Vote on firing Rex

[The Big Cat]

Context of the 2010 defense, with 1 player of 11 (or 13-15 if talking about key contributors) and 4 DC's ago, having ANYTHING to do with our expectations in 2016?

 

Are you one of those dudes who gets mad when they hold the last 20 years of futility against the current Bills and the organization today?

 

Keep it relevant, homie.

 

your habit of reading 3/4 of a post so you can find something to key in on and B word about is getting really old.

 

read the whole thing, if you still don't get it, look within.

Edited December 23, 2016 by The Big Cat

[BringBackOrton]

 

your habit of reading 3/4 of a post so you can find something to key in on and B word about is getting really old.

 

read the whole thing, if you still don't get it, look within.

Your habit of assuming I don't understand your point, just because it's almost always built on a faulty premise at best is even more tiring.

 

Especially when it's a straw man about a "legacy" defense. Not only have I never heard that phrase before you, I have never seen a single post intimate that the last 5 years of Buffalo Bills football have had anything resembling consistently solid defenses.

 

So the point is, all the people who never made the point you're attacking are wrong. Coolio.

Edited December 23, 2016 by jmc12290

[The Big Cat]

Your habit of assuming I don't understand your point, just because it's almost always built on a faulty premise at best is even more tiring.

 

Especially when it's a straw man about a "legacy" defense. Not only have I never heard that phrase before you, I have never seen a single post intimate that the last 5 years of Buffalo Bills football have had anything resembling consistently solid defenses.

 

So the point is, all the people who never made the point you're attacking are wrong. Coolio.

 

k, bye

[Freddie's Dead]

your right I left out Marcel

 

We didnt miss Shaq cuz Lorax was killing it.....

 

Ragland is a wild card...we need to watch him play before we can even say he would be an upgrade (I think he will)

 

but the fact remains....our secondary is HORRIBLE.....much of it based off safety play. We actually MISS Searcy

Searcy, Rambo, Cockrell. Cockrell is by far the worst. Couldn't get on the field here, starting for PIT. WTF is wrong with that picture?

[The Big Cat]

Rex !@#$ed up all the good that came from the 2014 defense.

 

Is that better?

 

So long as we're also counting all the good that didn't' come from it:

1. 2 healthy/reliable safeties
2. A non-useless Mario Williams
3. A healthy Kyle Williams

 

Those sorts of things. But you've been a brick wall to these truths, so I guess it's a fools errand getting you to understand them now.

[Peter]

 

So long as we're also counting all the good that didn't' come from it:

1. 2 healthy/reliable safeties
2. A non-useless Mario Williams
3. A healthy Kyle Williams

 

Those sorts of things. But you've been a brick wall to these truths, so I guess it's a fools errand getting you to understand them now.

 

Thank you for being a voice of reason.

Edited December 23, 2016 by Peter

[Dr.Sack]

I've been skeptical of Rex, but the players leaders who want him I say one more season.

[The Big Cat]

Like your brick wall to the "3 and out in bunches" theory that was proven to be complete bull ****?

]

 

Stopped reading after this line because I wasn't in the mood for fiction.

 

Thank you for being a voice of reason.

 

There are some truly special people here. Not sure why I bother.

 

Seeing you have the same retarded arguments with the same people confirms my sanity!!

[jethro_tull]

With a healthy team and upgrades at the positions of need, keeping Rex and the system in place is the best chance to make the playoffs next season. Beyond that.......

[Mister Defense]

 

There's that "great D" talk again.

To recap:

 

2010: horrible defense

2011: horrible defense

2012: historically horrible defense

2013: below average defense

2014: very good defense

2015: average/below average defense

2016: average/above average defense

This notion that Rex Ryan dismantled some kind of legacy defense is extremely misleading.

 

Credit be to Schwartz for his one magical year (in which virtually nobody got injured and they wilted when it mattered most, but still).

 

Rex Ryan did not "ruin" a "great defense." He took a defense that WAS BAD then over performed for a season and has since been middling to good.

 

Let me say that I personally do not think the 2014 defense was 'great', and I was simply pointing to the faulty logic of the poster. But it is clear that Big Cat is just as illogical and that his lack of facts, and faulty analysis, is another example of those supporting Ryan not having much to back up their position.

 

The 2014 defense was very good, consistent and, for most teams, posed significant problems on offense. They looked they were on the verge of greatness.

 

But Big Cat bizarrely implies that that the 2014 defense was a fluke, a one year thing, and that it followed a "WAS BAD" defense the year before, 2013.

 

But, like so much in the above post. the facts do not back up the analysis.

 

The two years before Rex Ryan took over:

• The Bills were ranked 10th in defense in 2013
• The Bills were ranked 4th in defense in 2014

Under Rex Ryan:

• In 2015, Ryan's first year they were ranked 15th
• This year, with two years under his belt, a fully implemented Ryan defense, and his brother as his assistant coach, the Bills are 19th

 

So, the implications in his post are completely off--the defense has clearly declined, and clearly is worse this year than last, and dramatically less effective than in 2014, a shell of its former self.

