jeffismagic Posted April 4, 2017 Posted April 4, 2017 The "Good Morning Football" crew debates which team should draft Texas Tech QB Patrick Mahomes and should teams risk drafting him in the first round. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OpGNQq2oRzs
BuffaloHokie13 Posted April 4, 2017 Posted April 4, 2017 The "Good Morning Football" crew debates which team should draft Texas Tech QB Patrick Mahomes and should teams risk drafting him in the first round. Care to summarize? Can't do youtube at work.
jeffismagic Posted April 4, 2017 Posted April 4, 2017 Care to summarize? Can't do youtube at work. They discuss risk/reward with Mahomes. Should a team at #3 like the Bears take Mahomes even if he isn't ready for a year or two? What if he turns into Rodgers or Favre? Then they say Steelers or team that is a Superbowl contender will have a hard sell to fans if they don't draft based on need.
TheFunPolice Posted April 4, 2017 Posted April 4, 2017 Steelers a Super Bowl contender? Belichick smirked.
Eric Moulds on my A** Posted April 4, 2017 Posted April 4, 2017 Steelers a Super Bowl contender? Belichick smirked. Cards fall the right way they could be.. Full season with Bell, Brown stays healthy, Martavis reinstated (supposing he doesn't get suspended again), Big Ben and a wild card in Greene.. that's a potent offense.
KOKBILLS Posted April 4, 2017 Posted April 4, 2017 Tech QB Mahomes stays busy and other visit notes … We note in an earlier post that Texas Tech Patrick Mahomes, who has visits or workouts planned with 18 teams prior to the draft, may be the ‘most interesting man’ in the draft. In fact, the legend of Mahomes, or at least his itinerary, continues to grow. The latest team to add their name to Mahomes’ dance card in Buffalo which will reportedly work him out later this week. The Bills, who have the 10th pick this year, did extend incumbent starter Tyrod Taylor earlier this year, but did little to hide the fact that they really wanted to upgrade the position prior to the extension. Meanwhile, Pittsburgh has also reportedly scheduled a work out with Mahomes. Like a lot of teams around the league, the Steelers may have to start to think about finding a future replacement for aging veteran Ben Roethlisberger who reportedly considered retiring this off-season. However, the Steelers, who have the 30th pick this year, may not have much a shot at Mahomes as there is a growing buzz around the league that he is closing in on a possible top ten grade. http://gbnreport.com/ Honestly...I would not be at all surprised if he was the 1st QB taken...He's my #1 QB in this Draft and I've been doing this amateur scouting thing for over 20 years...I'm not saying whatsoever that I know better than anyone...However, I have to believe a few teams will see it my way...And it's not like NFL teams are all that great at scouting QB's anyway unless things are glaringly obvious (ie. The Mannings, Luck, Stafford etc...)...The top 3rd of NFL QB's in 2016 included a 6th Rd pick as the best...maybe of all time, two 4th round picks, two 2nd round picks, and a 3rd round pick...So... With Mahomes it all depends on what teams are looking for and the size of their you-know-whats... The thing is, I like some of the other QB's in this Draft too...Especially Trubisky and Watson...So when I say i like Mahomes best of them I really do think that's saying something...This is not 2013 no matter what ill informed folks like John Clayton say...EJ Manuel would be hard pressed to be the 6th or 7th QB taken if he came out this year...This is a decent, albeit not outstanding, class of QB's...IMHO Mahomes floor is just about where the others are, while his ceiling is elite...And I'm more than willing to swing for the fences on a kid like him...Because if he works out it's not a single or a double...It's a 3 run Home Run...
