GG Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 16 hours ago, TPS said: @Deranged Rhino you should enjoy this piece by Escobar: http://www.atimes.com/article/heres-the-real-reason-the-us-must-talk-to-russia/ In trying to make sense of the article, what would you consider a source who was a highly placed USSR military officer, but is now an "independent" Russia consultant based in the US, who somehow still has deep insight into Russian military capabilities? And is writing freely about it? The contention that Russian navy was catching up the US in the '70s, is laughable to anyone who stepped foot on a Russian naval vessel in the '80s & '90s. Finally, in one breath, the article scolds the US military apparatus for foisting the Russian scare to drum up military spending only to warn that Russians are now much more advanced than the US in the latest technologies.
Nanker Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 They made good subs. Well, except for the reactor parts.
DC Tom Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 1 hour ago, Nanker said: They made good subs. Well, except for the reactor parts. They didn't make good subs until Walker gave them the technology. 1
3rdnlng Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 4 minutes ago, DC Tom said: They didn't make good subs until Walker gave them the technology. What about Red October?
TPS Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 2 hours ago, GG said: In trying to make sense of the article, what would you consider a source who was a highly placed USSR military officer, but is now an "independent" Russia consultant based in the US, who somehow still has deep insight into Russian military capabilities? And is writing freely about it? A member of Trump's national security team? The contention that Russian navy was catching up the US in the '70s, is laughable to anyone who stepped foot on a Russian naval vessel in the '80s & '90s. Finally, in one breath, the article scolds the US military apparatus for foisting the Russian scare to drum up military spending only to warn that Russians are now much more advanced than the US in the latest technologies. I understood Escobar's main point as the elites mistakenly want to isolate Russia as a foe, which of course helps the funding stream; however, by doing so it pushes Russia into an alliance with China, which is the real threat to the future superiority of the US. But let's argue about a minor statement related to the technology gap 50 years ago....
GG Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 1 hour ago, TPS said: I understood Escobar's main point as the elites mistakenly want to isolate Russia as a foe, which of course helps the funding stream; however, by doing so it pushes Russia into an alliance with China, which is the real threat to the future superiority of the US. But let's argue about a minor statement related to the technology gap 50 years ago.... That minor statement is emblematic of the wide misses in the entire article. I can make the argument that the whole reason that US "allowed" Russia to catch up is that because over the last 20 yrs, the US military has been preoccupied with rebuilding itself to combat Chinese and asymmetric terrorist threats.
DC Tom Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 17 minutes ago, GG said: That minor statement is emblematic of the wide misses in the entire article. I can make the argument that the whole reason that US "allowed" Russia to catch up is that because over the last 20 yrs, the US military has been preoccupied with rebuilding itself to combat Chinese and asymmetric terrorist threats. It's more that the US military hasn't been rebuilding itself. It's been preoccupied with trying, but the strategic and operational direction keeps swerving all over the place since the "peace dividend." Ballistic missile defense, carrier warfare, and precision bombing is basically the only consistency in defense policy. Everything else is a hash.
GG Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 20 minutes ago, DC Tom said: It's more that the US military hasn't been rebuilding itself. It's been preoccupied with trying, but the strategic and operational direction keeps swerving all over the place since the "peace dividend." Ballistic missile defense, carrier warfare, and precision bombing is basically the only consistency in defense policy. Everything else is a hash. I'll defer to you on that. But everyone always overstates the role that the military industrial complex plays in the DOD budget. At the end of the day it's a massive pork barrel program for each Senator's hom state, with most of the costs having nothing to do with defense contractors, but with keeping the bases open.
DC Tom Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 39 minutes ago, GG said: I'll defer to you on that. But everyone always overstates the role that the military industrial complex plays in the DOD budget. At the end of the day it's a massive pork barrel program for each Senator's hom state, with most of the costs having nothing to do with defense contractors, but with keeping the bases open. Actually, the biggest part of the defense budget, by far, is HR costs. Recruitment, training, pay, pensions, health care. Depending on the budget request you read, anywhere from 20-50% of the DoD budget. (Biggest source of the disparity is that sometimes things like recruitment and training falls under Operations and Maintenance line items, sometimes Personnel, depending on which document you're reading.) Looking at the 2019 budget request...the requested authorization for "Cooperative Threat Reduction" is less than that for the OIG's office. Both are less than the "Workforce Development Fund." All three combined are less than the total for Environmental restoration. Almost $800M is requested for drug interdiction operations. There is a hell of a lot DoD does that isn't directly related to any sort of primary defense mission, defense contractors, or senate pork.
