The Trump Economy

[3rdnlng]

6 minutes ago, Koko78 said:

 

I can't. I heard it over the telegraph.

Next time, try this:

[Koko78]

13 minutes ago, 3rdnlng said:

Next time, try this:

 

I checked with the Pony Express office, here you go:

 

[boyst]

On 1/10/2019 at 3:08 PM, Koko78 said:

 

I checked with the Pony Express office, here you go:

 

Never has @TakeYouToTaskerbeen so moist. 

[row_33]

where did that bear go?

 

[3rdnlng]

29 minutes ago, row_33 said:

where did that bear go?

 

It's a chameleon and turned into a bull.

[TPS]

@GG and I recently argued about monopolies. Here is a review of a book (I've ordered) on the issue Suggesting it is THE defining problem of our age. 

The Myth of Capitalism 

https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2019/01/seeking-cure-new-gilded-age-total-corporate-domination-everything.html

 

there is no such thing as a "free market" when economic power is so concentrated.

[GG]

35 minutes ago, TPS said:

@GG and I recently argued about monopolies. Here is a review of a book (I've ordered) on the issue Suggesting it is THE defining problem of our age. 

The Myth of Capitalism 

https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2019/01/seeking-cure-new-gilded-age-total-corporate-domination-everything.html

 

there is no such thing as a "free market" when economic power is so concentrated.

 

Simple question. 

 

Does an average person benefit more from buying everything they want at lower prices from Amazon, Walmart, etc. or going to multiple websites to fill out the shopping cart and paying a lot more in the process? 

[TakeYouToTasker]

1 hour ago, TPS said:

@GG and I recently argued about monopolies. Here is a review of a book (I've ordered) on the issue Suggesting it is THE defining problem of our age. 

The Myth of Capitalism 

https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2019/01/seeking-cure-new-gilded-age-total-corporate-domination-everything.html

 

there is no such thing as a "free market" when economic power is so concentrated.

 

The defining problem of our age is laid bare in The Bell Curve, by Charles Murray.

 

To your point:  we don't live in a free market, or capitalist if you prefer, society.  Our economy is structured to be neo-mercantilist and empower duopoly.  Capitalist societies only exist where economic advantage is not encoded into law which can be purchased by businesses or industries. 

[plenzmd1]

2 hours ago, GG said:

 

Simple question. 

 

Does an average person benefit more from buying everything they want at lower prices from Amazon, Walmart, etc. or going to multiple websites to fill out the shopping cart and paying a lot more in the process? 

Interesting question, and one in say in the short term..yes one does benefit. The larger question becomes once competition has been forced out of the market, do long term prices rise above what one would see in a competitive market and hence wipe out the short term gain

55 minutes ago, TakeYouToTasker said:

 

The defining problem of our age is laid bare in The Bell Curve, by Charles Murray.

 

To your point:  we don't live in a free market, or capitalist if you prefer, society.  Our economy is structured to be neo-mercantilist and empower duopoly.  Capitalist societies only exist where economic advantage is not encoded into law which can be purchased by businesses or industries. 

I am not quite sure I understand your point..can you make a little simpler? Not saying that sarcastically, these last few posts are interesting as hell to me 

[3rdnlng]

28 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

Interesting question, and one in say in the short term..yes one does benefit. The larger question becomes once competition has been forced out of the market, do long term prices rise above what one would see in a competitive market and hence wipe out the short term gain

I am not quite sure I understand your point..can you make a little simpler? Not saying that sarcastically, these last few posts are interesting as hell to me 

Some other company will always come along to knock them off their perch.

[TakeYouToTasker]

43 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

I am not quite sure I understand your point..can you make a little simpler? Not saying that sarcastically, these last few posts are interesting as hell to me 

 

We do not have a capitalist economy.  We have a mixed economy in which laws are written for the benefit of certain industries or companies, to the detriment of other industries or companies (legislating winners and losers).  Much of this is in the form of regulations which create barriers to new market entry, which stifles competition.

[GG]

44 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

Interesting question, and one in say in the short term..yes one does benefit. The larger question becomes once competition has been forced out of the market, do long term prices rise above what one would see in a competitive market and hence wipe out the short term gain

I am not quite sure I understand your point..can you make a little simpler? Not saying that sarcastically, these last few posts are interesting as hell to me 

 

That's why the US has historically been very effective when the feds went anti-trust violations that affected consumers.  In the last generation, the focus switched to deemed harm to competitors, without a clear tie in whether consumers have been harmed.  It's the difference between the US model and the European model.    This shift in enforcement aids the environment that Tasker refers to, because increased focus on companies' behaviors and added regulations tend to benefit larger corporations who can afford the exorbitant cost of compliance.    It's also why the thesis proposed by TPS's book reference is full of crap.

[plenzmd1]

11 minutes ago, 3rdnlng said:

Some other company will always come along to knock them off their perch.

Hmm, not so sure of that, and a little simplistic. Barriers to entry at the scale of an Amazon or Walmart are massive,it  is not realistic to think another organization could throw the necessary investment to compete

[DC Tom]

3 hours ago, GG said:

 

Simple question. 

 

Does an average person benefit more from buying everything they want at lower prices from Amazon, Walmart, etc. or going to multiple websites to fill out the shopping cart and paying a lot more in the process? 

 

Wrong question.  What you really mean to ask is "Does the benefit to the consumer of lower prices due to the economy of scale in Amazon's, Walmart's, etc's business models outweigh the barriers to innovation and market entry that those economies of scale also create?"

 

 

[3rdnlng]

3 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

Hmm, not so sure of that, and a little simplistic. Barriers to entry at the scale of an Amazon or Walmart are massive,it  is not realistic to think another organization could throw the necessary investment to compete

That Sears & Roebuck is just too big to compete with.

[plenzmd1]

Just now, 3rdnlng said:

That Sears & Roebuck is just too big to compete with.

Sears never controlled the retail market the same Amazon and Walmart do today..but you are correct another unforeseen technology could come along and disrupt retailing again the way the internet has done to B&M.

[Deranged Rhino]

1 minute ago, plenzmd1 said:

Sears never controlled the retail market the same Amazon and Walmart do today..but you are correct another unforeseen technology could come along and disrupt retailing again the way the internet has done to B&M.

 

Hoping it'll be replicators. 

 

[TakeYouToTasker]

4 minutes ago, Deranged Rhino said:

 

Hoping it'll be replicators. 

 

 

We'd have to completely rethink copyright and patent laws.

[/dev/null]

2 minutes ago, TakeYouToTasker said:

 

We'd have to completely rethink copyright and patent laws.

What if you used a replicator time replicate a hammer.  Who owns the hammer and anything you use to build with it

 

Or what If you replicate a hammer to build another replicator to build another hammer?

[Deranged Rhino]

1 minute ago, TakeYouToTasker said:

 

We'd have to completely rethink copyright and patent laws.

 

I don't mean to slide what has been a really interesting conversation the past few pages, but I hadn't really thought of the impact of this tech beyond "that would be cool"... but I would imagine if it ever were to become a reality it would completely and permanently alter everything about our economic system... or, I guess, whichever company manufactures the replicator machines would become the new Amazon/last mega corp left standing.