Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 Again, I just don't agree that he was given a fair opportunity - especially with all of the injuries and suspensions etc. McCoy was given four full years with a worse winning percentage and an all pro QB. Rex was given less than two years without a Philip Rivers. As it is, the defense that we had this past year performed better against common opponents compared to the defense of the guy many here tout as the defensive Svengali. As for discipline and focus, yesterday's game may have shown that Rex was the only guy keeping it together. Was McCoy's tenure plagued by problems like 12 men on field, 10 men on field at critical game junctures, late play calls, D scrambling to get into position, strange challenges or lack of challenges? Was McCoy's tenure plagued by reports of problems like players showing up late for meetings, sleeping in meeting rooms, stupid boneheaded penalties? Did McCoy, during his first 2 years, degrade the performance of either the O or the D he inherited or did he improve them both (in the first 2 years)? I know don't like Taylor, but what wins football games is points, and the Bills, 12th and 10th on points scored for offense this year, compare favorably with the best of the 4 Rivers-led O that McCoy fielded (12th in 2013 and 9th this year) and better than 2 others (26th and 17th) There's no question this year's injuries hurt Ryan's chances, but for the most part he seemed to be given FA who played capably in most positions You're certainly entitled to your viewpoint that Rex wasn't given a fair opportunity. Hopefully you can understand the viewpoint that Rex's own sloppy coaching, combined with failing to meet expectations to maintain or improve the D, led to his dismissal.
Peter Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 Not necessarily... by all accounts Whaley has gotten the players his coaches have requested. The point I was trying to make is that guys like Cowher (just as an example) want to be the big swinging you know what. Guys like that do not want to answer to a guy like Doug Whaley and Doug Whaley has shown (in my judgment) that he does not want someone with a bigger name than he has. He wants someone who is beholden to him (I think)>
PromoTheRobot Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 Well based on the "HMMMMMMMMMMMM" I get the feeling that something in the interview is likely going to conflict with today's presser. Hasn't posted yet. Said it's filed so likely needs to go over editing before posting. http://pro32.ap.org/ This is where it will be.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 You're going down with this ship eh Peter? I supported the Rex hire and I want continuity but my goodness, did he ever earn his dismissal. I sometimes disagree with you but when you're right, you're right.
K-9 Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 https://twitter.com/john_wawrow/status/816039486987599872 The Sullys and Buckys of the world WISH they had this kind of access. And they would if they weren't such pricks.
Dorkington Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 Yeah, I guess I disagree with the media and a lot of folks here, I have no issues with how Whaley handled that... it was clear he was trying to be as 'company first' as possible, and also didn't want to throw Rex and co under the bus either. The media wouldn't let things go, so kept asking the same damned things. I think Whaley has done a decent job in getting talent on this team (better than other GMs since our last playoffs), but like he said, it's not good enough. I'm hopeful that his choice for HC does better than Russ's choices for HCs. If we don't make the playoffs (or show real improvement) next year, I'll be on team 'fire whaley', but right now I still support him as GM. Also, !@#$ the local media. Bunch of idiots.
Wayne Arnold Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 Stupid article. I would fire someone if they worked for me a published articles like that. Whaley is just being tricky. He's telling the truth with regard to the meeting Rex and Terry had that Tuesday morning and that's when Rex probably asked Terry to just fire him that day instead of after the Jets game. So Whaley is truthful to a certain extent, but you have to be naive to think Whaley didn't have input on the ultimate decision to fire Rex after the season. The press has to be better by recognizing this and give him questions he can't awkwardly stumble away from. For example: "Was the decision to fire Rex after the Jets game made before Terry fired him on Tuesday?" I don't think I heard that question.
Peter Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 Was McCoy's tenure plagued by problems like 12 men on field, 10 men on field at critical game junctures, late play calls, D scrambling to get into position, strange challenges or lack of challenges? Was McCoy's tenure plagued by reports of problems like players showing up late for meetings, sleeping in meeting rooms, stupid boneheaded penalties? Did McCoy, during his first 2 years, degrade the performance of either the O or the D he inherited or did he improve them both (in the first 2 years)? I know don't like Taylor, but what wins football games is points, and the Bills, 12th and 10th on points scored for offense this year, compare favorably with the best of the 4 Rivers-led O that McCoy fielded (12th in 2013 and 9th this year) and better than 2 others (26th and 17th) There's no question this year's injuries hurt Ryan's chances, but for the most part he seemed to be given FA who played capably in most positions You're certainly entitled to your viewpoint that Rex wasn't given a fair opportunity. Hopefully you can understand the viewpoint that Rex's own sloppy coaching, combined with failing to meet expectations to maintain or improve the D, led to his dismissal. Don't know. Yet, I saw Pittsburgh (for example) have problems with communications and not enough men on the field. As far as I know, Mike T still has his job. These issues can happen to a lot of coaches. I do not mean to pick on Tomlin. I also think that yesterday's game showed that Rex may have been the only guy keeping it together.
