Augie Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 It's not about if he does or not. It's about the belief that he can. Every GM in the NFL believed that guys like Kelly, Marino etc would win a Super Bowl, even if they never had it all come together. Now you've changed the question. It reads "will he win one". I said no, just because the odds are against him. Can he win one? Sure, I think he could if it all fell together properly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gray Beard Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 Does winning the SB imply that he has to be the starting quarterback for most of the season, including the SB? If that is the criteria, then I doubt it. Does being the backup quarterback on a SB winning team count? If that is considered "winning" then it's a crap shoot. Does keeping him imply that he must be the starter, or can he be kept in order to be part of a legitimate quarterback competition (maybe not this year, but in a year or two for sure)? Keeping him with the implication that he must be the starter doesn't seem smart or realistic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 My topics stimulate such thought provoking and lively debates that they are each individually considered a precious gift to the TBD community and as such, they are not subject to the multiple threads on the same topic moderation. Your topics make most of us think that your TSWs version of Skip Baylee's only on a smaller scale while spewing even more hot garbage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 Now you've changed the question. It reads "will he win one". I said no, just because the odds are against him. Can he win one? Sure, I think he could if it all fell together properly.Moving the goalposts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted January 22, 2017 Author Share Posted January 22, 2017 Your topics make most of us think that your TSWs version of Skip Baylee's only on a smaller scale while spewing even more hot garbage Citation needed, home slice. Now you've changed the question. It reads "will he win one". I said no, just because the odds are against him. Can he win one? Sure, I think he could if it all fell together properly. Right.. Do you believe he will win a Super Bowl? That was the original question and that's what I meant. If you don't believe he will, you have to dump him. Does winning the SB imply that he has to be the starting quarterback for most of the season, including the SB? If that is the criteria, then I doubt it. Does being the backup quarterback on a SB winning team count? If that is considered "winning" then it's a crap shoot. Does keeping him imply that he must be the starter, or can he be kept in order to be part of a legitimate quarterback competition (maybe not this year, but in a year or two for sure)? Keeping him with the implication that he must be the starter doesn't seem smart or realistic. Step back and realize that you're wondering if being a backup on a Super Bowl winning team counts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 Citation needed, home slice. Right.. Do you believe he will win a Super Bowl? That was the original question and that's what I meant. If you don't believe he will, you have to dump him. Then you have to dump Rivers, Palmer, Stafford, Cousins, and a whole bunch of other guys. TT is more likely to win than Palmer or Rivers for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 Yet his contract only counts 16 million against the cap. The only number that really matters. I believe around the 20th highest QB salary in 2017. I think he's worth it. That's it's the only number that matters is a bit asinine- it also would tie him to our cap for 3 years. That 3 is an important number too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted January 22, 2017 Author Share Posted January 22, 2017 (edited) Then you have to dump Rivers, Palmer, Stafford, Cousins, and a whole bunch of other guys. TT is more likely to win than Palmer or Rivers for sure. Haha no. Stafford dude. Are you kidding? Call up Detroit and offer TT for Stafford. You'll get laughed at. Edited January 22, 2017 by FireChan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 Depends on his blood sugar levels tbh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 7 votes for yes. Puff puff pass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Hammersticks Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 That's it's the only number that matters is a bit asinine- it also would tie him to our cap for 3 years. That 3 is an important number too. If you believe, as I do, that he is the best (and more importantly most realistic) option out there, then the 16-17 million cap hit per year for two more season is a good gamble. I'd feel better rolling with Tyrod than any of the 2017 rookies, and I don't see any better options in FA. JMHO. 7 votes for yes. Puff puff pass. Mortgage the future for Mitch? 😆😳 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 (edited) Haha no. Stafford dude. Are you kidding? Call up Detroit and offer TT for Stafford. You'll get laughed at."Will he win a Super Bowl?" You said dump them if not. I think Stafford is really good but it's not likely that he will win a Super Bowl. I'm just using your criteria.... Do you see why it's a stupid thread? You can't use "can" and "will" interchangeably because they mean two different things. If you want to troll do it right. Edited January 22, 2017 by Kirby Jackson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gray Beard Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 Step back and realize that you're wondering if being a backup on a Super Bowl winning team counts. I was trying to point out that the poll was vague enough to allow multiple interpretations. By saying "win a SB" I assume he meant as a starter. If he is trying to imply that TT has not yet displayed a skill set comparable to the four QBs who are playing today, then I agree. I was also trying to weigh in on the "Dump Tyrod" argument. I realize he is due for a big payday that would be a bad cap hit, but until a better QB is identified he probably should be kept. And his cap hit is not out of line with other "average" QBs. I believe he should be kept, and within a year or two a legitimate QB competition can occur. In the meantime, if the new coaches are any good this team should be able to back into a wild card game, which isn't great but it is a step in the right direction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted January 22, 2017 Author Share Posted January 22, 2017 (edited) "Will he win a Super Bowl?" You said dump them if not. I think Stafford is really good but it's not likely that he will win a Super Bowl. I'm just using your criteria.... Do you see why it's a stupid thread? You can't use "can" and "will" interchangeably because they mean two different things. If you want to troll do it right. I wasn't using them interchangeably. You're bringing it to an absurd conclusion. It's unlikely that any QB will win a Super Bowl, so dump them all? That's disingenuous. You either believe he will bring a trophy home for your team or won't. We believed JK would. The Colts/Broncos believed Peyton would. Edited January 22, 2017 by FireChan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
