ALF Posted March 3, 2017 Posted March 3, 2017 I still think McD and Whaley play it safe and keep Taylor as a bridge till Cardale or a drafted QB can outplay him. The best case would be a renegotiated incentive contract or a trade that made sense.
gjv001 Posted March 3, 2017 Posted March 3, 2017 Had the Draft had a bonified Franchise QB, and the Bills were certain to obtain that QB, Cosell's might have a point. But for now, Taylor is a moderately priced QB cabable of leading a top ten scoring offense with a banged up recieving corp. He gives us the best chance to win in 2017 and end the playoff drought.
mannc Posted March 3, 2017 Posted March 3, 2017 Winston is the truth. He's gonna be a top 10 QB in the next 2 years. So you think Winston will continue to improve, right? . Tyrod has fewer NFL starts than Winston does (and arguably better numbers). Why isn't it likely that Tyrod will continue to improve too?
bobobonators Posted March 3, 2017 Posted March 3, 2017 What does McDermott want. I could give a crap about Cosell. Cosell and most analysts have the luxury of talking about moving on from TT without providing a viable alternative. So you think Winston will continue to improve, right? . Tyrod has fewer NFL starts than Winston does (and arguably better numbers). Why isn't it likely that Tyrod will continue to improve too? Exactly
FireChan Posted March 3, 2017 Posted March 3, 2017 So you think Winston will continue to improve, right? . Tyrod has fewer NFL starts than Winston does (and arguably better numbers). Why isn't it likely that Tyrod will continue to improve too? Because WInston was the #1 overall pick, who is way younger, seen less NFL coaching, and already a better QB than Tyrod?
Thurman#1 Posted March 3, 2017 Author Posted March 3, 2017 (edited) But his word is not God - far from it !! Bill Polian stated there is nobody in the draft and nobody in free agency as good as Tyrod. ANYONE who claims a QB is good enough to make the playoffs but not good enough to win the Superbowl - get over yourself - that is such a thin line when factoring in so many of TEAM variables needed to win a superbowl - make the playoffs it becomes a tournament Did I say that his word was God? Didn't I in fact say that people can disagree? But no, that's not a thin line at all between good enough to make the playoffs and good enough to win the Super Bowl.. Extremely few QBs outside the top 10 to 12 ever win Super Bowls, and the exceptions were almost without exceptions paired with defenses that were not just good but historically spectacular. Make the playoffs and you are either for real or a fodder team. There are three or four fodder teams in the playoffs every year, and that's what we would be. As for Polian saying that there's nobody in FA or the draft as good as Tyrod, I don't know if Cosell would disagree. Beside the point, though. Cosell is saying that outside Buffalo there really isn't much disagreement about what Tyrod is, a QB who's fun to watch and a terrific runner but not a good passer. The specifics are at the link but that's the main idea. Edited March 3, 2017 by Thurman#1
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 3, 2017 Posted March 3, 2017 For folks not familiar with Greg Cosell: IMHO he is one of the pundits that is worth listening to. He knows his stuff and he isn't influenced by the fashion of the day. That said, his remarks have to be interpreted in the context of "freedom from accountability" enjoyed by all analysts. For example he rates this year's crop of QB here:http://www.latimes.com/sports/nfl/la-sp-nfl-combine-qb-prospects-20170302-story.html There isn't a one of them that he doesn't describe a flaw, possibly a deal-breaking flaw from the perspective of developing a long-term successful NFL QB. For calibration purposes, here is what he had to say pre-draft about EJM: http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000148931/article/ej-manuel-offers-both-concerns-positives-cosell-says
Thurman#1 Posted March 3, 2017 Author Posted March 3, 2017 (edited) What does McDermott want. I could give a crap about Cosell. Cosell and most analysts have the luxury of talking about moving on from TT without providing a viable alternative. Agreed, the analysts do indeed have the luxury of talking about moving on from TT without providing a viable alternative. And the Bills have the luxury of actually moving on without a bridge who if they pick up his contract would be paid like a top 10 or 12 guy. Two years is his most likely length of stay and if that's indeed how long he stays, he would cost the Bills $40.5 mill, $2.25 mill, the most expensive bridge QB in NFL history by a factor of about three. It's the first year for the new coach, we've got the luxury of a year or so a the very least to get things in place and get out of salary cap hell. If the best car in your town is a '97 Jetta priced like a '15 Porsche, you might be better served by going to the third or fourth-best car in your town, a car that's reasonably priced. If Tyrod is willing to make himself affordable, I'd be all for keeping him as a bridge guy. Edited March 3, 2017 by Thurman#1
jeffismagic Posted March 3, 2017 Posted March 3, 2017 Agreed, the analysts do indeed have the luxury of talking about moving on from TT without providing a viable alternative. And the Bills have the luxury of actually moving on without a bridge who if they pick up his contract would be paid like a top 10 or 12 guy. Two years is his most likely length of stay and if that's indeed how long he stays, he would cost the Bills $40.5 mill, $2.25 mill, the most expensive bridge QB in NFL history by a factor of about three. It's the first year for the new coach, we've got the luxury of a year or so a the very least to get things in place and get out of salary cap hell. If the best car in your town is a '97 Jetta priced like a '15 Porsche, you might be better served by going to the third or fourth-best car in your town, a car that's reasonably priced. If Tyrod is willing to make himself affordable, I'd be all for keeping him as a bridge guy. But you have to have a car in place before you can walk away from the 97 Jetta. There is no way you can do better!!!
