SoCal Deek Posted August 16, 2019 Posted August 16, 2019 10 hours ago, ShadyBillsFan said: The magic wand MAGA.... America first ... I'm still waiting There’s your problem. Stop waiting and get to work!
Tiberius Posted August 16, 2019 Posted August 16, 2019 3 hours ago, GG said: My names is GG and I approve this message. Neither Rome nor Athens had a bond market there buddy. Florence did have a bond market but it was not the reason they fell from grace at all.
TPS Posted August 16, 2019 Posted August 16, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, GG said: My names is GG and I approve this message. The guy seems a bit confused. He thinks the loss of reserve status is related to money printing; it's not. It's related to the decline in economic power. Economic power is what gives rise to military/political power which is used to push its currency on the world. The decline of the US started in the late 1970s as US corps began to outsource production, and was hastened by the rise of LBOs in the 1980s and private equity over the past 20 years, both of which focus on short term profits, buying and breaking up firms for a quick buck. The decline in the economic base goes along with the decline of the middle class and stagnant wages, with Walmart now the largest private sector employer. The loss of those good jobs reduces the tax base in the middle, and with the significant rise in inequality, those at the top pay most of the taxes. However, they have pushed your favored supply side economics in order to cut their taxes, so deficits have gotten bigger every time supply side tax cuts are passed. Deficits are compounded on the spending side as the MIC gets their share by pushing endless conflict, and the day of reckoning is coming because government can't both provide the resources to maintain the war machine and provide the promises to my generation. However, the constraint is NOT about money, rather it's a real resource constraint. Will we have enough productive capacity (labor and machinery) to meet the demand for both the military goods AND the consumption goods driven by the SS payments to retirees (not to mention all of the claims on goods and services by the rest of the private sector!)? No. The government could simply "appropriate additional funds" and fill the future SS gap, but that would lead to too many claims on the available resources--inflation, which is the ultimate constraint on fiscal policy. So woe is us, it's all MMT's fault (not), even though most of you never heard of it until this year (thanks AOC!). The reality is the decline of the US began a long time ago, and just as the rising economic power of the US took over from the declining economic power of the UK, so too will the rising economic power China usurp the declining economic power of US. The US will lose its reserve currency status, but it won't be MMT's fault..... Edited August 16, 2019 by TPS
3rdnlng Posted August 16, 2019 Posted August 16, 2019 1 hour ago, mead107 said: Buy Meadcoins Did you delete your WTF have the dems done in the last 2 1/2 years thread? We in the know, want to know. 1
mead107 Posted August 16, 2019 Posted August 16, 2019 13 minutes ago, 3rdnlng said: Did you delete your WTF have the dems done in the last 2 1/2 years thread? We in the know, want to know. Yes
3rdnlng Posted August 16, 2019 Posted August 16, 2019 1 minute ago, mead107 said: Yes Who the f do you think you are, Gleeful Gator? 1
mead107 Posted August 16, 2019 Posted August 16, 2019 Almost time for the wtf have the democrats done in 3 years. Or what are there states and cities like. Not doing a very good job.
Buffalo_Gal Posted August 16, 2019 Posted August 16, 2019 Just now, mead107 said: Almost time for the wtf have the democrats done in 3 years. Or what are there states and cities like. Not doing a very good job. You could have just updated the title. 2
3rdnlng Posted August 16, 2019 Posted August 16, 2019 13 minutes ago, mead107 said: Almost time for the wtf have the democrats done in 3 years. Or what are there states and cities like. Not doing a very good job. I know 2 people that are totally behind you and can guess that other than a few asswipes everyone supports you. WTF, you're already retired with a fixed pension. Give em Hell.
Doc Brown Posted August 16, 2019 Posted August 16, 2019 (edited) 14 hours ago, TH3 said: "I can walk down Fifth Avenue and shoot someone....and my supporters will still love me" This cult of personality sentiment was and is still true of "Obamaites" as well. Both groups will defend them unconditionally and are motivated by allegiance to them above their policies or party. Luckily, the 22nd amendment was passed when it was. Edited August 16, 2019 by Doc Brown 1
Foxx Posted August 16, 2019 Posted August 16, 2019 7 hours ago, mead107 said: Yes why in the bloody hell would you do something like that? do you know how much posterity you simply flushed?
/dev/null Posted August 16, 2019 Posted August 16, 2019 5 hours ago, Doc Brown said: This cult of personality sentiment was and is still true of "Obamaites" as well. Both groups will defend them unconditionally and are motivated by allegiance to them above their policies or party. Luckily, the 22nd amendment was passed when it was.
