Taylor does have a groin issue after all; may need surgery

[dave mcbride]

As for the Watkins pick, I was told before the draft that if the Bills had ANY chance to get Sammy that they would "run to the podium." They LOVED him (as did everybody).

I still think that was a great pick. When healthy, he's the best player on the field. He's only 23 too.

[MAJBobby]

Doesnt matter again read the clause. Has to Have an INJ that Drs say will cause to miss games in 2017.

 

Example Blows his knee out (will mis games in 2017). Bills just decline option.

 

Inj hurts TT ability to land work at with a decent contract because who signs a QB in UFA thats gonna miss GAMES in 2017'

 

That is what the clause is in easy to understand language.

 

THAT is what the bills were protecting their flexibility

[Kelly the Dog]

I still think that was a great pick. When healthy, he's the best player on the field. He's only 23 too.

He's one of the best players in the league. It remains to be seen if this injury prone thing continues. But it has drastically changed the fortunes of the team. He really hasn't been 100% healthy in his entire career. It's sad.

[MAJBobby]

And this is how Florio rolls with it as his headline

 

@profootballtalk

Tyrod Taylor to be evaluated for groin/hernia surgery; it's a procedure that could cost the Bills $30.5 million

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/12/29/tyrod-taylor-to-be-evaluated-for-groinhernia-surgery/

 

After rolling with this headline 10 minutes earlier

 

@profootballtalk

The Bills put Tyrod Taylor in bubble wrap to avoid owing him $30.5 million; it may have been too late

For an attorney he cant even understand a basic injury clause. Ooonwait he does but that doesnt get clicks

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

Doesnt matter again read the clause. Has to Have an INJ that Drs say will cause to miss games in 2017.

 

Example Blows his knee out (will mis games in 2017). Bills just decline option.

 

Inj hurts TT ability to land work at with a decent contract because who signs a QB in UFA thats gonna miss GAMES in 2017'

 

That is what the clause is in easy to understand language.

 

THAT is what the bills were protecting their flexibility

 

This would probably make the most sense. I assume that means what - pass a physical in march? No one will sign him otherwise right?

[dave mcbride]

Doesnt matter again read the clause. Has to Have an INJ that Drs say will cause to miss games in 2017.

 

Example Blows his knee out (will mis games in 2017). Bills just decline option.

 

Inj hurts TT ability to land work at with a decent contract because who signs a QB in UFA thats gonna miss GAMES in 2017'

 

That is what the clause is in easy to understand language.

 

THAT is what the bills were protecting their flexibility

Link? I didn't find anything saying that at all. All I found was "start of league season." I'm not saying you're wrong; I just haven't seen any evidence that suggests you're correct. How do you project outward from March 1 anyway? ACL tears are often 7 month injuries now; if he were to tear it on Sunday, there's a decent chance he'd be ready by the first game of the season. Philip Rivers tore an ACL in the AFC championship game and didn't miss any time the next season.

[MAJBobby]

Link? I didn't find anything saying that at all. All I found was "start of league season." I'm not saying you're wrong; I just haven't seen any evidence that suggests you're correct. How do you project outward from March 1 anyway? ACL tears are often 7 month injuries now; if he were to tear it on Sunday, there's a decent chance he'd be ready by the first game of the season. Philip Rivers tore an ACL in the AFC championship game and didn't miss any time the next season.

Trying to find the clause. It was posted months ago but specifically remember Bills DR conduct physical

 

And specifically talked Games

 

Then Bills also insured themselves against the guarantees meaning if they do pay it they get that money back to them (granted lose the cap space)

 

So really the smart thing is

 

Even if they want to move on from him and he is hurt and the clause kicks in you mind as well keep him on your team (losing space anyway) and insurance pays you back. Thej he fets healthy and reclaims his job or you deal him in camp when a team (Minny) becomes desperate for a QB

[Hapless Bills Fan]

He was referencing the depth chart that "if" he had a hamstring injury EJ would be next up but yea. That's just too much of a coincidence that he made that reference and then this shows up.

 

Lynn was an RB. I think he knows the difference between a hamstring and a groin (adductor) injury.

 

Of course we could do a lot better, and I want to do better. But let's be real... we don't have any other immediate options for improvement. Keeping Tyrod and taking a chance in the draft is about the only option we have for both making the playoffs and striking future gold.

 

If you want to pick up whatever crappy QB and tank, for a future high draft pick, I can see that argument, but I'd rather get to the playoffs now and build on what we have.

 

I want to see the Bills do the Eagles "all in" strategy: keep Taylor as their best current option, and keep looking for better yet. Even with his option, his pay will not be so unreasonable that they can't do that, and taking out the bonus, his contract would be marketable to trade partners if they find "better".

 

 

Assuming he doesn't heal and then they cut him he gets paid still.