Thurman#1 Posted March 3, 2017 Author Posted March 3, 2017 Had the Draft had a bonified Franchise QB, and the Bills were certain to obtain that QB, Cosell's might have a point. But for now, Taylor is a moderately priced QB cabable of leading a top ten scoring offense with a banged up recieving corp. He gives us the best chance to win in 2017 and end the playoff drought. First, it's simply not true that he's moderately priced. He's a bridge QB who if he stays for five years will have these five QBs as the closest to him in terms of average yearly salary: Tom Brady, Matt Ryan, Cam Newton, Phillip Rivers and Eli Manning. Those are the only five QBs who would be within a million dollars per year of Tyrod's two-year average. He's guaranteed $40.5 mill if he stays for two years, so that's $20.25 mill per year, and only those five QBs are within a million of that. And the reason our offense scored a lot was our run game. The pass game was below average. Our TDs last year looked like this: 3 defensive TDs, 17 passing TDs and 29 running TDs, in a league where not a single other team scored more running TDs than passing TDs.
mannc Posted March 3, 2017 Posted March 3, 2017 (edited) Because WInston was the #1 overall pick, who is way younger, seen less NFL coaching, and already a better QB than Tyrod?It's irrelevant to my point where he was drafted. And your statement that Jameis is already a better QB is not supported by any statistical evidence. It's also not clear how 4 years on the bench in Baltimore helped Tyrod develop as a QB. Jameis is younger, but Tyrod's far from old. Edited March 3, 2017 by mannc
cd1 Posted March 3, 2017 Posted March 3, 2017 (edited) If tanking was an exact science I'd advocate for it....but it's not so until you have something better lined up you keep Tyrod. But, But, But - Tanking IS good for a team - just look what it has done for Cleveland... :sarcasm: Edited March 3, 2017 by cd1
Thurman#1 Posted March 3, 2017 Author Posted March 3, 2017 Hard to argue with any of what Cosell says. If the Bills want to cut Taylor and tank for Darnold, go right ahead. I'm fully on board with that idea. Just don't cut him, tell me you still think you're close and then sign some journeyman QB who can win us 5 games this year under the premise management still thinks we're close. The Bills aren't close to the playoffs, and if they want to cut Taylor, and cut McCoy, and start rebuilding for the future, I have no problem with that. Cutting Taylor and signing some journeyman QB who can win us five games while saving us maybe $25 - $30 million bucks would make a lot more sense than keeping Tyrod, spending the extra $25 - $30 mill and winning seven or eight. Five games would have us drafting around third or fourth.
dogbyte Posted March 3, 2017 Posted March 3, 2017 All tt does is make you mediocre. If they pickup the option they will not select a QB with a high draft pick.
Thurman#1 Posted March 3, 2017 Author Posted March 3, 2017 But, But, But - Tanking IS good for a team - just look what it has done for Cleveland... :sarcasm: Put them in a pretty good spot to be good, maybe even really good, over the next couple of years..
cd1 Posted March 3, 2017 Posted March 3, 2017 Put them in a pretty good spot to be good, maybe even really good, over the next couple of years.. Jury is out on current situation. What about the LAST time Cleveland started over? (Hint 1999)
BillsFan2313 Posted March 3, 2017 Posted March 3, 2017 Because WInston was the #1 overall pick, who is way younger, seen less NFL coaching, and already a better QB than Tyrod? And can see over the middle
Marty McFly Posted March 3, 2017 Posted March 3, 2017 Don't mistake post count for "casual fan" ... I put out hard stats and you still want Cleveland's roster? I believe I'm landing on your stance on Tyrod .. my issue is the comparison to Cleveland. Plus .. granted they overhauled the GM position ... but Cleveland draft pedigree vs. Buffalo ... can you say Manziel .. can you say Pitt DB Justin Gilbert in top 10 .. Not a rex fan ... but I'll take an injured Shaq and Ragland over those bums. Trent Richardson / Brandon Weedon both 1st rounders in 2012. Please This is factual. Before the 2015/16 draft the Browns have been beyond terrible at drafting. It's irrelevant to my point where he was drafted. And your statement that Jameis is already a better QB is not supported by any statistical evidence. It's also not clear how 4 years on the bench in Baltimore helped Tyrod develop as a QB. Jameis is younger, but Tyrod's far from old. This. He can still improve. Just hope if they move on from Tyrod they have a good plan in place. I think we can keep Tyrod and still draft our franchise QB. Doesnt have to be one or the other. Especially if a team like the Bucs is paying its back up 7M a year. First, it's simply not true that he's moderately priced. He's a bridge QB who if he stays for five years will have these five QBs as the closest to him in terms of average yearly salary: Tom Brady, Matt Ryan, Cam Newton, Phillip Rivers and Eli Manning. Those are the only five QBs who would be within a million dollars per year of Tyrod's two-year average. He's guaranteed $40.5 mill if he stays for two years, so that's $20.25 mill per year, and only those five QBs are within a million of that. And the reason our offense scored a lot was our run game. The pass game was below average. Our TDs last year looked like this: 3 defensive TDs, 17 passing TDs and 29 running TDs, in a league where not a single other team scored more running TDs than passing TDs. Tyrod is responsible for a lot of that running success whether u wanna admit it or not. Matter fact I bet if we let go of Tyrod ur running #s go down next year.
FireChan Posted March 3, 2017 Posted March 3, 2017 It's irrelevant to my point where he was drafted. And your statement that Jameis is already a better QB is not supported by any statistical evidence. It's also not clear how 4 years on the bench in Baltimore helped Tyrod develop as a QB. Jameis is younger, but Tyrod's far from old. TT had 4 years of getting used to the NFL. It's an advantage. Where he was drafted matters quite a bit because one was good enough and showed enough in college to be worth the #1 pick. Jameis on tape is a much better QB. He makes some bad decisions, but he's decisive, he throws from the pocket regularly, steps into his throws etc. He's a much better QB. He's a worse wildcat Brad Smith type RB than Tyrod though, I'll give you that.
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