jeffismagic Posted April 4, 2017 Posted April 4, 2017 (edited) Honestly...I would not be at all surprised if he was the 1st QB taken...He's my #1 QB in this Draft and I've been doing this amateur scouting thing for over 20 years...I'm not saying whatsoever that I know better than anyone...However, I have to believe a few teams will see it my way...And it's not like NFL teams are all that great at scouting QB's anyway unless things are glaringly obvious (ie. The Mannings, Luck, Stafford etc...)...The top 3rd of NFL QB's in 2016 included a 6th Rd pick as the best...maybe of all time, two 4th round picks, two 2nd round picks, and a 3rd round pick...So... With Mahomes it all depends on what teams are looking for and the size of their you-know-whats... The thing is, I like some of the other QB's in this Draft too...Especially Trubisky and Watson...So when I say i like Mahomes best of them I really do think that's saying something...This is not 2013 no matter what ill informed folks like John Clayton say...EJ Manuel would be hard pressed to be the 6th or 7th QB taken if he came out this year...This is a decent, albeit not outstanding, class of QB's...IMHO Mahomes floor is just about where the others are, while his ceiling is elite...And I'm more than willing to swing for the fences on a kid like him...Because if he works out it's not a single or a double...It's a 3 run Home Run... Yes, following the Bills this town needs a home run at the QB position. We deserve it after suffering so many years! Kyle Shanahan went on the record saying arm talent is the best way to win in the NFL at the quarterback position. “There’s a very natural ability in the throwing and if you don’t have that, it’s very hard to succeed in this league,” Shanahan told beat writers after last Thursday’s press conference. “You are always looking for one of those seven throwers on the planet, whatever that number is. I’m guessing there’s only around seven.” There’s only one consensus elite arm talent in the 2017 NFL Draft, and that’s Mahomes. The strapping 6-foot-3, 220 pounder has a rocket launcher attached to his right arm. http://www.knbr.com/2017/02/15/texas-tech-prospect-pat-mahomes-has-the-arm-talent-shanahan-says-hes-looking-for/ Edited April 4, 2017 by jeffismagic
BillsFan17 Posted April 4, 2017 Posted April 4, 2017 Honestly...I would not be at all surprised if he was the 1st QB taken...He's my #1 QB in this Draft and I've been doing this amateur scouting thing for over 20 years...I'm not saying whatsoever that I know better than anyone...However, I have to believe a few teams will see it my way...And it's not like NFL teams are all that great at scouting QB's anyway unless things are glaringly obvious (ie. The Mannings, Luck, Stafford etc...)...The top 3rd of NFL QB's in 2016 included a 6th Rd pick as the best...maybe of all time, two 4th round picks, two 2nd round picks, and a 3rd round pick...So... With Mahomes it all depends on what teams are looking for and the size of their you-know-whats... The thing is, I like some of the other QB's in this Draft too...Especially Trubisky and Watson...So when I say i like Mahomes best of them I really do think that's saying something...This is not 2013 no matter what ill informed folks like John Clayton say...EJ Manuel would be hard pressed to be the 6th or 7th QB taken if he came out this year...This is a decent, albeit not outstanding, class of QB's...IMHO Mahomes floor is just about where the others are, while his ceiling is elite...And I'm more than willing to swing for the fences on a kid like him...Because if he works out it's not a single or a double...It's a 3 run Home Run... Now to be fair, in all those years, how many QBs have you seen come from an Air Raid offense and workout in the NFL?
jeffismagic Posted April 4, 2017 Posted April 4, 2017 Now to be fair, in all those years, how many QBs have you seen come from an Air Raid offense and workout in the NFL? How many HOF players came from Miami of Ohio before Big Ben? You keep posting stuff about Air Raid. Please explain how that form of spread offense will leave a QB less prepared than from other forms of spread offense. Seriously, let's hear it.
YoloinOhio Posted April 5, 2017 Posted April 5, 2017 (edited) But🤔 @siriusXMNFL Bill Polian's top 5 Draft QB's: - Trubisky - Kizer - Watson - Kaaya - C. Kelly Edited April 5, 2017 by YoloinOhio
BillsFan17 Posted April 5, 2017 Posted April 5, 2017 (edited) How many HOF players came from Miami of Ohio before Big Ben? You keep posting stuff about Air Raid. Please explain how that form of spread offense will leave a QB less prepared than from other forms of spread offense. Seriously, let's hear it. So what school you play for has more to do with how well you play than the system the scool employs? The Air Raid will also typically split the linemen wider, in turn forcing DEs and ede ushers to have to go further upfield to reach the QB. While the QB is primarily in the shotgun and not taking snaps under center. Often just reading what the defense gives them wirh basic route concepts. The offense in no way prepares QBS for an NFL style offense. We have seen Mahomes play sandlot football being thay blocking style. Plus, in the air raid attack, much like chip Kellys fast pace attack, if you aren't converting first downs you will tire out a defense big time. You keep acting like its going to be an utterly smooth transition. Yet, no QB has ever transitioned from that style of offense and played well in the NFL. Edited April 5, 2017 by BillsFan17