 

I think Yolo's point is why would you cut him if his injury clause is gonna kick in? If you're taking the cap hit anyway, keep him!

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

Trying to find the clause. It was posted months ago but specifically remember Bills DR conduct physical

 

And specifically talked Games

 

Then Bills also insured themselves against the guarantees meaning if they do pay it they get that money back to them (granted lose the cap space)

 

So really the smart thing is

 

Even if they want to move on from him and he is hurt and the clause kicks in you mind as well keep him on your team (losing space anyway) and insurance pays you back. Thej he fets healthy and reclaims his job or you deal him in camp when a team (Minny) becomes desperate for a QB

 

Right - doesn't affect the cap. But affects what you might have to actually spend for salary.

[MAJBobby]

Link? I didn't find anything saying that at all. All I found was "start of league season." I'm not saying you're wrong; I just haven't seen any evidence that suggests you're correct. How do you project outward from March 1 anyway? ACL tears are often 7 month injuries now; if he were to tear it on Sunday, there's a decent chance he'd be ready by the first game of the season. Philip Rivers tore an ACL in the AFC championship game and didn't miss any time the next season.

Also March 1st has nothing to do with it. Its the physical he will take when they dont pick up option which i think that deadline was march 9th

[dave mcbride]

Trying to find the clause. It was posted months ago but specifically remember Bills DR conduct physical

 

And specifically talked Games

 

Then Bills also insured themselves against the guarantees meaning if they do pay it they get that money back to them (granted lose the cap space)

 

So really the smart thing is

 

Even if they want to move on from him and he is hurt and the clause kicks in you mind as well keep him on your team (losing space anyway) and insurance pays you back. Thej he fets healthy and reclaims his job or you deal him in camp when a team (Minny) becomes desperate for a QB

I looked and couldn't find it. Again, I'm not saying you're wrong, but it's very trick to make projections on March 1 regarding late season injuries. As I said, an ACL tear this week probably wouldn't stop him from playing in game 1 of next season.

[MAJBobby]

 

Lynn was an RB. I think he knows the difference between a hamstring and a groin (adductor) injury.

 

 

I want to see the Bills do the Eagles "all in" strategy: keep Taylor as their best current option, and keep looking for better yet. Even with his option, his pay will not be so unreasonable that they can't do that, and taking out the bonus, his contract would be marketable to trade partners if they find "better".

 

 

 

I think Yolo's point is why would you cut him if his injury clause is gonna kick in? If you're taking the cap hit anyway, keep him!

Correct if clause does kick in pick the option up. Get another QB. When TT gets healthy he either wins his job back or deal him.

[The Wiz]

 

Lynn was an RB. I think he knows the difference between a hamstring and a groin (adductor) injury.

 

 

I think Yolo's point is why would you cut him if his injury clause is gonna kick in? If you're taking the cap hit anyway, keep him!

I agree, more to the point that he was hinting at him being injured (even though he has been listed as injured all this time) but now everyone is jumping all over it like it's new news.

 

I think it would be dumb to cut him also if his injury clause kicked in but I recall plenty of people on here saying that EJ should have been cut as soon as Rex was hired even though his contract was fully guaranteed (no it's not 27m but it's still dead cap). The only way they would cut him if his clause kicked in would be to serve someone else's objective.

[MAJBobby]

I looked and couldn't find it. Again, I'm not saying you're wrong, but it's very trick to make projections on March 1 regarding late season injuries. As I said, an ACL tear this week probably wouldn't stop him from playing in game 1 of next season.

I get that put happens all the time. Player passes a physical from a team and immediately fails another.

 

So in march anyoje REALLY think he wont pass the team physical when they decline the option (if they do of course)

 

Much to do About nothing really but sports writers need something to write about. Here its just about a clause tht is in every contract with big guarantees

 

I also think it is very easy for Bills if Agent pulled something like that to fight and win.

 

This INJ didnt cause you to miss ANY games now your trying ti use it for guaranteed money.

Edited December 29, 2016 by MAJBobby

[dave mcbride]

I get that put happens all the time. Player passes a physical from a team and immediately fails another.

 

So in march anyoje REALLY think he wont pass the team physical when they decline the option (if they do of course)

 

Much to do About nothing really but sports writers need something to write about. Here its just about a clause tht is in every contract with big guarantees

 

I also think it is very easy for Bills if Agent pulled something like that to fight and win.

 

This INJ didnt cause you to miss ANY games now your trying ti use it for guaranteed money.

That's why I'm skeptical it was written in this way - a lot of serious injuries can occur late in seasons and not require anyone to miss time next season, although they might. It's hard to predict and varies from player to player. Christ, players are even coming back from achilles tears pretty quickly now. Hence a firm March 1 diagnosis on the player's status at that current moment is a lot cleaner for both sides. Otherwise you end up with lawsuits because of indeterminate language.

