BuffaloHokie13 Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 I'd say if a QB isn't showing improvement after year 2, dump him. In general. Isn't sophomore slump kind of a thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Isn't sophomore slump kind of a thing? With QB's? Not necessarily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolishDave Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 I hope we sign him for 10 years, he is definitley the answer. All the pretty stats you guys dig up to make your case is interesting. How many times has this guy put the team on his back and won games when needed? Let' s see those fancy stats compared to the other QBs that have taken their teams to the playoffs. I wouldn't rest my case against the Flaco, and Tannenhill group. The Flaco contract has killed that organization, the Same way the Tie Rod contract would put us in cap hell. The Ravens cannot afford to surround him with talent. No it doesn't. His cap hit is 15.9 million next year if the Bills pick up his option. That is not cap hell. Not by any stretch. His dead cap is high for next year, but that only comes into play if you get rid of him right away. If the Bills commit to him they are committing for 3 years. The TT contract wouldnt put us in cap hell. 20ish highest paid QB out of 32 teams is cap hell? What would you consider Dareus? Joe flacco is the 2nd highest paid QB next yr. TT would be exactly at 20. Below Jay cutler. I honestly dont know what people complain or argue about anymore. http://overthecap.com/position/quarterback/2017/ Out of all the guys who want to cut him, not one single person has yet to show how you get improvement at the Qb position once he is cut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 No it doesn't. His cap hit is 15.9 million next year if the Bills pick up his option. That is not cap hell. Not by any stretch. His dead cap is high for next year, but that only comes into play if you get rid of him right away. If the Bills commit to him they are committing for 3 years. Out of all the guys who want to cut him, not one single person has yet to show how you get improvement at the Qb position once he is cut. But a few have admitted they are okay with getting worse (assuming they are correct and the drop off to the replacement isn't a giant cliff). I know I've at least seen GunnerBill take that stance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 But a few have admitted they are okay with getting worse (assuming they are correct and the drop off to the replacement isn't a giant cliff). I know I've at least seen GunnerBill take that stance. But that's not realistic because no one who is actually hired by the organization at present benefits with a decline in record. Only their successors might, and that's a huge open question itself given that teams which bottom out often stay bottomed out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolishDave Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 But a few have admitted they are okay with getting worse (assuming they are correct and the drop off to the replacement isn't a giant cliff). I know I've at least seen GunnerBill take that stance. Well if those guys really want a worse football team, cutting Tyrod has a very high percentage chance of making that happen. Kind of a strange position for a Bills "fan" to take though. Chances of getting similar or better performance out of a rookie is minuscule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobobonators Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 No it doesn't. His cap hit is 15.9 million next year if the Bills pick up his option. That is not cap hell. Not by any stretch. His dead cap is high for next year, but that only comes into play if you get rid of him right away. If the Bills commit to him they are committing for 3 years. Out of all the guys who want to cut him, not one single person has yet to show how you get improvement at the Qb position once he is cut. Exactly. In 29 games started with us, 7200 all purpose yards and 47 TD's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Gun Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 But a few have admitted they are okay with getting worse (assuming they are correct and the drop off to the replacement isn't a giant cliff). I know I've at least seen GunnerBill take that stance. I guess you have a crystal ball and it is a forgone conclusion that a different QB will be worse than Tyrod. Close mind think much! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 I guess you have a crystal ball and it is a forgone conclusion that a different QB will be worse than Tyrod. Close mind think much! First, The post you quoted was regurgitating a paraphrased opinion of another poster, whom I suspect will corroborate or correct me on the stance. Second, have you seen the QB options available this offseason? It's a pretty easy guess to say letting go of Tyrod will mean a dip in offensive production next year. The question being debated is simply how much will it dip and how much of a dip is acceptable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtDart Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 (edited) The TT contract wouldnt put us in cap hell. 20ish highest paid QB out of 32 teams is cap hell? What would you consider Dareus? Joe flacco is the 2nd highest paid QB next yr. TT would be exactly at 20. Below Jay cutler. I honestly dont know what people complain or argue about anymore. http://overthecap.com/position/quarterback/2017/ His salary would be the bottom third, just like our passing Offense with him as QB. He had plenty of opportunities to put the team on his shoulders and pull out games, Miami case and point. He had two chances to pull out a comeback and he couldn't. The stats you guys all pull out are pretty, but they haven't pushed us over the top. He is an average QB, he isn't worth that type of money. Derek Carr, had 8 4th qrtr comebacks this year. He is slowly making an argument as an elite QB. That is the type of guy that pushes teams into the playoffs. Taylor would be nothing more than an expensive stop gap until we find that guy. Edited January 3, 2017 by DirtDart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maury Ballstein Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 But a few have admitted they are okay with getting worse (assuming they are correct and the drop off to the replacement isn't a giant cliff). I know I've at least seen GunnerBill take that stance. This. I'll take a 5-11 followed by an 11-5 Over the perpetual 8-8. