Alphadawg7 Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 They kept 3 QBs on the 53 last year and seeing as Whaley still has control of the 53, why would that change? Oh, are you saying Cardale was on the active 53? For some reason i thought he was on PS all year until week 17, so if that is the case then my bad. I would adjust my point to be then he would be competing for that 3rd spot on the 53 or facing going to PS.
Wayne Cubed Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 Oh, are you saying Cardale was on the active 53? For some reason i thought he was on PS all year until week 17, so if that is the case then my bad. I would adjust my point to be then he would be competing for that 3rd spot on the 53 or facing going to PS. Yea he was on the 53 all yea just not part of the 46 active for game day. If they tried to sneak him into the PS another team would have snatched him up.
BillsVet Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 Just to be clear the Bills are HAPPY with where Cardale is now not disappointed. He isn't going to be fighting for a roster spot or anything (unless he regresses quite a bit). He may even end up as the #2. Cardale was a project and I don't think that all Bills fans realized that. It was always going to take a few years. They aren't scrapping that plan now. Who are "the Bills" that are happy? The only holdovers are the front office types who picked him last year and of course they're "happy" as they were with EJ at the end of 2013. If they weren't "happy" it'd be quite an admission their decision wasn't right. Saying something enough doesn't make it true. Point is, he's not close to starting in his second season and doesn't make them better at the position in 2017.
Alphadawg7 Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 (edited) Yea he was on the 53 all yea just not part of the 46 active for game day. If they tried to sneak him into the PS another team would have snatched him up. Makes sense, I mistakenly thought he was on the PS. My original point about Chad Kelly still applies as I have this feeling he will be one of our 5th round picks as it just makes too much sense. With the Bills not having a 4th rounder, I just can't see us using either of our top 3 picks on a QB unless someone they really like slides to a great value spot. Gilmore looks like he is most likely gone leaving 3 huge holes in the starting secondary at CB and both safety spots. I assume we likely address CB in FA as there are some suitable guys there to bring in, especially with the draft being a strong one for safeties. You have to think WR and RT are high on the list too. So, I think those first 3 picks are going to be a higher priority for Secondary, RT and WR (depending on what isnt addressed in FA) then look to use one of our two picks in the 5th to bring a young prospect in to compete for Cardale as the development guy. Edited February 4, 2017 by Alphadawg7
Kirby Jackson Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 (edited) Who are "the Bills" that are happy? The only holdovers are the front office types who picked him last year and of course they're "happy" as they were with EJ at the end of 2013. If they weren't "happy" it'd be quite an admission their decision wasn't right. Saying something enough doesn't make it true. Point is, he's not close to starting in his second season and doesn't make them better at the position in 2017. The front office and previous coaching staff was pleased with his progress. I clarified that already. He was never intended to be ready to start in 2017. I think every team in the league knew that going into the 2016 draft. He was a guy that had insane tools, a lack of experience and didn't play in a pro style offense. When a team (in this case the Bills) made the decision to take him they were aware that it would be a process. This wasn't news to anyone. He was drafted because of his upside. Cardale was going to be behind guys like Kessler on day 1 but the thinking is that if he develops he will fly by those guys. So far he's shown the FO progress (which was what they hoped). They will give it another year to see if that continues. As a sidenote you are THE LAST PERSON on this board that should say "if you say something enough it doesn't make it true." You've regurgitated the same one thought over and over for years. Edited February 4, 2017 by Kirby Jackson
Augie Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 Who are "the Bills" that are happy? The only holdovers are the front office types who picked him last year and of course they're "happy" as they were with EJ at the end of 2013. If they weren't "happy" it'd be quite an admission their decision wasn't right. Saying something enough doesn't make it true. Point is, he's not close to starting in his second season and doesn't make them better at the position in 2017. Not being close to starting does not mean that he is not better, and if he's better the position is improved at least in that regard.
bigK14094 Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 Lets see...a couple more years, and his contract is up....and the Bills investment in him will hit the marketplace. If he can play, the Bills will have to bid for him, Really wondering about the stragedy of him using a Bills roster spot to develope for 3 years, and then departing. Seems like project guys are a bad bet in the NFL. I would cut him now. (Same scenrio with EJ, but he never became good)
Augie Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 Lets see...a couple more years, and his contract is up....and the Bills investment in him will hit the marketplace. If he can play, the Bills will have to bid for him, Really wondering about the stragedy of him using a Bills roster spot to develope for 3 years, and then departing. Seems like project guys are a bad bet in the NFL. I would cut him now. (Same scenrio with EJ, but he never became good) No one knows him better than the team that sees him every day. If you see something worth keeping, you can lock him up early. It's the ideal way to operate, actually. Did the Packers waste their time with Aaron Rogers?