TPS Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 1 hour ago, GG said: That minor statement is emblematic of the wide misses in the entire article. I can make the argument that the whole reason that US "allowed" Russia to catch up is that because over the last 20 yrs, the US military has been preoccupied with rebuilding itself to combat Chinese and asymmetric terrorist threats. You like to focus on the mundane. Of course, since you view Russia and Putin as evil incarnate, I am sure that you disagree with his main thesis... If the Russia-gate hysterics prevent Trump from normalizing relations with Russia, then Putin has no choice but to ally with China, which would also raise the risk of a major conflict.
Deranged Rhino Posted July 23, 2018 Author Posted July 23, 2018 The five names given immunity are out. Podesta not one of them (though it's not over) https://mobile.twitter.com/Techno_Fog/status/1021473211807088640 1
GG Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 43 minutes ago, TPS said: You like to focus on the mundane. Of course, since you view Russia and Putin as evil incarnate, I am sure that you disagree with his main thesis... If the Russia-gate hysterics prevent Trump from normalizing relations with Russia, then Putin has no choice but to ally with China, which would also raise the risk of a major conflict. I disagree with the main thesis because it's a meandering jumbled mess.
LaDexter Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 1 hour ago, TPS said: You like to focus on the mundane. Of course, since you view Russia and Putin as evil incarnate, I am sure that you disagree with his main thesis... If the Russia-gate hysterics prevent Trump from normalizing relations with Russia, then Putin has no choice but to ally with China, which would also raise the risk of a major conflict. The hypocritical hysteria over Russia has a reason. It isn't that the hacks exposed massive cheating and lying by the Hillary campaign. It is much more about this... http://freedom-articles.toolsforfreedom.com/remembering-israel-911-role/ ""Russian President Putin was getting so tired of Obama’s provocations that he was considering releasing evidence proving once and for all that 9/11 was an inside job"
Taro T Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 1 hour ago, Deranged Rhino said: The five names given immunity are out. Podesta not one of them (though it's not over) https://mobile.twitter.com/Techno_Fog/status/1021473211807088640 How the #### does Brennan get immunity?
njbuff Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 4 minutes ago, Taro T said: How the #### does Brennan get immunity? I don't think it's that scumbag John Brennan. 2
Taro T Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 1 minute ago, njbuff said: I don't think it's that scumbag John Brennan. Gotcha. Thanks. 1
DC Tom Posted July 23, 2018 Posted July 23, 2018 On 7/22/2018 at 4:41 PM, TPS said: @Deranged Rhino you should enjoy this piece by Escobar: http://www.atimes.com/article/heres-the-real-reason-the-us-must-talk-to-russia/ That "piece" is half book review, half propaganda, half wishful thinking. I'll just read the book. Maybe. I'll try...but I have a suspicion it's a mind-numbing slog of a chore. But that article is a pile of garbage.
TPS Posted July 24, 2018 Posted July 24, 2018 11 hours ago, DC Tom said: That "piece" is half book review, half propaganda, half wishful thinking. I'll just read the book. Maybe. I'll try...but I have a suspicion it's a mind-numbing slog of a chore. But that article is a pile of garbage. 11 hours ago, DC Tom said: That "piece" is half book review, half propaganda, half wishful thinking. I'll just read the book. Maybe. I'll try...but I have a suspicion it's a mind-numbing slog of a chore. But that article is a pile of garbage. ?
DC Tom Posted July 24, 2018 Posted July 24, 2018 3 hours ago, TPS said: ? I hate these new emojis. I have no idea what that's supposed to be. Sticking your tongue out? You're eating a strawberry? The Joker put a smile on your face? You have a cold sore? What the !@#$ is that?
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