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtDart Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Exactly. In 29 games started with us, 7200 all purpose yards and 47 TD's.And ZERO playoff apperances...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolishDave Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 And ZERO playoff apperances...... Because Drew Brees and Philip Rivers and Cam Newton just proved that all you need to get to the playoffs is a quarterback. Typical anti-Tyrod guy who uses team stats to justify something about a QB. Incredibly weak take and doesn't even realize it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 (edited) Not only has Buffalo's offense ranked top 10 in 2015 &16 in offensive touchdowns scored per game, but Tyrod Taylor is also finding the endzone more than some "franchise guys". http://nysportsbiz.com/2017/01/03/since-2015-tyrod-taylor-is-averaging-more-tds-per-game-than-flacco-tannehill-others/ Come on. The other QBs mentioned are either obviously not franchise QBs yet (Tannehill), or were franchise QBs but have regressed out of the category (Flacco), or are game managers. The one exception is Dalton and the guy who did the article didn't get his numbers right. Poor article generally but didn't even check their facts. Dalton didn't play in three games last year. He averages more TDs than Tyrod, even though his OL has been horrible this year. I suppose some of those guys may be faces of the franchise, but they sure aren't top ten or twelve QBs, the kind you want if you care about having a good shot at winning SBs. Separate Taylor's 2017 salary from his cap hit. He gets paid $27MM (I think) in 2017 but his spread out cap hit is $15MM. That's pretty low for a starting QB. Assuming he's on the roster for one year, and one year only, he will cost us $30.5 mill on the cap. Yeah, it'll be spread out over two years, but who cares, it's still huge money, especially for a team that's fairly cash-strapped. Especially for one year of a guy playing like Tyrod Taylor. If he's on the roster for two years, he will cost us $40.5 against the cap. And again, it'll be spread out over three years, but again, it's still far more than he will have been worth. And it's money we will be in desperate need of. His contract - as written now - would only be good for the Bills if he stays with us through four or five years, as a starter, and to do that he would have to make huge steps or we will pretty much have a ceiling of being playoff one-and-outs. I expect the Bills will ask him to re-negotiate, and wouldn't be surprised if Tyrod agrees. Edited January 3, 2017 by Thurman#1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QCity Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 The 2017 shipment of Kool Aid is already here! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PolishDave Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 His contract - as written now - would only be good for the Bills if he stays with us through four or five years, as a starter, and to do that he would have to make huge steps or we will pretty much have a ceiling of being playoff one-and-outs. I expect the Bills will ask him to re-negotiate, and wouldn't be surprised if Tyrod agrees. Not true. It costs you $10 million in dead cap to ditch him after 3 years and only 3 million after 4. Either of those is doable. So the commitment is 3 years really not 4 or 5. Meanwhile - during the time he is under contract, he is only costing you 16-17 million as a starter. That is a bargain for a starting QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downunderbill Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 And I continue to marvel at how people continue to ignore our pourous defense which couldnt hold a 24-9 lead vs the Raiders amongst others. Not sure what you getting at. Poor defence has been one of the main themes of discussion for most of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Isn't sophomore slump kind of a thing? Is sixth year slump now called sophomore slump? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Is sixth year slump now called sophomore slump? Kind of tough to slump, or succeed for that matter, when you aren't even on the field, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted January 3, 2017 Share Posted January 3, 2017 Not true. It costs you $10 million in dead cap to ditch him after 3 years and only 3 million after 4. Either of those is doable. So the commitment is 3 years really not 4 or 5. Meanwhile - during the time he is under contract, he is only costing you 16-17 million as a starter. That is a bargain for a starting QB. Oh, it "only" costs you $10 mill after three? Are you using the word "only" with $10 million? Really? And if $16 - $17 mill is a bargain for a starter, great, let's pick up Bortles and give him a new contract like that. Or Bradford or Cutler or Osweiler or Fitz. They're starters. It's not a bargain for a starter, it's a bargain for a starter if you think he's got a good chance to develop into a top 10 or 12 guy. Otherwise you're probably hoping to give your guy a bridge QB contract, not a franchise QB contract. Name one guy who's been paid in the nine figures and has played like Tyrod (roughly the 20th best QB in the league) and has lasted three or four years in a second or third contract. Guys like Osweiler, Fitz, and I'm betting Tyrod at this point, don't tend to last that long at salaries that high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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