Let's Talk Race Issues

[Azalin]

That brings us to the most tragic aspect of black crime. The primary victims are law-abiding black people who must conduct their lives in fear. Some parents serve their children meals on the floor and sometimes put them to sleep in bathtubs so as to avoid stray bullets. The average American does not live this way and would not tolerate it. And that includes the white liberals who support and make excuses for criminals. Plain decency mandates that we come to the aid of millions of law-abiding people under siege. For their part, black people should stop being pawns for white liberals and support the police who are trying to protect them.

 

I've always liked Williams. He and Sowell both come across to me as heirs to Friedman's general philosophy of economics, and he's always had a pretty keen insight into American culture, especially with regard to African Americans. Thanks for posting.

[Meathead]

Pawns of Liberals

 

By Prof. Walter E. Williams

 

 

fwiw our goal is/should be to decouple the topic of race with classic american politics

 

hahahahhahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa. yeaaaah. good luck with that one

 

no wait, i mean it this time

 

race is too vital a topic to let get submerged in the poisonous radioactive goo that is our national politics. associating our most important elements of natural existence with the petty, self-serving, primitive, war creating frailties of our lower human nature, we all directly lose. lose big time

 

race and politics. to us it looks like a giant chocolate sundae and a spoon. actually its dynamite and an acetylene torch

so we have to actively resist putting those two together

 

ridiculously tall order, i realize. nonetheless, it has to be the goal

[grinreaper]

 

fwiw our goal is/should be to decouple the topic of race with classic american politics

 

hahahahhahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa. yeaaaah. good luck with that one

 

no wait, i mean it this time

 

race is too vital a topic to let get submerged in the poisonous radioactive goo that is our national politics. associating our most important elements of natural existence with the petty, self-serving, primitive, war creating frailties of our lower human nature, we all directly lose. lose big time

 

race and politics. to us it looks like a giant chocolate sundae and a spoon. actually its dynamite and an acetylene torch

so we have to actively resist putting those two together

 

ridiculously tall order, i realize. nonetheless, it has to be the goal

You don't debate or discuss but you got that proclamation thing down pretty good.

[boyst]

 

fwiw our goal is/should be to decouple the topic of race with classic american politics

 

hahahahhahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa. yeaaaah. good luck with that one

 

no wait, i mean it this time

 

race is too vital a topic to let get submerged in the poisonous radioactive goo that is our national politics. associating our most important elements of natural existence with the petty, self-serving, primitive, war creating frailties of our lower human nature, we all directly lose. lose big time

 

race and politics. to us it looks like a giant chocolate sundae and a spoon. actually its dynamite and an acetylene torch

 

so we have to actively resist putting those two together

 

ridiculously tall order, i realize. nonetheless, it has to be the goal

one of the former HNIC's once said he hoped his children wouldn't be judged by the color of their skin but something about their character.

 

So why is race so important again?

[Meathead]

one of the former HNIC's once said he hoped his children wouldn't be judged by the color of their skin but something about their character.

 

So why is race so important again?

 

dr mr boyst

 

once again, what to do with you. you are like a non-stop motor of mostly funny nonsense: entertaining but only occasionally more nutritionally filling that a super slurpee

 

so youve been big on this race blindness idea for weeks now. i can tell its your thing. so sincere congrats on moving well beyond no ni99ers in nascar, but this is still a beginner step. not that beginner steps are bad, they arent, they are good. but they are stepping stones. lets think this through a little and see where the next step might be

 

the idea of being race neutral comes from a desire to leave old racist patterns behind. ok, that part is good. but race neutrality itself is actually a bad idea. "not seeing color" sounds nice when compared against lynching negros for not minding their place, but bad when actually integrating races as brothers

 

if we consider how important race is relatively, its closer to shoe size and eye color than it is to the enormous over-importance we put on it now. ridiculously so, in fact. but race indeed IS a little more important than how big our feet are or how tall we are

 

race often matches cultural delineations, and culture is reflective of learned behavior patterns that have evolved differently in each culture over time. note that cultural differences are mostly superficial, most cultures are mostly similar, and many elements are repeated among cultures with different ways they are expressed. so most often their understanding and subtleties are hard to pick out among the different cultural languages, but they are far more alike than they are different

 

the point is, these cultural differences are treasure troves of lessons on life and perspective. for example, we can say that historic western white dominance and success brings certain knowledge gifts and flaws to the collective, so does historic arab, asian, and african dominance in those cultures. each culture brings its own spin on life situations that repeat, and in those subtleties we have valuable data on life and human development

 

erasing the knowledge of those gifts and flaws would be developmentally tragic. it would destructive at the highest order of our existence. which means it would be stupid

 

so to some important degree, the recognition of race and its relationship to culture must be maintained

 

then whats the next step?

