Jets want another qb. The hots for Trubisky

[BringBackOrton]

 

Hindsight is 20/20, if even. You realize what the Eagles gave up to move up from just 8th overall to 2nd, right? The Bills picked 19th. And Wentz was a projection selection who played in the lesser FCS.

It's not when I said it before the draft.

Edited December 17, 2016 by jmc12290

[run dat back]

Awesome! If the Jets nab Trubisky, then maybe the Bills can pry away Geno Smith from them!

 

To back up Johnny Manziel

[What a Tuel]

 

I can tell you right now that none of the 3 QB's they've drafted in the past 4 years is worth anything. As for next year, they'll pick before the Bills, who will likely take a QB high as well. We'll see who does better.

 

You were actually right the first time. They drafted 4 QB's in 4 years. Every year. Hasn't worked for them.

 

2013 - Geno Smith

2014 - Tajh Boyd

2015 - Bryce Petty

2016 - Christian Hackenberg.

It's not when I said it before the draft.

 

Wentz started out great but he is currently 4 tds and 9 ints in the last 6 games.

 

I really hate when people declare QB's great so quickly. Time will tell. Just like it did with Tannehill RG3 and Luck when people declared it the new age of QB's. 33% accuracy right there.

[BringBackOrton]

 

You were actually right the first time. They drafted 4 QB's in 4 years. Every year. Hasn't worked for them.

 

2013 - Geno Smith

2014 - Tajh Boyd

2015 - Bryce Petty

2016 - Christian Hackenberg.

They are just as close as us to finding their franchise QB, but they actually have a chance of finding one.

[Maury Ballstein]

You were actually right the first time. They drafted 4 QB's in 4 years. Every year. Hasn't worked for them.

 

2013 - Geno Smith

2014 - Tajh Boyd

2015 - Bryce Petty

2016 - Christian Hackenberg.

 

Wentz started out great but he is currently 4 tds and 9 ints in the last 6 games.

 

I really hate when people declare QB's great so quickly. Time will tell. Just like it did with Tannehill RG3 and Luck when people declared it the new age of QB's. 33% accuracy right there.

Wentz will be top tier imo. They will add some weapons at rb and wr over the next few years then it's on.

[Doc]

It's not when I said it before the draft.

 

Even if you said it, the cost to get him would have been exorbitant. And he's not looking so hot right now.

 

You were actually right the first time. They drafted 4 QB's in 4 years. Every year. Hasn't worked for them.

 

2013 - Geno Smith

2014 - Tajh Boyd

2015 - Bryce Petty

2016 - Christian Hackenberg.

 

Wentz started out great but he is currently 4 tds and 9 ints in the last 6 games.

 

I really hate when people declare QB's great so quickly. Time will tell. Just like it did with Tannehill RG3 and Luck when people declared it the new age of QB's. 33% accuracy right there.

 

My bad. Forget about Boyd. So much for that "draft a QB every year" theory.

 

They are just as close as us to finding their franchise QB, but they actually have a chance of finding one.

 

Not really. Again the point is that the "draft a QB every year" theory doesn't work if you can't draft a good one.

[What a Tuel]

Wentz will be top tier imo. They will add some weapons at rb and wr over the next few years then it's on.

 

Like I said, time will tell, but that has been said of many QBs. He is a rookie, and he will have a shot to improve. I'm just saying it isn't guaranteed. I don't think Dak Prescott is guaranteed either. Derek Carr is proving himself right now. That's what these other QB's have to do. Consistency is king.

[BringBackOrton]

 

Even if you said it, the cost to get him would have been exorbitant. And he's not looking so hot right now.

 

Not really. Again the point is that the "draft a QB every year" theory doesn't work if you can't draft a good one.

Wentz is a bust? Philly blew it?

 

Obviously. Who doesn't know that? It's about odds.

 

You can't ever draft a good one if you don't take shots. The main argument against drafting QB's has always been, "you don't get time to develop or evaluate them." That time, is not the reason it's not working in NY. Did Geno or Boyd need some more time to be evaluated?

 

Basically, NY proves that drafting a QB frequently doesn't hinder anybody. You just need to find a good one, and if they take 3-4 to our 1, they have way better odds of getting them.

Edited December 17, 2016 by jmc12290

[What a Tuel]

Wentz is a bust? Philly blew it?

 

Wentz is about a big of a bust as RG3 or Ponder or Luck or Carr or Tannehill or Bradford or Newton or Bortles was in the last 6ish years. You simply can't say for sure at this point. He is showing an ugly side right now, but time will tell.

[Doc]

Wentz is a bust? Philly blew it?

 

Obviously. Who doesn't know that? It's about odds.