 

And 2014 was not a 'magical' fluke defense, but one improving on many positive things from the previous year, 2013, that was not the "BAD DEFENSE" Big Cat painted it as in order to support a failing coach.

 

Hence, Ryan took a very good defense and has made it much worse; worse last year, and worse this year than last year. So much worse than when he arrived, a defense he said himself underperformed when it was 4th in the league. They are 19th this year, and regressing as the year progresses.

 

Those defensive numbers are the facts. Pretty clear ones, I think, so bizarre how someone could just throw those out the window and come up with

their own made up facts and the faulty analysis that almost always accompanies such bad information.

 

 

I can only hope that those at One Bills Drive are using legitimate information and solid analysis of it to make this important decision. If so, Rex Ryan is done, and there is almost no gray area as to why this is needed.

[BADOLBILZ]

 

Stopped reading after this line because I wasn't in the mood for fiction.

 

There are some truly special people here. Not sure why I bother.

 

Seeing you have the same retarded arguments with the same people confirms my sanity!!

 

 

Who DOES know why you bother?

 

There really isn't a lot of nuance to this argument but you insist on trying to generate some.

 

"Ok so you don't buy the heat maps........how about 3 and outs? 3 and outs have to prove I'm right".

 

And you didn't even check to see if there was any statistical correlation. And of course, there wasn't.

 

So then it was the "back to back 3 and outs"...........as if any team that has a lot of 3 and outs doesn't string a bunch of them together.

 

You got NOTHING and yet you keep coming back with more angles of the same bullish*t.

[Alphadawg7]

 

There's that "great D" talk again.

To recap:

 

2010: horrible defense

2011: horrible defense

2012: historically horrible defense

2013: below average defense

2014: very good defense

2015: average/below average defense

2016: average/above average defense

This notion that Rex Ryan dismantled some kind of legacy defense is extremely misleading.

 

Credit be to Schwartz for his one magical year (in which virtually nobody got injured and they wilted when it mattered most, but still).

 

Rex Ryan did not "ruin" a "great defense." He took a defense that WAS BAD then over performed for a season and has since been middling to good.

 

THIS ^

 

The over exaggeration of how good the defense was before Rex is mind blowing. Its like all the foolish people who still think FitzCrapTrick should still be our QB.

 

Our Defense compiled sack and INT stats, but overall it was a bend and hope it don't break. It was one of those defenses that would get your hopes up and then not come through in the key moments of games it needed to. Now people go back and look at stats and think it was some elite defense that Rex broke. No one on this board was running around hyping them up to be elite, in fact, the shout box and threads were filled with whining and complaining week after week. Now all of a sudden there is this perception that we were elite and now we are not.

[The Big Cat]

 

 

Who DOES know why you bother?

 

There really isn't a lot of nuance to this argument but you insist on trying to generate some.

 

"Ok so you don't buy the heat maps........how about 3 and outs? 3 and outs have to prove I'm right".

 

And you didn't even check to see if there was any statistical correlation. And of course, there wasn't.

 

So then it was the "back to back 3 and outs"...........as if any team that has a lot of 3 and outs doesn't string a bunch of them together.

 

You got NOTHING and yet you keep coming back with more angles of the same bullish*t.

Entirely false. Up and down, completely 100% false.

 

But sure.

 

THIS ^

 

The over exaggeration of how good the defense was before Rex is mind blowing. Its like all the foolish people who still think FitzCrapTrick should still be our QB.

 

Our Defense compiled sack and INT stats, but overall it was a bend and hope it don't break. It was one of those defenses that would get your hopes up and then not come through in the key moments of games it needed to. Now people go back and look at stats and think it was some elite defense that Rex broke. No one on this board was running around hyping them up to be elite, in fact, the shout box and threads were filled with whining and complaining week after week. Now all of a sudden there is this perception that we were elite and now we are not.

The vocal minority that opposes this truth is precisely that.

 

Let me say that I personally do not think the 2014 defense was 'great', and I was simply pointing to the faulty logic of the poster. But it is clear that Big Cat is just as illogical and that his lack of facts, and faulty analysis, is another example of those supporting Ryan not having much to back up their position.

 

The 2014 defense was very good, consistent and, for most teams, posed significant problems on offense. They looked they were on the verge of greatness.

 

But Big Cat bizarrely implies that that the 2014 defense was a fluke, a one year thing, and that it followed a "WAS BAD" defense the year before, 2013.

 

But, like so much in the above post. the facts do not back up the analysis.