 

being comfortable as an individual and then a society to recognize the gifts and flaws of each race. to be able to analyze them all equally, which they are. to give each race/culture a real seat at the table where they will get both praise for their gifts and criticized for their flaws. in this way we analyze them, break them down into logic pieces, and leverage the good where we can

 

would that be possible if we implement some kind of race neutrality? no

 

there shouldnt be any problem being wide eyed and looking directly at race, in both our cultures and our individuals. its HOW we look at race that we are botching this equation. aaaaa-gain

[Azalin]

 

fwiw our goal is/should be to decouple the topic of race with classic american politics

 

 

The only way to do that is to ignore race altogether. If we can not be divided as Americans, then we can not be pitted against each other by agenda-driven groups. Racial disparity will only become a thing of the past when people stop seeing race as something that makes us different from one another.

[boyst]

 

dr mr boyst

 

once again, what to do with you. you are like a non-stop motor of mostly funny nonsense: entertaining but only occasionally more nutritionally filling that a super slurpee

 

so youve been big on this race blindness idea for weeks now. i can tell its your thing. so sincere congrats on moving well beyond no ni99ers in nascar, but this is still a beginner step. not that beginner steps are bad, they arent, they are good. but they are stepping stones. lets think this through a little and see where the next step might be

 

the idea of being race neutral comes from a desire to leave old racist patterns behind. ok, that part is good. but race neutrality itself is actually a bad idea. "not seeing color" sounds nice when compared against lynching negros for not minding their place, but bad when actually integrating races as brothers

 

if we consider how important race is relatively, its closer to shoe size and eye color than it is to the enormous over-importance we put on it now. ridiculously so, in fact. but race indeed IS a little more important than how big our feet are or how tall we are

 

race often matches cultural delineations, and culture is reflective of learned behavior patterns that have evolved differently in each culture over time. note that cultural differences are mostly superficial, most cultures are mostly similar, and many elements are repeated among cultures with different ways they are expressed. so most often their understanding and subtleties are hard to pick out among the different cultural languages, but they are far more alike than they are different

 

the point is, these cultural differences are treasure troves of lessons on life and perspective. for example, we can say that historic western white dominance and success brings certain knowledge gifts and flaws to the collective, so does historic arab, asian, and african dominance in those cultures. each culture brings its own spin on life situations that repeat, and in those subtleties we have valuable data on life and human development

 

erasing the knowledge of those gifts and flaws would be developmentally tragic. it would destructive at the highest order of our existence. which means it would be stupid

 

so to some important degree, the recognition of race and its relationship to culture must be maintained

 

then whats the next step?

 

being comfortable as an individual and then a society to recognize the gifts and flaws of each race. to be able to analyze them all equally, which they are. to give each race/culture a real seat at the table where they will get both praise for their gifts and criticized for their flaws. in this way we analyze them, break them down into logic pieces, and leverage the good where we can

 

would that be possible if we implement some kind of race neutrality? no

 

there shouldnt be any problem being wide eyed and looking directly at race, in both our cultures and our individuals. its HOW we look at race that we are botching this equation. aaaaa-gain

you took all that time to write that really believing I'll read it? Wow. Sucks to be you

[Meathead]

 

The only way to do that is to ignore race altogether. If we can not be divided as Americans, then we can not be pitted against each other by agenda-driven groups. Racial disparity will only become a thing of the past when people stop seeing race as something that makes us different from one another.

