Nanker Posted March 19, 2019 Posted March 19, 2019 2 hours ago, Chef Jim said: Sorry didn't read it. I've only read War of the Worlds. Very few give Wells the credit he deserves for writing about things that were not invented long after he was gone. Dude had a hell of an imagination. The Civil War could have that affect on people.
KRC Posted March 19, 2019 Posted March 19, 2019 3 minutes ago, Chef Jim said: Oh no I'm talking about able bodied American citizens who used to do this labor. We are making it more attractive to sit on your ass and collect a government check. "Free" stuff...
GG Posted March 19, 2019 Author Posted March 19, 2019 4 minutes ago, Chef Jim said: Oh no I'm talking about able bodied American citizens who used to do this labor. They never really existed either. It was either family farms, and nobody has 10 kids anymore to help on the farm. The large farm owners always relied on migrant workers - whether American or recent immigrants. There's no such thing as an American migrant worker anymore.
Chef Jim Posted March 19, 2019 Posted March 19, 2019 (edited) 13 minutes ago, GG said: They never really existed either. It was either family farms, and nobody has 10 kids anymore to help on the farm. The large farm owners always relied on migrant workers - whether American or recent immigrants. There's no such thing as an American migrant worker anymore. Again because it's a two fold problem. They don't have to work due to public handouts and they've been replaced by cheaper and harder working workforce. And farms have consolidated into these mega farms. It blows me away the size of the cow barns/milking parlors these days when I visit. I guess that makes it three fold. Edited March 19, 2019 by Chef Jim
3rdnlng Posted March 19, 2019 Posted March 19, 2019 30 minutes ago, GG said: They never really existed either. It was either family farms, and nobody has 10 kids anymore to help on the farm. The large farm owners always relied on migrant workers - whether American or recent immigrants. There's no such thing as an American migrant worker anymore. It used to be that migrants (mainly Puerto Rican) would move their way north throughout the harvest seasons and pick tomatoes and grapes or work in the food processing plants and then end up picking apples. I remember a camp (actually what I think was an old monastery) near Cassadaga, NY where they were housed. A priest looked after them and acted as a labor supplier. Being from Puerto Rico they of course were legal and things seemed to run pretty smoothly. I suppose it might have or is different in places like the San Joaquin Valley.
GG Posted March 19, 2019 Author Posted March 19, 2019 20 minutes ago, 3rdnlng said: It used to be that migrants (mainly Puerto Rican) would move their way north throughout the harvest seasons and pick tomatoes and grapes or work in the food processing plants and then end up picking apples. I remember a camp (actually what I think was an old monastery) near Cassadaga, NY where they were housed. A priest looked after them and acted as a labor supplier. Being from Puerto Rico they of course were legal and things seemed to run pretty smoothly. I suppose it might have or is different in places like the San Joaquin Valley. No different in Cali. Always relied on the Mexican migrants. Even had a temporary legal program in place for part time workers. That's why every GOP congressman who voted down immigration reform in 2007 should burn in hell 1
3rdnlng Posted March 19, 2019 Posted March 19, 2019 5 minutes ago, GG said: No different in Cali. Always relied on the Mexican migrants. Even had a temporary legal program in place for part time workers. That's why every GOP congressman who voted down immigration reform in 2007 should burn in hell I don't think it's that simple. After the Reagan amnesty we never got the secure border that was promised. 2007 was a "fool me once" moment and the right has been smarting over the former amnesty enough that a fence is going to have to come first.
GG Posted March 19, 2019 Author Posted March 19, 2019 3 minutes ago, 3rdnlng said: I don't think it's that simple. After the Reagan amnesty we never got the secure border that was promised. 2007 was a "fool me once" moment and the right has been smarting over the former amnesty enough that a fence is going to have to come first. Yeah, and 12 years later that grandstanding has certainly worked, hasn't it? The GOP got played by a hard core fringe and will continue to be on defensive. The 2007 reform was a decent move. The wall is nothing but a symbol.
row_33 Posted March 19, 2019 Posted March 19, 2019 10 minutes ago, GG said: Yeah, and 12 years later that grandstanding has certainly worked, hasn't it? The GOP got played by a hard core fringe and will continue to be on defensive. The 2007 reform was a decent move. The wall is nothing but a symbol. do you use this brain when you drive your car?
GG Posted March 19, 2019 Author Posted March 19, 2019 Just now, row_33 said: do you use this brain when you drive your car? No I have a lackey Canadian do the menial thinking.
3rdnlng Posted March 19, 2019 Posted March 19, 2019 Just now, GG said: Yeah, and 12 years later that grandstanding has certainly worked, hasn't it? The GOP got played by a hard core fringe and will continue to be on defensive. The 2007 reform was a decent move. The wall is nothing but a symbol. The wall is more of a traffic cop and the Border Patrol is all for it. They oughta know.
GG Posted March 19, 2019 Author Posted March 19, 2019 1 minute ago, 3rdnlng said: The wall is more of a traffic cop and the Border Patrol is all for it. They oughta know. So in summary, GOP didn't get the wall, didn't stop the flow of new illegals and didn't deport the 11 million illegals already here. But they did ensure that a large majority of the 15% of population of the US with higher birth ratea5 never votes for GOP. Sheer political brilliance.
row_33 Posted March 19, 2019 Posted March 19, 2019 just pre-approved for another credit card, I will decline the offer but nice to know this is back again in the Trump Economy
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted March 19, 2019 Posted March 19, 2019 19 minutes ago, GG said: So in summary, GOP didn't get the wall, didn't stop the flow of new illegals and didn't deport the 11 million illegals already here. But they did ensure that a large majority of the 15% of population of the US with higher birth ratea5 never votes for GOP. Sheer political brilliance. How'd that prior amnesty work out for voting GOP? That's ridiculous logic.