Marty McFly Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 It'll be Whaley selling it to the new coaches, and it's the #3 spot. I can't imagine it's that much of a tough sell. He can say, "Take a look at him this year and make a decision next off season" at the very least. I don't think they would be pushing very hard for a different QB prospect for the #3 spot. This No one knows him better than the team that sees him every day. If you see something worth keeping, you can lock him up early. It's the ideal way to operate, actually. Did the Packers waste their time with Aaron Rogers? and this.
Mr. WEO Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 Simple--you start him only in the playoffs and the Super Bowl.
JohnC Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 You do EXACTLY what you always planned on doing with a Cardale. You continue to develop him. He made big strides in year 1 and still has a ways to go. This isn't a surprise to the Bills. He was a raw prospect with a high celing. He wasn't being drafted to be a solid back-up that can play day one. He was a guy that was drafted because he has the raw tools to be a star. His role this year probably looks a lot like his role last year. That's not a disappointment or a surprise, that was the plan. The issue I have with Cardale or any qb prospect is his accuracy. If a qb doesn't have sharp accuracy in college it is improbable (not impossible) that he will have it in the pros where the windows are tighter and the speed of the game is much faster. Without a doubt he has intriguing tools related to his size and arm strength. I'm not criticizing his selection and investment on development. It's just that I think the odds are against him making it in the long run because of the accuracy issue. I would love to be wrong and am still very much open about him.
TANK2 Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 He doesnt get ready cause hes not good enough and never will be.
JoeF Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 Whaley's not going to have much of a sales job with McDermott and Dennison... Cam 6'5" 245 great size, rocket arm, superior mobility, smart football player, very durable Cardale 6'5" 249 great size, rocket arm, good mobility, more athlete than football player, can take hits without being fragile Cardale has the physical tools to be a superman. Dennison and Culley have probably already looked at last years mini-camp, training camp, preseason game, practice and Jets game tape. They see improved footwork throughout the year; improved ball placement throughout the year, the ability to grasp a fairly simple NFL passing system and the courage to throw into any window with literally a rocket arm. That's all they need to see...you keep an asset like Cardale around for at least his rookie contract plus the option year if he works hard and behaves well. He's young. He could be the future. Choosing between Cardale and say Jeff Tuel as a number 3-- there is no choice.
PromoTheRobot Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 Serious question: what do you do with Cardale? All you ever hear about him is that he's not ready, which he proved hugely in the Jets game. You also read there's no time during the regular season to develop him because other QB's need the rep's. So when does he get ready? If you bring back Tyrod, he plays and he's probably here a few more years. Where's the window for Cardale? If he's "not ready," how do you make him the 2nd QB even with EJ gone? If you don't bring back Tyrod, someone else plays because Cardale's not ready. You pick up a serviceable vet and probably forget about the playoffs. If you draft Watson at #10 (which appeals to me a lot), there's a better chance of him playing early -- like in 2017 -- than Cardale. So what's the point of carrying Cardale? What are you supposed to do with him and when? This post shows why I don't believe anyone will be patient enough to develop a Bills QB. Cardale Jones is exactly the kind of flyer pick people say the Bills need to make. But a year later we want the next shiny object.
JoeF Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 This post shows why I don't believe anyone will be patient enough to develop a Bills QB. Cardale Jones is exactly the kind of flyer pick people say the Bills need to make. But a year later we want the next shiny object. Oh look a puppy!
DefenseWins Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 If the Bills decide to move on from TT they will more than likely draft a QB high in this years draft... They may bring in a "caretaker" to provide veteran leadership skills and start most of the season while the new "kid" develops... This should have relatively little to any impact on Cardale Jones... Cardale may have a canon for an arm but there is a whole lot more to becoming a good NFL QB than just having a big arm... Can he learn to read defenses? Does he have good pocket presence" Can he develop "touch" on his passes? These are just a few of the many hurdles he will have to overcome if he is to develop into a good pro QB... Most "projects" of this type FAIL... A QB's ARM doesn't usually determine his level of success... It's whats in his HEAD that matters most...
