and is a massive favorite to win it again next year.

 

All things are not equal in the careers of Montana and Brady. And having watched the entire careers of both, I would give Brady the nod for GOAT. But, its honestly about as close as you can get and I wouldn't be upset at anyone who took Montana. I am just presenting my case of why I still see Brady as the GOAT over Montana.

[Guest K-GunJimKelly12]

I think some people missed the point of the post. Brady is an all-time great no doubt. One of the best ever. He would win Super Bowls in any era and can take a hit. Here is the thing, every time a defender let's up nowadays to avoid a 15 yard penalty, and it is often, 20+ years ago, the QB what getting absolutely drilled every time. Yes QB's take hits today but it is nothing like it used to be. There is just no way a Brady or any other QB could take the beating QB's used to take, and still played at the age of 39 like they did at 25. It just doesn't happen.

 

Therefore Brady would have had more injuries with more concussions included in that. His body would have broken down sooner and we wouldn't have had a 15 year prime that allowed him to get to 7 Super Bowls and win 5. Brady is clearly the greatest of his era, but his body would would be a lot more broken down at 39-40, if he had played 20-30 years ago.

[Alphadawg7]

I think some people missed the point of the post. Brady is an all-time great no doubt. One of the best ever. He would win Super Bowls in any era and can take a hit. Here is the thing, every time a defender let's up nowadays to avoid a 15 yard penalty, and it is often, 20+ years ago, the QB what getting absolutely drilled every time. Yes QB's take hits today but it is nothing like it used to be. There is just no way a Brady or any other QB could take the beating QB's used to take, and still played at the age of 39 like they did at 25. It just doesn't happen.

 

Therefore Brady would have had more injuries with more concussions included in that. His body would have broken down sooner and we wouldn't have had a 15 year prime that allowed him to get to 7 Super Bowls and win 5. Brady is clearly the greatest of his era, but his body would would be a lot more broken down at 39-40, if he had played 20-30 years ago.

 

I get what you are saying, its just unfortunately not accurate. QBs before Montana's ERA, during his ERA and even just a bit later than his ERA have played into their later 30's and into their 40's. Guys like Blanda, Moon, Marino, Testaverde, Farve all played during ERA's that took a beating for most their careers. You mention Marino, and he was 39 when he retired and still could have kept playing had he chose to but the Dolphins team was not very good and didn't have a lot of talent on it at that point of his career.

 

Brady is one of the best of all time, and probably the best ever, at using his feet to create time and separation in the pocket to avoid taking hits. His longevity is a function of how mobile he is in the pocket and much he works on his body. Its like Floyd Mayweather...the reason he has lasted so long is his uncanny ability to avoid taking damage and how hard he is too hit. Its very hard to get to Brady because he is so good at avoiding the pressure and getting rid of the ball quickly.

[CanadianFan]

 

One thing you left out though is that Joe Montana played with one of the greatest collection of both defensive and offensive talents in history including the greatest WR in history, greatest S in history, and one of the greatest coaches in history. He played with elite players all over those rosters. Roger Craig was the Marshall Faulk of his time...Taylor, Clark, Waters, Jones, etc. Great OL too. Then you add the Haleys, Lott's, etc on the D and this roster was ELITE top to bottom and led by the one of the greatest football minds and coaches in history.

 

Brady has won 5 SB's with marginal or worse receivers and average RB's. The talent he's had to work with as weapons is a joke compared to what Montana had. Brady has done more with less than Montana had to work with. Brady won 3 SB's in 4 years with scrub weapons. Brady just won 2 SB's in last 3 years with marginal WR weapons again and is a massive favorite to win it again next year.

 

All things are not equal in the careers of Montana and Brady. And having watched the entire careers of both, I would give Brady the nod for GOAT. But, its honestly about as close as you can get and I wouldn't be upset at anyone who took Montana. I am just presenting my case of why I still see Brady as the GOAT over Montana.

 

And you didn't account for all the cheating. I wonder if Walsh cheated and secretly taped opponents closed practices? If the league decides to burn the offending tapes instead of bringing that organization to justice?