GG Posted March 19, 2019 Author Posted March 19, 2019 23 minutes ago, Joe in Winslow said: How'd that prior amnesty work out for voting GOP? That's ridiculous logic. Because 2007 wasn't pure amnesty. But carry on sweeping the problem under the rug and act surprised when thousands more storm the border.
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted March 19, 2019 Posted March 19, 2019 Just now, GG said: Because 2007 wasn't pure amnesty. But carry on sweeping the problem under the rug and act surprised when thousands more storm the border. I was speaking of Reagan's amnesty. Solution to the problem is to step up enforcement with draconian fines on farmers and businesses that hire illegals and deport any and all Illegals found. It will take time but if you punish the law breaking businesses it will stop. 1
GG Posted March 20, 2019 Author Posted March 20, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, Joe in Winslow said: I was speaking of Reagan's amnesty. Solution to the problem is to step up enforcement with draconian fines on farmers and businesses that hire illegals and deport any and all Illegals found. It will take time but if you punish the law breaking businesses it will stop. You were talking about Reagan amnesty and I was talking about Bush's proposal for legal and lengthy process for people who are already here and would not be deported in any case. Do you ever take more than a second to come up with an answer without looking at the whole picture? The main reason the illegals are drawn to the US is purely because there's a huge mismatch between labor demand and supply. There aren't enough Americans who are willing or able to do the work that's supplied by the foreign workforce. Everybody who's put in 10 seconds of real research instead of listening to the moron Ann Coulters of this world recognize that is the problem. And the solution isn't to punish businesses who hire these workers but to change the ***** laws that encourage legal migration, with more incentives to temporary workers. You're one of the idiots who's the first to complain about the evils of mandating a $15/hr minimum wage and then in the next breath you're supporting cutting off a major source of supply of low skilled labor. What do you think will happen to businesses that rely on that labor pool? Do you think they'll be able to immediately fill those jobs or will they immediately go out of business? Stop listening to morons who haven't a clue and try to understand the whole picture. There's a huge imbalance of labor supply and demand. The immigration quotas haven't been updated in decades despite big economic growth. US policies also encouraged destabilization of Central American countries, where ordinary citizens are starving or are robbed. What the hell do you think will happen in that situation? And your only solution to that is to build a ***** wall? Seriously? All of this was discussed and the outcome predicted to a tee in 2007. And like the moron socialists on the other side you continue to believe that all you need now is a ***** bigger wall. Edited March 20, 2019 by GG
3rdnlng Posted March 20, 2019 Posted March 20, 2019 20 minutes ago, GG said: You were talking about Reagan amnesty and I was talking about Bush's proposal for legal and lengthy process for people who are already here and would not be deported in any case. Do you ever take more than a second to come up with an answer without looking at the whole picture? The main reason the illegals are drawn to the US is purely because there's a huge mismatch between labor demand and supply. There aren't enough Americans who are willing or able to do the work that's supplied by the foreign workforce. Everybody who's put in 10 seconds of real research instead of listening to the moron Ann Coulters of this world recognize that is the problem. And the solution isn't to punish businesses who hire these workers but to change the ***** laws that encourage legal migration, with more incentives to temporary workers. You're one of the idiots who's the first to complain about the evils of mandating a $15/hr minimum wage and then in the next breath you're supporting cutting off a major source of supply of low skilled labor. What do you think will happen to businesses that rely on that labor pool? Do you think they'll be able to immediately fill those jobs or will they immediately go out of business? Stop listening to morons who haven't a clue and try to understand the whole picture. There's a huge imbalance of labor supply and demand. The immigration quotas haven't been updated in decades despite big economic growth. US policies also encouraged destabilization of Central American countries, where ordinary citizens are starving or are robbed. What the hell do you think will happen in that situation? And your only solution to that is to build a ***** wall? Seriously? All of this was discussed and the outcome predicted to a tee in 2007. And like the moron socialists on the other side you continue to believe that all you need now is a ***** bigger wall. My reason for supporting a wall is that it would funnel illegals and traffickers in both people and drugs to ports of entry. I'm all for fixing the immigration problem by giving out work visas while allowing people to get in line for citizenship. I want these people vetted though.
GG Posted March 20, 2019 Author Posted March 20, 2019 2 minutes ago, 3rdnlng said: My reason for supporting a wall is that it would funnel illegals and traffickers in both people and drugs to ports of entry. I'm all for fixing the immigration problem by giving out work visas while allowing people to get in line for citizenship. I want these people vetted though. That's why it's not an either or situation. Comprehensive immigration reform needs to happen and then you can leave border patrol and law enforcement tackling the serious issues. A wall without reforming the laws in the end will be a stupid and futile gesture
3rdnlng Posted March 20, 2019 Posted March 20, 2019 8 minutes ago, GG said: That's why it's not an either or situation. Comprehensive immigration reform needs to happen and then you can leave border patrol and law enforcement tackling the serious issues. A wall without reforming the laws in the end will be a stupid and futile gesture I agree completely, but changing the laws without securing our borders is folly.
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