 

sorry brother, i just dont see it that way

 

we can do that by committing to each other as brothers and having the discussion driven from that place with the motivation to strengthen the relationship between individuals and between the races

 

and despite boyst not wanting to read anything more complicated than a chuck-e-cheese menu, there actually ARE distinctions between the races that are valuable to us, as i described in my too-long-for-agriculture-engineers explanation

 

politics is the process to win at any cost. that mindset is anathema to actually accomplishing something in a legitimate debate. thus if you want to get anywhere race and politics cant be connected the way we are connecting them right now in american society bc we will see exactly what we see happening now - we will get nowhere

 

for the record, there are some of us that have absolutely no problem talking openly and honestly about difficult topics among the races. its just that we are very rare and tend not to get listened to. MLK was reviled by most ppl in his time, and we can say that about all race issue visionaries. ppl dont want logic and reason, they want victory and scorched earth at the expense of their 'opponents'. thats why you dont want it to get political, to move it from the space where their are opponents at all and into the space where there are only partners wanting sincerely to make progress

 

yeah pretty rare indeed

Edited February 16, 2017 by Meathead

[TakeYouToTasker]

Racism will be an issue until we stop caring about race, and until people stop caring where people come from, and begin to focus onwhere they are going.

Edited February 16, 2017 by TakeYouToTasker

[Azalin]

 

sorry brother, i just dont see it that way

 

we can do that by committing to each other as brothers and having the discussion driven from that place with the motivation to strengthen the relationship between individuals and between the races

 

and despite boyst not wanting to read anything more complicated than a chuck-e-cheese menu, there actually ARE distinctions between the races that are valuable to us, as i described in my too-long-for-agriculture-engineers explanation

 

politics is the process to win at any cost. that mindset is anathema to actually accomplishing something in a legitimate debate. thus if you want to get anywhere race and politics cant be connected the way we are connecting them right now in american society bc we will see exactly what we see happening now - we will get nowhere

 

for the record, there are some of us that have absolutely no problem talking openly and honestly about difficult topics among the races. its just that we are very rare and tend not to get listened to. MLK was reviled by most ppl in his time, and we can say that about all race issue visionaries. ppl dont want logic and reason, they want victory and scorched earth at the expense of their 'opponents'. thats why you dont want it to get political, to move it from the space where their are opponents at all and into the space where there are only partners wanting sincerely to make progress

 

yeah pretty rare indeed

 

Sorry, I just believe that focusing on each others differences will keep us divided, with plenty of politicians lining up to exploit one group or another as being victims of one sort or another. Yes, there are cultural differences among the different American ethnicities, but those cultural differences are due to the fact that we have all evolved as separate communities, not because there's any true difference between us. That can and will be overcome in time.

 

I was alive and in grade school when Dr King rose to prominence, and he was not reviled by most people. He had tremendous support from a large segment of the populace, and it was considered to be a tremendous loss to our nation when he was assassinated. I remember it well. To characterize his movement as anything else is to do him and his supporters of the day an injustice.

Racism will be an issue until we stop caring about race, and until people stop caring where people come from, and begin to focus onwhere they are going.

 

Yes.

[Wacka]

Let's talk race issues?

 

Daytona is only 10 days away!!!

[Meathead]

Racism will be an issue until we stop caring about race, and until people stop caring where people come from, and begin to focus onwhere they are going.

 

good intent but too simplistic. and it wastes valuable resources we could apply toward the common long-term human good

 

its not caring about race thats the problem. its competing on race that is

 

we SHOULD care about race. just not about the stupid stuff we care about race right now. and at the tremendous imbalances that we keep whipsawing back and forth on race

 

in whiteys cycle we only really cared about all white men being created equal. in this cycle we have defined whiteness as default bad on race and blackness as sacred. both extremes do tremendous unnecessary damage to the collective

 

if instead we focus on our responsibility to analyze the gift of race that the cosmos has bestowed upon us ALL COLLECTIVELY, then we can put race to use to our advantage. we do this via the process i outlined earlier, sort of a classic SWOT bidness analysis except per race. by identifying the gifts and flaws in each race we can optimize all races and push the human ball up the hill together

 

come help me push my ball. come on, push it. push it real good

 

I was alive and in grade school when Dr King rose to prominence, and he was not reviled by most people. He had tremendous support from a large segment of the populace, and it was considered to be a tremendous loss to our nation when he was assassinated. I remember it well. To characterize his movement as anything else is to do him and his supporters of the day an injustice.

 

 

thats your romantic attachment. most of what you say is true but your spin has a wishful thinking flavor to it

 

the country was even way more white dominated than it is now. more whites than not wanted to maintain the status quo and it was like that for a long time. mlk was indeed a major force loved by many, but certainly it was not the majority at the time. that didnt happen for at least a decade after his assassination, probably longer. believe me, there were many more virulent rednecks like those in my family than there was in the lily white suburbs or whatever magical land you came from. not trying to be snarky, thats just fact

 

and lets nto try to out-mlk eachother, ok? thats just unnecessary and pointless

Edited February 17, 2017 by Meathead

[keepthefaith]

Racism will be an issue until we stop caring about race, and until people stop caring where people come from, and begin to focus onwhere they are going.