 

You can't ever draft a good one if you don't take shots. The main argument against drafting QB's has always been, "you don't get time to develop or evaluate them." That time, is not the reason it's not working in NY. Did Geno or Boyd need some more time to be evaluated?

 

Basically, NY proves that drafting a QB frequently doesn't hinder anybody. You just need to find a good one, and if they take 3-4 to our 1, they have way better odds of getting them.

 

Never said Wentz is a bust or that Philly blew it. I'm saying that he started off hot in his first 4 games (7 TD's and 1 INT) but has largely struggled since then (6 TD's and 11 INT's), as teams have game film on him. Will he improve? Time will tell. And Philly gave up a ton to move up just 6 spots so the Bills couldn't have gotten him unless they gave away the farm.

 

And the point is that drafting a good QB largely takes luck. There are guys who are highly-rated/ytouted every year who bust, while less heralded guys or those with warts succeed. The Jets are no closer to finding their guy after 4 straight years of drafting a QB and will likely take one in the 1st next year. The Bills may as well. Who will succeed? That remains to be seen.

[Mr. WEO]

 

Never said Wentz is a bust or that Philly blew it. I'm saying that he started off hot in his first 4 games (7 TD's and 1 INT) but has largely struggled since then (6 TD's and 11 INT's), as teams have game film on him. Will he improve? Time will tell. And Philly gave up a ton to move up just 6 spots so the Bills couldn't have gotten him unless they gave away the farm.

 

And the point is that drafting a good QB largely takes luck. There are guys who are highly-rated/ytouted every year who bust, while less heralded guys or those with warts succeed. The Jets are no closer to finding their guy after 4 straight years of drafting a QB and will likely take one in the 1st next year. The Bills may as well. Who will succeed? That remains to be seen.

 

Sometimes. Or maybe a decent scouting department and a savvy GM.

[BringBackOrton]

 

Never said Wentz is a bust or that Philly blew it. I'm saying that he started off hot in his first 4 games (7 TD's and 1 INT) but has largely struggled since then (6 TD's and 11 INT's), as teams have game film on him. Will he improve? Time will tell. And Philly gave up a ton to move up just 6 spots so the Bills couldn't have gotten him unless they gave away the farm.

 

And the point is that drafting a good QB largely takes luck. There are guys who are highly-rated/ytouted every year who bust, while less heralded guys or those with warts succeed. The Jets are no closer to finding their guy after 4 straight years of drafting a QB and will likely take one in the 1st next year. The Bills may as well. Who will succeed? That remains to be seen.

Are you arguing my point for me? If every QB prospect is a 1 in a million shot, then the team that drafts 4 instead of 1 has a 4x better chance of finding one. That's how luck works. Do you think they really care that they got Boyd instead of Cyril Richardson? Are you glad that we didn't "waste" a pick on Boyd?

Edited December 17, 2016 by jmc12290

[Doc]

Sometimes. Or maybe a decent scouting department and a savvy GM.

 

Mostly it's luck. If teams that hit on later round picks knew how good those guys would be, they would have taken them much earlier for fear of losing them.

[Doc]

Are you arguing my point for me? If every QB prospect is a 1 in a million shot, then the team that drafts 4 instead of 1 has a 4x better chance of finding one. That's how luck works. Do you think they really care that they got Boyd instead of Cyril Richardson? Are you glad that we didn't "waste" a pick on Boyd?

 

I have no issue with taking a QB later in the draft, looking for that 1-in-a-million shot, like Tahj Boyd. But the Jets used 2-2nd rounders and an early 4th rounder.

[Mr. WEO]

 

Mostly it's luck. If teams that hit on later round picks knew how good those guys would be, they would have taken them much earlier for fear of losing them.

 

No one knows how good anyone will be, so that's not a convincing argument. Also, each team has different needs at draft time.

 

Russell Wilson is a good example (and probably the biggest draft day error the Bills have had in decades). The Bills needed a QB going forward, having only Fitzpatrick as a viable starter on the roster. There is a ton of film on Wilson, who excelled at 2 top programs in college. He had all the gifts: very intelligent, could read defense, great improviser and runner, solid arm.

 

Yet al Nix and Whaley and the scouting team could right on their assessment sheet was "too short". That's it. AND they concluded a much more solid bet (this was only a 3rd round pick we are talking about) was a WR who, before the draft, admitted "people say I can't catch".

 

Yet Pete Carroll (after crushing it with his first and second round picks) had his eye on Wilson in the third--even though the Seahawks had just signed Matt Flynn for 26 million (10 mil guaranteed) as their new starting QB. Did other teams pass on Wilson? Yes. In fact, noted lame brain Andy Reid passed on him twice in the 2nd. He was fired after the season.

 

As I said, you need smart people in the FO.

