fridge Posted March 7, 2017 Posted March 7, 2017 When your boss is going to fire you, he might have a problem with a former employee trying to override him because said former employee thinks you can be a pet project and be improved. If Lorenzo Alexander was just pure dumb luck and had nothing to do with evaluating talent then EJ Manuel was just a fluke or pure dumb bad luck. Bad analogy I know, but to chalk things like that up to "dumb luck" is dumb. Whaley has always shown a higher aptitude in evaluating LB/CB/DB talent. Wildly different situations. We picked up Lorenzo Alexander to be a ST specialist. Had he been just a ST beast, I'm not calling it dumb luck. Now...getting 10+ sacks filling in for an injury, that's dumb luck. Whaley did not scout him and intend to start him, and I assure you there was no expectation he would have a pro-bowl LB season. Again, I don't have a lot of issues with Whaley as a talent evaluator, I'm just not willing to let people add Lorax to his pro's list like it was some genius master plan. Also, I apologize for hijacking this thread.
eball Posted March 7, 2017 Posted March 7, 2017 Let me explain. In my line of work, there are always former employees that come back around from time to time to say hello. Some of them were there for years. When they give me advice or share their past job stories, I listen. It isn't threatening to my boss that they come around from time to time and it isn't threatening to me to listen to them. You still don't get it. That's ok, I'll give up now. Stories like these piss me off because they are lazy reporting, they mean less than nothing, and yet some of you carry them around as evidence of some sort of dysfunction. And don't call me a blind homer or pollyanna; I did more than any of you when I took the time to write and send a letter to the Pegulas in December and cancelled a 27 year run of season tickets.
WotAGuy Posted March 7, 2017 Posted March 7, 2017 Great question. In his career he's 64/68 fg wise from 30-39 Meanwhile in the last 2 seasons he missed 11 xps What the difference is to Dan between FG and XP I am not quite sure. It may be a mental thing because hes pretty good from that distance. Very interesting. I can see the mental stumbling block with this. You go out to kick a FG and 33 yds is a gimme. You go out to kick a XP that used to be a 19 yd automatic, and now it's 33 yds. Big difference in looking at that 33 yd XP.
Johnny Hammersticks Posted March 7, 2017 Posted March 7, 2017 I don't know - maybe Christie was seeing Carpenter struggle, and just wanted to offer some tips on how to kick good at the Ralph (New Era). Pass on some info on the swirling winds, direction, etc. What if Jim Kelly approached Losman / Edwards / Fitz / Orton / Tyrod, to pass on some advice (if they were receptive to it), and the GM told Kelly to get lost. How would that fly? Need to show a little respect for the accomplished alumni who want to help get the franchise back on track. ehhh....get your point, kinda, but Kelly would be different than Christie. Not even in the same league as Kelly/Thomas in terms of "accomplished alumni." When is the last time Steve Christie was seen at training camp or on the sidelines?
White Linen Posted March 7, 2017 Posted March 7, 2017 Hard to believe that Christie would have to go through the GM just to "talk shop" with Carpenter... I think this too. If you're reaching out to the GM - I have to think you're asking to take some kind of roll. I just can't see how a GM could approve that. Not that Christie couldn't be helpful or that reaching out wasn't appreciated but what do you say to the coach on staff? I mean does the coach listen in - does he wait to hear from Carp what was shared - what happens if there's even a small contradiction?
K-9 Posted March 7, 2017 Posted March 7, 2017 Whaley: Hey Carp. Steve Christie has offered to come in and give you tips on kicking in Buffalo. Carpenter: Who? Whaley: Steve Christie. Kicked for us when we went to Superbowls back in the day. Carpenter: You mean that wide right guy? Whaley: No. That was Scott Norwood. Carpenter: Who? Whaley: Never mind, Carp, never mind.
What a Tuel Posted March 7, 2017 Posted March 7, 2017 (edited) I think if a former Kicker wants to talk to the Current Kicker The GM should stay the f out of it and let the conversation happen if Carp wants it Where did I ever say Whaley should listen to former players on personnel moves. Whaley planned on cutting Carpenter. Christie never says when he tried to offer to help him, and argues part of his reasoning is that he knows how it feels to be cut and it is hard. Also I wish you guys would pay as close attention to words other people use as you do Whaley's wording. "For the record, I did offer to help him, but was told by the GM that he wouldn't be receptive to outsiders" Steve Christie Patrick Moran @PatMoranTweets 2h2 hours ago Steve Christie told me he didn't know who specifically considered him an "outsider" but reiterated he was "definitely turned away" by the GM Edited March 7, 2017 by What a Tuel
Dablitzkrieg Posted March 7, 2017 Posted March 7, 2017 This is more on Carpenter being too proud than on whaley
Wayne Cubed Posted March 7, 2017 Posted March 7, 2017 I think if a former Kicker wants to talk to the Current Kicker The GM should stay the f out of it and let the conversation happen if Carp wants it Where did I ever say Whaley should listen to former players on personnel moves. Where in any of what was said do you get or is it implied that Whaley got in the way? It could very well be possible that Whaley asked Carpenter and Carpenter said no thanks. Whaley relayed that message to Christie. You do know that Christie could have contacted Carpenter personally right? If Whaley said no, he could have still got in touch somehow with Carpenter. Whaley, that we know of, doesn't monitor players personnel phones. He didn't have to use the Bills to contact him if he wanted to help him so badly. If Christie thinks he can coach, then by all means he can type up his resume and start looking for jobs.