Billschinatown Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 Well based on the "HMMMMMMMMMMMM" I get the feeling that something in the interview is likely going to conflict with today's presser. Hasn't posted yet. Said it's filed so likely needs to go over editing before posting. Not sure I agree with this hmm interpretation. Awful move for Pegula to contradict him today.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 The point I was trying to make is that guys like Cowher (just as an example) want to be the big swinging you know what. Guys like that do not want to answer to a guy like Doug Whaley and Doug Whaley has shown (in my judgment) that he does not want someone with a bigger name than he has. He wants someone who is beholden to him (I think)> I think Whaley realizes very well that he's being given the power to lead the coaching search and have the major input on who to hire because "with power comes responsibility" and if the coach isn't better and the team doesn't improve, he's sitting on an armed ejection seat and out he will go. Maybe in his best dreams, he hires a meek and biddable coach who is beholden to him - I dunno. I suppose I don't really want to go too far into what Whaley's best dreams may involve. In reality, though, I think Whaley is sincere in saying he wants whoever will give the Bills the best chance to win, because that clearly aligns with his best shot for job security. He probably would prefer the coach to report to him as Gailey reported to Nix, but I thought he made it clear that was "on the table" during the interview process.
yungmack Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 (edited) The true irony of this is that, if he's hired, he'd be coaching in the same division as William the Bastard. (I'm the only one that gets that, aren't I?) Nice 1066 reference. You know where Hastings St. is in Buffalo, right? Edited January 2, 2017 by yungmack
Peter Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 (edited) The Sullys and Buckys of the world WISH they had this kind of access. And they would if they weren't such pricks. Indeed, you are 100% correct. I just read short version: "(Whaley) had input on the basis of conversations throughout the year, what the problems were," http://pro32.ap.org/article/apnewsbreak-bills-owner-outlines-reasons-he-fired-rex-ryan Edited January 2, 2017 by Peter
Heitz Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 Full JW story / Pegula interview up: http://pro32.ap.org/article/apnewsbreak-bills-owner-outlines-reasons-he-fired-rex-ryan
Protocal69 Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 (edited) I think this is what happened when the BILLS hired Rex Ryan and that it went down like this: Russ Brandon wanted Rex. Whaley really didn't want Rex. Whaley wanted Hue Jackson Pegulas trusted Russ Brandon more than Whaley so therefore choose Rex because of Brandon's recommendation (Dont let him leave the building") plus they liked Rex as a person. Pegulas after the fact found out that they got played per say by Brandon and Rex. and given how things played out decided to own their mistake and fire Rex and removed Brandon from the process. He would have fired Brandon to, but he is too valuable in his role of marketing and other things that he does for both the BILLS and Sabres.So now by letting Whaley handle the hiring process this is Terry's way of saying 'fine we were wrong' so I'll let you call the shots this time. If you are right great. If not you will be fired and I will nuke the whole thing. Edited January 2, 2017 by Protocal69
Kelly the Dog Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 I think Whaley realizes very well that he's being given the power to lead the coaching search and have the major input on who to hire because "with power comes responsibility" and if the coach isn't better and the team doesn't improve, he's sitting on an armed ejection seat and out he will go. Maybe in his best dreams, he hires a meek and biddable coach who is beholden to him - I dunno. I suppose I don't really want to go too far into what Whaley's best dreams may involve. In reality, though, I think Whaley is sincere in saying he wants whoever will give the Bills the best chance to win, because that clearly aligns with his best shot for job security. He probably would prefer the coach to report to him as Gailey reported to Nix, but I thought he made it clear that was "on the table" during the interview process. Yep. I think it was obvious. This year, there isn't really a big name coach that is available and would require (rightfully, not in his own head) that much power. If Bill Cowher came out of retirement and the Pegulas wanted him, and he wanted to be in Buffalo I fully believe Whaley would have said it's fine that Cowher reports to Pegulas. He deserves that clout. Same thing with, say, Gruden. He's a big name and a lot of power. Maybe even Sean Peyton although maybe not. But that's about it. Otherwise it's going to be the normal NFL way of doing business: The GM hires and fire the HC, and the owners sign off on these decisions.