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted August 16, 2019 Posted August 16, 2019 more layoffs Cisco Layoffs 2019: 500 Lose Jobs In Engineering At San Jose And Milpitas Lowe’s Layoffs 2019: 12 Things to Know Abou… IBM Layoffs 2019: 12 Things to Know About th… AT&T Layoffs 2019: Job Cuts to Affect Employ…
3rdnlng Posted August 16, 2019 Posted August 16, 2019 Gleeful Shady, it seems like you're doing a little jig here reveling in what you can claim is a sinking economy. Here is what you failed to mention in each of those articles: Cisco is restructuring and may hire those that are laid off in another division Lowe's is outsourcing their assembly operations. No net loss of jobs. IBM may be laying off 1700 of its 340,000 worldwide employees but they may also be picking up 13,000. AT&T article was from 7 months ago. You are a dishonest poster with an agenda. Gleeful Shady seems like a pretty good moniker for you. 3 1
row_33 Posted August 16, 2019 Posted August 16, 2019 Looks like the world won’t be plunging into instant recession and ruin after all. The gleeful doomsayers were wrong again. Oh well, I’m sure the Dow will drop again soon so they can work their BS again without accountability
GG Posted August 16, 2019 Author Posted August 16, 2019 13 hours ago, TPS said: The guy seems a bit confused. He thinks the loss of reserve status is related to money printing; it's not. It's related to the decline in economic power. Economic power is what gives rise to military/political power which is used to push its currency on the world. The decline of the US started in the late 1970s as US corps began to outsource production, and was hastened by the rise of LBOs in the 1980s and private equity over the past 20 years, both of which focus on short term profits, buying and breaking up firms for a quick buck. The decline in the economic base goes along with the decline of the middle class and stagnant wages, with Walmart now the largest private sector employer. The loss of those good jobs reduces the tax base in the middle, and with the significant rise in inequality, those at the top pay most of the taxes. However, they have pushed your favored supply side economics in order to cut their taxes, so deficits have gotten bigger every time supply side tax cuts are passed. Deficits are compounded on the spending side as the MIC gets their share by pushing endless conflict, and the day of reckoning is coming because government can't both provide the resources to maintain the war machine and provide the promises to my generation. However, the constraint is NOT about money, rather it's a real resource constraint. Will we have enough productive capacity (labor and machinery) to meet the demand for both the military goods AND the consumption goods driven by the SS payments to retirees (not to mention all of the claims on goods and services by the rest of the private sector!)? No. The government could simply "appropriate additional funds" and fill the future SS gap, but that would lead to too many claims on the available resources--inflation, which is the ultimate constraint on fiscal policy. So woe is us, it's all MMT's fault (not), even though most of you never heard of it until this year (thanks AOC!). The reality is the decline of the US began a long time ago, and just as the rising economic power of the US took over from the declining economic power of the UK, so too will the rising economic power China usurp the declining economic power of US. The US will lose its reserve currency status, but it won't be MMT's fault..... I think you have to revisit your cause and effect arguments in this thread. Trennert (and I) are not claiming that MMT will be the cause of the US losing its economic supremacy. We're saying that people shouldn't treat MMT as a free lunch, because it will come back to bite IF the US starts to lose its supremacy. Let's go back to the original question that prompted the voluminous responses. The question was basic, why didn't QE cause inflation when the move is fundamentally inflationary? The answer was simple - because the timing of the move was in the aftermath of a major recession and the markets knew that the strength of the US economy could easily withstand the infusion of liquidity. It had nothing to do with Fed's accounting treatment of how QE was deployed into the markets. Then the discussion turned to whether QE is sustainable over a long term, and that's where the warnings should sit. MMT is not pain free and works only when a country's currency and debt are used as a reference benchmark. That's why as a theory is doesn't work, because the cause and effect are reversed. It's economic baloney talk that frames private economic activity as driven by government actions, as opposed to government's finances driven by private markets' behavior. Until you recognize the correct order of economic activity that funds government coffers with real currency (whether in fiat cash or tangible assets) then this discussion will go nowhere. It's the perverse logic of economists' misunderstanding of the private economy's contribution that leads a politician to stand in front of an entrepreneur who built his business with his bare hands and tell him that he's not the one who built that business.
Tiberius Posted August 16, 2019 Posted August 16, 2019 11 hours ago, Doc Brown said: This cult of personality sentiment was and is still true of "Obamaites" as well. Both groups will defend them unconditionally and are motivated by allegiance to them above their policies or party. Luckily, the 22nd amendment was passed when it was. Obama's popularity was based upon competence, integrity and decency. None of those things apply to Trump. Trump's ignorance, cruelty and incompetence seem to be his endearing factors. 1
Gary M Posted August 16, 2019 Posted August 16, 2019 13 hours ago, mead107 said: Almost time for the wtf have the democrats done in 3 years. Or what are there states and cities like. Not doing a very good job. better title "what will the dems do for the next 5 years"? 1 1
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