Edited December 29, 2016 by dave mcbride

[MAJBobby]

I agree, more to the point that he was hinting at him being injured (even though he has been listed as injured all this time) but now everyone is jumping all over it like it's new news.

 

I think it would be dumb to cut him also if his injury clause kicked in but I recall plenty of people on here saying that EJ should have been cut as soon as Rex was hired even though his contract was fully guaranteed (no it's not 27m but it's still dead cap). The only way they would cut him if his clause kicked in would be to serve someone else's objective.

And the 27M is also no issue. Why Bills will get a 27M payout from the insured contract.

 

So your losing the space anyway if clause kicks in keep him, draft a QB. If Rookie performing in offseason or Cardale TT healthy he comes back and tries wins job back or is dealt

 

 

And for those that Hate me talking about Tyrod. Sorry this conversation is more about the clause but still sorry

Edited December 29, 2016 by MAJBobby

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

I didn't know a friggin' Pats fan paid so close attention to the Bills. Ask me if I care what you think. Don't you have a friggin' Pats board to occupy your time with?

Excellent question

[jahnyc]

The Bills have been amazing over the last number of years in producing drama. I wish the team was more entertaining during the season with their play, but never a dull moment. Seriously. From ownership issues (including Bon Jovi) to constant changes with coaches, it has been an incredible run. Would be nice to have some stability at the QB position and with the GM and HC (including staff). At least we have stability with the ownership of the team (even if they are learning on the job), which is the most important piece of all of this and for which I am most appreciative after worrying for years about what happens after RW. At some point in the future, it will all work.

[What a Tuel]

Honest question: I've been searching, and I haven't seen anything saying that Tyrod has to be injured at the start of the 2017 regular season for the bonus to count. Everything I've seen says the beginning of the "league year," which is in fact March, and it doesn't specify anything beyond injured - as in can't play. That stands to reason too - if he is injured then, who is to say when he'll return even if it's a groin injury? There has to be some clear definition in these contracts about kick-in dates, and the only that logically makes sense given their decision not to play him this week is the March 1 date (given ACL tears now, he's likely be ready by September 1 if he had one of those on Sunday). Also, it's worth noting that Andre Reed missed the final dozen games of the 1996 season and the playoffs because of a groin injury that required surgery.

 

Does anyone have any clear evidence that states he has to be injured in September? What about preseason? Camp? Etc.?

 

Back then groin surgery was more like spleen surgery and the risk was higher, and the recovery longer.

 

http://www.buffalorumblings.com/2016/12/29/14116866/tyrod-taylor-injury-understanding-the-injury-only-guarantee-clause-in-buffalo-bills-contract

 

I reached out to Jason Fitgerald, the founder of OverTheCap.com, and he wrote the following to me via Twitter DM:

“The salary is already guaranteed for injury. What that means is that he if he were unable to pass a physical at the time of his release the Bills would owe him $27.5M on his contract.”

So there you have it. Pretty straight forward. If his groin injury means he won’t be able to pass a physical in mid-March and he’s cut, then the Bills would be on the hook for that enormous amount of money.

Fitzgerald went on to write:

“The info I have on the contract is that the Bills need to decide on his option by the 3rd day of the LY. If exercised a full guarantee kicks in on his 2017 base salary and a $3.25M full guarantee of his 2018 salary kicks in. Another $9.75M of his 2018 salary also becomes guaranteed for injury. Basically as long as he is healthy by the 4th day of free agency they can cut him without owing him another penny.”

[CommonCents]

 

Back then groin surgery was more like spleen surgery and the risk was higher, and the recovery longer.

 

http://www.buffalorumblings.com/2016/12/29/14116866/tyrod-taylor-injury-understanding-the-injury-only-guarantee-clause-in-buffalo-bills-contract

I reached out to Jason Fitgerald, the founder of OverTheCap.com, and he wrote the following to me via Twitter DM:

The salary is already guaranteed for injury. What that means is that he if he were unable to pass a physical at the time of his release the Bills would owe him $27.5M on his contract.

So there you have it. Pretty straight forward. If his groin injury means he wont be able to pass a physical in mid-March and hes cut, then the Bills would be on the hook for that enormous amount of money.

Fitzgerald went on to write:

The info I have on the contract is that the Bills need to decide on his option by the 3rd day of the LY. If exercised a full guarantee kicks in on his 2017 base salary and a $3.25M full guarantee of his 2018 salary kicks in. Another $9.75M of his 2018 salary also becomes guaranteed for injury. Basically as long as he is healthy by the 4th day of free agency they can cut him without owing him another penny.

So THINK ACL was incorrect and what the majority of folks had been saying was more in line with what's actually correct. Thanks for taking the time to dig this up.