TheFunPolice Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 I keep saying it, but this reminds me so much of Darcy staying on and hiring Ron Rolston. Darcy was finally THE man, finally had the $$ he needed. Picked a new coach. Team sold fans a line of BS. All of a sudden the team struggled the next year coming out of the gate and both were gone the same day and none other than Pat L came in for like 15 minutes before he had a blowup with ownership and quit. "Safe" doesn't mean much when you work for Terry. 15 minutes later you can be gone.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 The Sullys and Buckys of the world WISH they had this kind of access. And they would if they weren't such pricks. You're talking about this? http://pro32.ap.org/article/apnewsbreak-bills-owner-outlines-reasons-he-fired-rex-ryan "Pegula backed up Whaley's comments in his first interview since Ryan was fired on Dec. 27 and replaced by Anthony Lynn, who took over as interim coach. Pegula said he made what he called "an executive decision" to fire Ryan during his weekly conference call with the coach and Whaley. As the call came to a close, Pegula said Ryan asked to speak to the owner privately. Pegula said Ryan then directly asked him about his future beyond this season. Pegula said he had no choice but to set things straight with Ryan. "I was asked a point-blank question and based on the discussions we've been having all year, I felt it was better to tell Rex that we were going in a different direction," Pegula said. Ryan recommended Lynn to take over as interim coach for Buffalo's final game. Though Pegula was going to wait to evaluate Ryan's job after the season, he said he probably would've come to the same conclusion now as he did a week ago. Pegula based his decision on his own observations, input he's received from his front-office staff over the course of the season, and also on previous discussions he's had with Ryan regarding addressing the team's struggles." "With the Bills out of playoff contention, Pegula said the decision was made to bench starter Tyrod Taylor to evaluate backup EJ Manuel and rookie fourth-round pick Cardale Jones. Manuel, who is completing the final year of his contract, struggled in going 9 of 20 for 86 yards and a lost fumble, before being replaced by Jones to start the fourth quarter. As for Taylor's future, Pegula said that was still to be evaluated. Pegula did pay Taylor a compliment when reminded he went 7-8 this season. "Maybe he can win more games than that, I don't know," Pegula said. "But when the other side of the ball's not performing, it's hard to outscore people." Say I: It seems a lot of ink and electrons could have been saved if Pegula gave this interview last Tuesday.
BrooklynBills Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 Poor John Murphy was stumbling all over himself trying to make that crapshow seem normal. Luckily for him 3:00 came quickly. I had to laugh when Donald Jones said that GMs in this league really don't make big decisions and that they all are at the whim of ownership. I don't know how he say that and keep from laughing.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 I think this is what happened when the BILLS hired Rex Ryan and that it went down like this: Russ Brandon wanted Rex. Whaley really didn't want Rex. Whaley wanted Hue Jackson Pegula trusted Russ Brandon more than Whaley so therefore choose Rex because of that recommendation (Dont let him leave the building") plus they liked Rex as a person. Pegulas after the fact found out that they got played per say by Brandon and Rex. and given how things played out decided to own their mistake and fire Rex and removed Brandon from the process. He would have fired Brandon but his too valuable in the marketing job and other that he does for both the BILLS and Sabres.So now letting Whaley handle the hiring process this is Terry way of saying fine we were wrong so I'll let you call the shots this time. If you are right great. If not you will be fired and I will nuke the whole thing. Yep, this.
Peter Posted January 2, 2017 Posted January 2, 2017 I keep saying it, but this reminds me so much of Darcy staying on and hiring Ron Rolston. Darcy was finally THE man, finally had the $$ he needed. Picked a new coach. Team sold fans a line of BS. All of a sudden the team struggled the next year coming out of the gate and both were gone the same day and none other than Pat L came in for like 15 minutes before he had a blowup with ownership and quit. "Safe" doesn't mean much when you work for Terry. 15 minutes later you can be gone. Ron Rolston is the Mendoza line of head coaches. God forbid that Doug Whaley should hire the NFL version of Ron Rolston. Even I think Doug will do better than that.
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