jeffismagic Posted April 5, 2017 Posted April 5, 2017 (edited) So what school you play for has more to do with how well you play than the system the scool employs? The Air Raid will also typically split the linemen wider, in turn forcing DEs and ede ushers to have to go further upfield (Irrelevant)to reach the QB. While the QB is primarily in the shotgun and not taking snaps under center(Yes, it's a spread offense). Often just reading what the defense gives them (Yes, it's called pre-snap read) with basic(?) route concepts. The offense in no way prepares QBS for an NFL style offense. (Nothing but restating your initial statement!) We have seen Mahomes play sandlot football being thay blocking style. (When he has a clean pocket he is happy to throw from there) Plus, in the air raid attack, much like chip Kellys fast pace attack, if you aren't converting first downs you will tire out a defense big time. (Irrelevant to NFL transition) You keep acting like its going to be an utterly smooth transition. Yet, no QB has ever transitioned from that style of offense and played well in the NFL. (wrong) You really need to spend more time on Air Raid. It's just another form of spread offense. There is nothing about it that makes a QB fall apart in the NFL. Spread offenses have just started to be successful transitioning to the NFL (as NFL systems become more college and spread like) and Air Raid systems are getting top prospects now. So your rule will soon be shattered multiple times. The only relevant item is the play under shotgun. Yes, that is true. Leach, often regarded as the Air Raid’s godfather, says his system is derived from many wishbone principles: distributing the ball to all five skill-position players. Except his offense focuses on doing that through passing. The coach also emphasizes that the NFL has borrowed from his playbook. “It’s indisputable that most of the NFL is copying us and doing Air Raid things,” Leach says. “The Patriots have total Air Raid influences, the Saints have total Air Raid influences, the Packers, the 49ers, to a lesser degree Seattle, the Broncos for sure(Dennison). It’d be easier to say the ones who aren’t influenced by it.” But the Air Raid alone isn’t the only reason some evaluators are skeptical of players like Falk. “Of course it’s great if a guy has big production, and you’re more likely to find that if they’re in an Air Raid system,” says an AFC personnel man. “My concerns with a guy from the Air Raid are the same as any guy who ran a spread offense. Only a fraction of the snaps they take are transferrable to the NFL.” The two biggest differences: commanding a huddle and taking snaps under center. “No question when a guy is learning how to play under center, the footwork needs to be worked on,” says UMass coach Mark Whipple, who was the quarterbacks coach for the Steelers during Ben Roethlisberger’s rookie year and the Browns during Weeden’s first NFL season. “The verbiage is a challenge for rookies no matter where they come from. http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2016/10/19/nfl-draft-2017-luke-falk-washington-state-air-raid-qbs# This explains why the Air Raid only had crappy QB prospects when it started. It was created for underdog schools. Now that schools who can recruit QB's can run it the NFL will have plenty of players soon. Edited April 5, 2017 by jeffismagic
FireChan Posted April 5, 2017 Posted April 5, 2017 You really need to spend more time on Air Raid. It's just another form of spread offense. There is nothing about it that makes a QB fall apart in the NFL. Spread offenses have just started to be successful transitioning to the NFL (as NFL systems become more college and spread like) and Air Raid systems are getting top prospects now. So your rule will soon be shattered multiple times. The only relevant item is the play under shotgun. Yes, that is true. Leach, often regarded as the Air Raid’s godfather, says his system is derived from many wishbone principles: distributing the ball to all five skill-position players. Except his offense focuses on doing that through passing. The coach also emphasizes that the NFL has borrowed from his playbook. “It’s indisputable that most of the NFL is copying us and doing Air Raid things,” Leach says. “The Patriots have total Air Raid influences, the Saints have total Air Raid influences, the Packers, the 49ers, to a lesser degree Seattle, the Broncos for sure(Dennison). It’d be easier to say the ones who aren’t influenced by it.” But the Air Raid alone isn’t the only reason some evaluators are skeptical of players like Falk. “Of course it’s great if a guy has big production, and you’re more likely to find that if they’re in an Air Raid system,” says an AFC personnel man. “My concerns with a guy from the Air Raid are the same as any guy who ran a spread offense. Only a fraction of the snaps they take are transferrable to the NFL.” The two biggest differences: commanding a huddle and taking snaps under center. “No question when a guy is learning how to play under center, the footwork needs to be worked on,” says UMass coach Mark Whipple, who was the quarterbacks coach for the Steelers during Ben Roethlisberger’s rookie year and the Browns during Weeden’s first NFL season. “The verbiage is a challenge for rookies no matter where they come from. http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2016/10/19/nfl-draft-2017-luke-falk-washington-state-air-raid-qbs# I'm so impressed. You have 195 posts in this topic. You so comfortably have the lead, #2, #3 and #4 combined barely come close. Which means if Mahomes sucks, you're may have to change names
jeffismagic Posted April 5, 2017 Posted April 5, 2017 I'm so impressed. You have 195 posts in this topic. You so comfortably have the lead, #2, #3 and #4 combined barely come close. Which means if Mahomes sucks, you're may have to change names So I am the board's biggest MaHomer? Guilty!