/dev/null Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 You do realize Tyrod already has a Super Bowl ring? I'm just sayin... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 .I didn't have to think too hard about the 1st question. Answered No. is there a chance that he opens it up and starts letting it rip again? Yes. If he can learn to be more comfortable trusting his WRs and throwing the ball without being so scared, I believe he can win a sb with the right supporting cast. More importantly a great D. That being said, I don't think that's going to happen. 2nd question is tough. Real tough. The only reason it's tough is because I love the Bills and the season so much, I don't want to live through another 2-3 win season. It's painful and I love getting fired up every Sunday. Tyrod gives us the best chance of being competitive next season. So in that respect I want him to remain a Bill. I really like the kid and would love for him to be the guy I don't think he will ever be. But as a life long Bills fan of 42 years, there's nothing in this world I want more than a Bills Super Bowl. I want to be alive to see it. The easiest route from our current is to cut tyrod and get rid of his contract. That's money we can use on building blocks for the SB run. The best way to acquire a franchise qb is via the draft. If there's someone in this draft they think can eventually lead us to the SB, draft him. If we land that guy, rebuilding begins this season. If there isn't a qb we like early, wait and maybe roll the dice on a QB late in the draft and see if he can at least impress. Sign a retread qb and embrace the tank. I hate to be that guy, but it's worth 1 season of sucking to get the right qb. We can't take the approach (we're wasting shady and Sammy). We're wasting shady and Sammy with tyrod as our QB if he can't lead us to th a title. Making the playoffs can't be our goal. Winning a super bowl must be. If Darnold or Rosen declare I'd take either one in a heartbeat. Josh Allen, jake browning, mason rudolph all have to improve, but have potential to be a franchise guy. See how they do next year. We don't know if any of these guys will develop into our savior, but we'll never know unless we try. We tried with tyrod. Injuries cripples his WR unit but I just don't see what equates to a championship qb in Tyrod Taylor. If we keep him, I'll root for him, attend many games and hope that we can transform into a contender. I will always Billieve. I just think the most competent route to a SB is getting a QB in the draft and give him what he needs to succeed. Having a great qb on a rookie contract allows the team to spend money elsewhere hence we have more resources to work with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 (edited) I wasn't using them interchangeably. You're bringing it to an absurd conclusion. It's unlikely that any QB will win a Super Bowl, so dump them all? That's disingenuous. You either believe he will bring a trophy home for your team or won't. We believed JK would. The Colts/Broncos believed Peyton would. I don't believe that Rivers or Palmer "will" (or Stafford for that matter). Can they? Of course they can!! Take Rivers as the example though. He probably has 3 years (maybe) left with a bad Chargers team. You have him in the "can" category but ask if Tyrod "will." They mean 2 different things. If you asked "can Tyrod" that is a different question than "will Tyrod." Are you following? To take it a step further "will he?" He already did. Edited January 22, 2017 by Kirby Jackson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted January 22, 2017 Author Share Posted January 22, 2017 I don't believe that Rivers or Palmer "will" (or Stafford for that matter). Can they? Of course they can!! Take Rivers as the example though. He probably has 3 years (maybe) left with a bad Chargers team. You have him in the "can" category but ask if Tyrod "will." They mean 2 different things. If you asked "can Tyrod" that is a different question than "will Tyrod." Are you following? Okay, I guess I wasn't clear in my criteria or my list. Obviously those older guys with years in the league have less chance than they did earlier in their career. No doubt. I was using them as a more abstract example. Take Phil Rivers. When SD extended/re-signed him, they had to ask themselves, "Is this the guy who will win us a Super Bowl?" And to me, that answer was yes, and so they had to keep him. I'm not making a comparison between Rivers today and Palmer today versus Tyrod today. I'm talking careers. When those guys in my list hit their contract negotiations, they were unequivocally believed as the "guys" who would win their team a Super Bowl. TT is not there. And that's why you have to let him go. Also that list is the "will" list. Not the "can" list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 Okay, I guess I wasn't clear in my criteria or my list. Obviously those older guys with years in the league have less chance than they did earlier in their career. No doubt. I was using them as a more abstract example. Take Phil Rivers. When SD extended/re-signed him, they had to ask themselves, "Is this the guy who will win us a Super Bowl?" And to me, that answer was yes, and so they had to keep him. I'm not making a comparison between Rivers today and Palmer today versus Tyrod today. I'm talking careers. When those guys in my list hit their contract negotiations, they were unequivocally believed as the "guys" who would win their team a Super Bowl. TT is not there. And that's why you have to let him go. Also that list is the "will" list. Not the "can" list. So you have 22 guys on the "will" list even though only 7 active guys have won one? I guess that if you excluded the 7 that have won, you would only need the 15 other guys to each win one in the next 15 years to be right. I guess it starts with Matt Ryan... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted January 22, 2017 Share Posted January 22, 2017 10 out of 27 people think tyrod is going to win a super bowl? I don't understand. CAN he? If he's the QB with an all time type defense and great weapons on O? He might be able to do that. WILL he? Only if he gets himself into that situation IMO. Considering there's a job out there right now that could put him in that situation (Denver), I'd say the chances he WILL win a SB are slightly better than slim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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