1billsfan Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 (edited) Your strategy has the words TANK written all over it in big freaking letters. And that doesn't sell tickets or merchandise or bring new fans to the team. It’s not tanking, it’s making sound business decisions in building your team the proper way. You can’t be expected to always go for the gold when the landscape and schedule just isn’t realistically there for you to do so. You don’t force yourself into making risky decisions like using a ton of cap money on a mediocre QB like Taylor, or burning a 1st rd QB pick on a talent poor or highly questionable class. It looks like there’s going to be about 3 maybe 4 true franchise QBs in next year’s class. The sound decision is to sign a cheap free agent QB, then hope Jones will be ready to start a significant number of games (8-10?) to take over the starting duties from whoever that veteran QB is. Whatever long shot Jones is, at least you’ll have a chance (no matter how small that chance is) that he shows he’s got the “it” factor and he’s going to be the long term answer. That Bills schedule is literally one of the toughest in the league. There’s no need to make rash or risky decisions so that it doesn’t look like you’re tanking. This team is a 6 or 7 win team with Taylor starting. Make the proper decisions with the QB position that will get you to the top 3 or 4 years from now. Just remember, the Bills are already behind the 8 ball with teams like the Raiders, Titans who have Carr and Mariota (even eventually the Colts with Luck). In the next couple of years, you’ll have a bunch of teams that have aging QBs (Steelers, Giants, Saints, Chargers, Cardinals, Vikings) who’ll be getting back into the QB market soon. I think there'll be a mad dash for QBs in the 2018 draft. Best to at least be in the range of getting one than winning two more games with Taylor and then having to burn 1st round picks to move up. If you aren’t in position because Cardale Jones turned out to be the steal of last years draft, then you don’t have to worry about it! Edited February 4, 2017 by 1billsfan
PolishDave Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 Whaley's not going to have much of a sales job with McDermott and Dennison... Cam 6'5" 245 great size, rocket arm, superior mobility, smart football player, very durable Cardale 6'5" 249 great size, rocket arm, good mobility, more athlete than football player, can take hits without being fragile Cardale has the physical tools to be a superman. Dennison and Culley have probably already looked at last years mini-camp, training camp, preseason game, practice and Jets game tape. They see improved footwork throughout the year; improved ball placement throughout the year, the ability to grasp a fairly simple NFL passing system and the courage to throw into any window with literally a rocket arm. That's all they need to see...you keep an asset like Cardale around for at least his rookie contract plus the option year if he works hard and behaves well. He's young. He could be the future. Choosing between Cardale and say Jeff Tuel as a number 3-- there is no choice. Joe, how do you know what they see? You just made that up. You have no idea what they see unless you are there with them watching it listening to what they say. Come on man.
Mike in Horseheads Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 Cardale will be selling cars at Joes gently preowned car lot next year. 30 day guarantee.
WideRightRevenge Posted February 4, 2017 Posted February 4, 2017 Whaley's not going to have much of a sales job with McDermott and Dennison... Cam 6'5" 245 great size, rocket arm, superior mobility, smart football player, very durable Cardale 6'5" 249 great size, rocket arm, good mobility, more athlete than football player, can take hits without being fragile Cardale has the physical tools to be a superman. Dennison and Culley have probably already looked at last years mini-camp, training camp, preseason game, practice and Jets game tape. They see improved footwork throughout the year; improved ball placement throughout the year, the ability to grasp a fairly simple NFL passing system and the courage to throw into any window with literally a rocket arm. That's all they need to see...you keep an asset like Cardale around for at least his rookie contract plus the option year if he works hard and behaves well. He's young. He could be the future. Choosing between Cardale and say Jeff Tuel as a number 3-- there is no choice. I'm with Joe on this one ... I am so tired of Bills QBs with limp arms and dink and dunk ... yes he needs time / accuracy .. but he did stretch the jets D when he played ... you can't even put him in Tuel in the same discussion ... granted the WR injuries didn't help Tyrod in '16 ... but only 12 picks in 2 years ... that's playing not to lose the game. When Tyrod does go deep, he drops in a nice ball ... but what I'm wanting is 20 yard outs where the ball is out before the receiver cuts ... we haven't had that forever.
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