[YoloinOhio]

Trubisky - Lacking enough of a body of work, only a one year starter. Reminds me of Blake Bortles. Shows pretty good poise in the pocket. Scans the field well. Changes throwing motion to get the ball into lanes around DL'men. Can make all the throws. Has a tendency to hang the deeper passes in the air too much at times, but it hasn't gotten him in trouble yet.

 

Watson - This is the guy I was all in on going into the season, but the QB I saw last year is nowhere to be found. He has been erratic at best, lacked poise in the pocket, and been wildly inaccurate at times.

 

Mahomes - Tyrod II, mark it down. Nice deep ball. Extends plays with his legs. Looks at the incoming rush too much at times. Locks in on one guy in a lot of instances. Can makes plays after extending the play with his legs to throw a ball downfield. Has kind of a quirky Phillip Rivers type throwing motion.

wth - according to all the cfb playoff previews Watson is very accurate and all-world talent. I wish what you say is true, lol! Haven't heard that though.

[Doc]

 

No one knows how good anyone will be, so that's not a convincing argument. Also, each team has different needs at draft time.

 

Russell Wilson is a good example (and probably the biggest draft day error the Bills have had in decades). The Bills needed a QB going forward, having only Fitzpatrick as a viable starter on the roster. There is a ton of film on Wilson, who excelled at 2 top programs in college. He had all the gifts: very intelligent, could read defense, great improviser and runner, solid arm.

 

Yet al Nix and Whaley and the scouting team could right on their assessment sheet was "too short". That's it. AND they concluded a much more solid bet (this was only a 3rd round pick we are talking about) was a WR who, before the draft, admitted "people say I can't catch".

 

Yet Pete Carroll (after crushing it with his first and second round picks) had his eye on Wilson in the third--even though the Seahawks had just signed Matt Flynn for 26 million (10 mil guaranteed) as their new starting QB. Did other teams pass on Wilson? Yes. In fact, noted lame brain Andy Reid passed on him twice in the 2nd. He was fired after the season.

 

As I said, you need smart people in the FO.

 

Wilson is literally a one-in-a-million QB. You can count on one finger how many sub-6' QB's have succeeded in the NFL in the past 30 years. The Seahawks took a shot at him a round earlier than other teams would have and it paid off handsomely.

 

As for "crushing it" with their 1st round pick of Bruce Irving, yeah, not so much. Again if they truly knew how good Wilson would be, they'd have taken him then.

[What a Tuel]

 

No one knows how good anyone will be, so that's not a convincing argument. Also, each team has different needs at draft time.

 

Russell Wilson is a good example (and probably the biggest draft day error the Bills have had in decades). The Bills needed a QB going forward, having only Fitzpatrick as a viable starter on the roster. There is a ton of film on Wilson, who excelled at 2 top programs in college. He had all the gifts: very intelligent, could read defense, great improviser and runner, solid arm.

 

Yet al Nix and Whaley and the scouting team could right on their assessment sheet was "too short". That's it. AND they concluded a much more solid bet (this was only a 3rd round pick we are talking about) was a WR who, before the draft, admitted "people say I can't catch".

 

Yet Pete Carroll (after crushing it with his first and second round picks) had his eye on Wilson in the third--even though the Seahawks had just signed Matt Flynn for 26 million (10 mil guaranteed) as their new starting QB. Did other teams pass on Wilson? Yes. In fact, noted lame brain Andy Reid passed on him twice in the 2nd. He was fired after the season.

 

As I said, you need smart people in the FO.

 

Picking a successful QB like Wilson out of a draft and holding him up is great and all, but I could pick 10 times as many QB's that we didn't pick that still flopped. The argument is that not picking those QB's that flopped is a bad thing because by not doing so we missed out on picking the one that didn't (Wilson). However the odds of picking Wilson from the ones that flopped are ridiculous without hindsight. Scouts didn't give Wilson a chance, the scouts were wrong. The scouts didn't give Hackenberg a good grade, they were likely right.

 

I don't like the argument that we should ignore scouting and draft the duds because one could be a gem. That just sounds awful.

[EasternOHBillsFan]

Awesome! If the Jets nab Trubisky, then maybe the Bills can pry away Geno Smith from them!

 

PLEASE tell me that is sarcasm... I could easily see Rex wanting Geno if he wasn't already so committed to Tyrod. Geno Smith is HOT GARBAGE.

[H2o]

wth - according to all the cfb playoff previews Watson is very accurate and all-world talent. I wish what you say is true, lol! Haven't heard that though.

Nah, he's had a better 2nd half of the year, but he's been plagued by inconsistency and accuracy issues this year. He's not even been close to the Watson of 2015 if you've watched him play. 👍