BillsFan17 Posted April 5, 2017 Posted April 5, 2017 (edited) Yet, until it happens, the success rate of QBS coming to the NFL out of that offense haven't translated. So until they actually do, and your big theory gets proven right, still safe to say the Air Raid isnt translating. That same article points out that no QB has transitioned from that style on offense to the NFL. Edited April 5, 2017 by BillsFan17
BADOLBILZ Posted April 5, 2017 Posted April 5, 2017 So I am the board's biggest MaHomer? Guilty! No, I think that would be Bandit. Maybe I missed it but seemed like you just got on the Mahomes thing in the offseason. I love his potential.......didn't really enjoy watching him on Saturdays nearly as much as I like his potential......he was a frustrating watch even when he was putting up numbers. He's got a lot of things to improve on but mainly consistency.......Buffalo would be a great landing spot, IMO because he's going to have a chance to compete for the job with Tyrod here and Tyrod isn't just going to give it up. Competition and that carrot in front of him should sharpen him up if anything will.
jeffismagic Posted April 5, 2017 Posted April 5, 2017 (edited) No, I think that would be Bandit. Maybe I missed it but seemed like you just got on the Mahomes thing in the offseason. I love his potential.......didn't really enjoy watching him on Saturdays nearly as much as I like his potential......he was a frustrating watch even when he was putting up numbers. He's got a lot of things to improve on but mainly consistency.......Buffalo would be a great landing spot, IMO because he's going to have a chance to compete for the job with Tyrod here and Tyrod isn't just going to give it up. Competition and that carrot in front of him should sharpen him up if anything will. Bandit gets credit for first Mahomes booster on this board. Yet, until it happens, the success rate of QBS coming to the NFL out of that offense haven't translated. So until they actually do, and your big theory gets proven right, still safe to say the Air Raid isnt translating. That same article points out that no QB has transitioned from that style on offense to the NFL. And your theory means nothing because you haven't demonstrated how the Air Raid poses unique challenges to NFL transition than other spread offenses. I just posted an AFC front office guy explaining that but you ignored the key takeaway without processing. Edited April 5, 2017 by jeffismagic
BillsFan17 Posted April 5, 2017 Posted April 5, 2017 Bandit gets credit for first Mahomes booster on this board. And your theory means nothing because you haven't demonstrated how the Air Raid poses unique challenges to NFL transition than other spread offenses. I just posted an AFC front office guy explaining that but you ignored the key takeaway without processing. Yet,the paragraph about what you cherry picked pointed out the failures of QBs playing in that system and translating to the NFL.
jeffismagic Posted April 5, 2017 Posted April 5, 2017 Yet,the paragraph about what you cherry picked pointed out the failures of QBs playing in that system and translating to the NFL. Fine. You scout your way based on maxims and I will scout the traits. Your way would have passed on Derek Carr (because his brother sucked), Dak Prescott (because Tim Tebow sucked) and Aaron Rodgers (because every other Tedford system QB was a bust). Actually, I hope every NFL team before Buffalo thinks like you.
BillsFan17 Posted April 5, 2017 Posted April 5, 2017 Fine. You scout your way based on maxims and I will scout the traits. Your way would have passed on Derek Carr (because his brother sucked), Dak Prescott (because Tim Tebow sucked) and Aaron Rodgers (because every other Tedford system QB was a bust). Actually, I hope every NFL team before Buffalo thinks like you. You are grasping at straws so badly. If they all played in the same system, it would absolutely be factored into their evaluation. You keep telling me I'm basing things off of other factors. I have never made any other correlation based on a players ability to transition to the pros other than the system. Not school, not family blood lines, I don't get the Dak and Tebow comparison, as far as Tedford, he's the only one who presents a valid point. Having one QB work outside of maybe Dilfer absolutely would cause teams to caution drafting his QBs. To think otherwise is absolutely blind and nieve. Watching Carr, Harrington, Akili Smit, and Boller absolutely outright bust... if you don't throw up a red flag that his system is obviously not translating... That to me is like saying we should keep drafting a QB in the sixth round, because that is where Brady was drafted. Or like you even mentioned let's keep dipping into Miami of Ohio because they produced Big Ben, therefore they have to have other QBs. Eli has two super bowls having came out of Ole Miss. Might as well draft Kelly. His older brother was awesome at Tennessee so let's snag Dobbs. Having one example to competely blanket an entire body of work is weak at best.
Recommended Posts