 

The two years before Rex Ryan took over:

• The Bills were ranked 10th in defense in 2013
• The Bills were ranked 4th in defense in 2014

Under Rex Ryan:

• In 2015, Ryan's first year they were ranked 15th
• This year, with two years under his belt, a fully implemented Ryan defense, and his brother as his assistant coach, the Bills are 19th

So, the implications in his post are completely off--the defense has clearly declined, and clearly is worse this year than last, and dramatically less effective than in 2014, a shell of its former self.

 

And 2014 was not a 'magical' fluke defense, but one improving on many positive things from the previous year, 2013, that was not the "BAD DEFENSE" Big Cat painted it as in order to support a failing coach.

 

Hence, Ryan took a very good defense and has made it much worse; worse last year, and worse this year than last year. So much worse than when he arrived, a defense he said himself underperformed when it was 4th in the league. They are 19th this year, and regressing as the year progresses.

 

Those defensive numbers are the facts. Pretty clear ones, I think, so bizarre how someone could just throw those out the window and come up with

their own made up facts and the faulty analysis that almost always accompanies such bad information.

 

 

I can only hope that those at One Bills Drive are using legitimate information and solid analysis of it to make this important decision. If so, Rex Ryan is done, and there is almost no gray area as to why this is needed.

TL;DR

 

But seriously, whatever you say.

[BADOLBILZ]

What does the 2010 defense have to do with the 2016 defense, pray tell? Kyle is the only player the same.

 

It's simple TBC was a huge defender of Rex D........he's been proven wrong by two seasons where the defense cost the team greatly........now he's trying to say that Rex failing was only natural because the D was bad 6 years ago.

 

Rex isn't a miracle worker ya' know.

 

Sure, the coaching on the offensive side of the ball can take a very flawed unit and score at a top 10 clip....injuries be damned........ but you can't expect Rex to coach a defense up...........or in lieu of that.....ya' know.......run a scheme that suit's the personnel.

Edited December 24, 2016 by #BADOL

[The Big Cat]

 

It's simple TBC was a huge defender of Rex D........he's been proven wrong by two seasons where the defense cost the team greatly........now he's trying to say that Rex failing was only natural because the D was bad 6 years ago.

 

Rex isn't a miracle worker ya' know.

 

Sure, the coaching on the offensive side of the ball can take a very flawed unit and score at a top 10 clip....injuries be damned........ but you can't expect Rex to coach a defense up...........or in lieu of that.....ya' know.......run a scheme that suit's the personnel.

[Mister Defense]

Entirely false. Up and down, completely 100% false.

 

But sure.

 

The vocal minority that opposes this truth is precisely that.

 

TL;DR

 

But seriously, whatever you say.

 

As clear, rational, and well supported as the post that I was responding to.

 

Yikes.

[The Big Cat]

 

As clear, rational, and well supported as the post that I was responding to.

 

Yikes.

You expected a rational response to an argument that was measurably false?

[Mister Defense]

You expected a rational response to an argument that was measurably false?

 

 

But all the evidence in my post was factual, to the best of my knowledge, and the analysis fits the data presented, refuting your assertions.

 

"Measurably false" means that you have clear evidence of it being false, specific and factual things you can point to that refute my claims.

 

What is that evidence--what was "measurably false"?

 

Or, is that statement too just like the post I was commenting on, simply made up, based on nothing more than your own opinion, though stated as fact?

 

If it is "measurably false", then please tell me and the others reading this what that measure is; point to the things in my post that are false and provide evidence as you explain why they are. (That is what I did as I explained the problems with your post.) Thank you.

[The Big Cat]

 

 

But all the evidence in my post was factual, to the best of my knowledge, and the analysis fits the data presented, refuting your assertions.

 

"Measurably false" means that you have clear evidence of it being false, specific and factual things you can point to that refute my claims.

 

What is that evidence--what was "measurably false"?

 

Or, is that statement too just like the post I was commenting on, simply made up, based on nothing more than your own opinion, though stated as fact?

 

If it is "measurably false", then please tell me and the others reading this what that measure is; point to the things in my post that are false and provide evidence as you explain why they are. (That is what I did as I explained the problems with your post.) Thank you.

 

By which measurement is the Bills' defense 19th?

[Formerly Allan in MD]

Like your brick wall to the "3 and out in bunches" theory that was proven to be complete bull ****?

 

They were all healthy when Brady took a **** on them in week two. And for the most part healthy when Andy Dalton did the same a few weeks later.

 

Let's go round and round on this discussion again. Bottom line is Rexs defense has sucked for the most part it's due to his scheme.

 

They bring him back then so be it. The wheels will spin and the team will be mediocre again next year, IMO. But I'm just a fan. I have no control over what they do or don't do.

 

I'll ask them to prove me wrong next year like I did last year and the year before that and the year before that...

Bravo!

Rex !@#$ed up all the good that came from the 2014 defense.

 

Is that better?

With the same players that excelled in 2014.