Dablitzkrieg Posted March 7, 2017 Posted March 7, 2017 I hope Steve comes to a home game and gets "Charles Oakley-ed" by a couple 300 pound security guards. They didn't want your help. Get over yourself and shut your yap. You shut your yap fool I'm only kidding fyi kind-of
Wayne Cubed Posted March 7, 2017 Posted March 7, 2017 ehhh....get your point, kinda, but Kelly would be different than Christie. Not even in the same league as Kelly/Thomas in terms of "accomplished alumni." When is the last time Steve Christie was seen at training camp or on the sidelines? Also Kelly/Thurman are there, at the games, being a presence. Even saying that, Jim has said multiple times he felt quarterback X was gonna take the Bills to the promised land. Doesn't mean he can coach or help any of these guys out.
Johnny Hammersticks Posted March 7, 2017 Posted March 7, 2017 You shut your yap fool I'm only kidding fyi kind-of Steve?
MAJBobby Posted March 7, 2017 Posted March 7, 2017 Where in any of what was said do you get or is it implied that Whaley got in the way? It could very well be possible that Whaley asked Carpenter and Carpenter said no thanks. Whaley relayed that message to Christie. You do know that Christie could have contacted Carpenter personally right? If Whaley said no, he could have still got in touch somehow with Carpenter. Whaley, that we know of, doesn't monitor players personnel phones. He didn't have to use the Bills to contact him if he wanted to help him so badly. If Christie thinks he can coach, then by all means he can type up his resume and start looking for jobs. Did I make claims. My statement at the beginning was Christie calls out FO - he did Bad look for Bills and Whaley - it is
Wayne Cubed Posted March 7, 2017 Posted March 7, 2017 Did I make claims. My statement at the beginning was Christie calls out FO - he did Bad look for Bills and Whaley - it is He didn't call out anyone. He said "HE didn't want outside help" that could be Whaley or Carp. You are assuming the he is Whaley. Could very well mean Carp didn't want outsider help.
What a Tuel Posted March 7, 2017 Posted March 7, 2017 (edited) Did I make claims. My statement at the beginning was Christie calls out FO - he did Bad look for Bills and Whaley - it is You guys would spin it either way. "Whaley cuts Carpenter despite Christie offering to perfect his kicking. Whaley says get lost Christie" "Whaley decides to keep the unpopular and inconsistent Carpenter, because a former Bills player Christie who kicked 15 years ago believes he can help him. #dysfunction #whaleyisgrasping" Edited March 7, 2017 by What a Tuel
Rocky Landing Posted March 7, 2017 Posted March 7, 2017 If my predecessor showed up to stage and offered to give me pointers on how to light our sets, I would tell him, in no uncertain terms, to GTFO.
MAJBobby Posted March 7, 2017 Posted March 7, 2017 He didn't call out anyone. He said "HE didn't want outside help" that could be Whaley or Carp. You are assuming the he is Whaley. Could very well mean Carp didn't want outsider help. Read his FB post and tell me that is not a call out of the FO. You guys would spin it either way. "Whaley cuts Carpenter despite Christie offering to perfect his kicking. Whaley says get lost Christie" "Whaley decides to keep the unpopular and inconsistent Carpenter, because a former Bills player Christie who kicked 15 years ago believes he can help him. #dysfunction #whaleyisgrasping" I forgot that the FO can do no wrong with you. Maybe you might want to look at my Whaley Posts and see where I am so fast to call him out.
DriveFor1Outta5 Posted March 7, 2017 Posted March 7, 2017 Did I make claims. My statement at the beginning was Christie calls out FO - he did Bad look for Bills and Whaley - it is Agree. It's simple as that. Whaley has done a few things that make him seem like a bit of a jerk. The fanboys will never admit that.
eball Posted March 7, 2017 Posted March 7, 2017 I think this too. If you're reaching out to the GM - I have to think you're asking to take some kind of roll. I just can't see how a GM could approve that. Not that Christie couldn't be helpful or that reaching out wasn't appreciated but what do you say to the coach on staff? I mean does the coach listen in - does he wait to hear from Carp what was shared - what happens if there's even a small contradiction? Kimmelweck? I mean, it is Buffalo.
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