Very well said. Simple and to the point.

[Chef Jim]

Very well said. Simple and to the point.

As opposed to whatever it is cabeza de carne said above.

[meazza]

It's clear that meat head doesn't get it.

[Meathead]

again, overly simplistic. and in fact, pretty much a naive pollyannic

 

just think about what youre saying for a moment

 

youre telling all the chinese to stop caring about their rich millenniums old culture. youre telling the arabs, the american indians, the africans, to stop caring about where they come from and all those built up legacies bc they just dont matter anymore

 

again, your desire to avoid race problems (a good thing) is driving you into crazy nuts ideas land (a bad thing) bc in your minds somehow it is IMPOSSIBLE to actually be able to talk about race and deal with race issues without it turning into a dispute. thats insane

 

while it is true that we are currently over-emphasizing race and thats turning it into a competition about race, it is also true that it would be flatly impossible to just forget about race. and it would be stupid to try bc you would do FAR FAR FAR more damage on multiple levels driving race from existence than you would simply embracing it in a healthy functioning adult manner

 

far far better, of course, is to learn how NOT to be attached emotionally to race issues. we cant be attached to race issues the way you are (ie. lets pretend no races exist so that we dont fight about it), nor like we are in our terrible culture war between blacks and whites both fighting for an illusion of control that neither of us should want or possibly have

 

we need a system reset here. YOU need a system reset here. the reset of course should be to real, true brotherhood. a brotherhood that recognizes what is really important, and what is not

 

go get some books and start reading. the word 'ignorance' doesnt mean stupid, it means you simply are not knowledgeable, you are not aware of what you dont know. thats whats going on in your heads, you havent done the work to bring the proper knowledge into your head, so you offer these kinds of broken bad ideas in the vacuum

 

i can recommend a ton of books if youre interested. nobody ever takes me up on that. and so the destructive cycle just continues ad nauseum. be bold, take a step, start reading

[meazza]

again, overly simplistic. and in fact, pretty much a naive pollyannic

 

just think about what youre saying for a moment

 

youre telling all the chinese to stop caring about their rich millenniums old culture. youre telling the arabs, the american indians, the africans, to stop caring about where they come from and all those built up legacies bc they just dont matter anymore

 

 

No we're not.

 

Again, you could write paragraphs and paragraphs of BS, you're still wrong.

[Azalin]

 

thats your romantic attachment. most of what you say is true but your spin has a wishful thinking flavor to it

 

the country was even way more white dominated than it is now. more whites than not wanted to maintain the status quo and it was like that for a long time. mlk was indeed a major force loved by many, but certainly it was not the majority at the time. that didnt happen for at least a decade after his assassination, probably longer. believe me, there were many more virulent rednecks like those in my family than there was in the lily white suburbs or whatever magical land you came from. not trying to be snarky, thats just fact

 

and lets nto try to out-mlk eachother, ok? thats just unnecessary and pointless

 

Romantic attachment? Spin? Nope, that's the way it was back in those days, and the fact that we have so much contribution to our culture by African Americans just goes to prove how accepting and accommodating most Americans are; the difference in racial equality between 1963 and 2017 is a reflection of our willingness as a nation to accept each other.

 

This issue is obviously a really big deal to you, and that's fine. You can carry on as you wish, but I'll keep treating everyone with equal respect regardless of what they look like.

[boyst]

The song what did you think I would do at this moment was noticed by a producer of the show that the guy with syndrome that makes him shake was on where he was the smart geeky kid. He heard it by the guy billy what's his name and then thought it would be great for the show years later.

It reached the charts that year

[DC Tom]

 

Romantic attachment? Spin? Nope, that's the way it was back in those days, and the fact that we have so much contribution to our culture by African Americans just goes to prove how accepting and accommodating most Americans are; the difference in racial equality between 1963 and 2017 is a reflection of our willingness as a nation to accept each other.

 

This issue is obviously a really big deal to you, and that's fine. You can carry on as you wish, but I'll keep treating everyone with equal respect regardless of what they look like.

You know who else ignored liberal elites about race and did what he thought was best?