If Not Rex Then Who ??

[BaaadThingsMan]

I think fans give the Pegula's too much credit as being great owners. Yes, they saved the team from moving, that's great. They haven't accomplished anything noteworthy on the field or the ice yet. Not sure how close they are to getting a playoff team for either franchise either.

they are just getting started

[klos63]

they are just getting started

not off to a good start with either franchise.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

not off to a good start with either franchise.

 

Sabres are FAR better off than the Bills.

[Alphadawg7]

I think fans give the Pegula's too much credit as being great owners. Yes, they saved the team from moving, that's great. They haven't accomplished anything noteworthy on the field or the ice yet. Not sure how close they are to getting a playoff team for either franchise either.

 

Ok, its statements like this that I find absurd. You dont know how close? Well lets see, last year we were close to the playoffs and challenged late despite the fact we had our starting QB miss 2 games (2 games that EJ lost us bringing us down to .500, Taylor had a winning record), our WR's 1-5 all go down with injuries, some for season or long periods of time, our best player McCoy miss games and battle a bad hammy most the season, lose ALL of the RB's on our roster to the point we had to sign guys off the street to start games because we didn't have a single healthy RB, had our prize DE quit on the team essentially, etc etc.

 

Now this year, we are still challenging late (I know its a long shot now after Raider game) for a playoff spot despite having Sammy out most the season and playing hurt in every game he has played while also missing Woods for a good chunk of the season, Harvin did nothing, and losing several other WR's to injuries...and of course McCoy missed almost 3 between sitting a game out and exiting early in 2 games, and we lost our best OL Wood for the season to go along with other injuries to our other good OL.

 

So, the reality is...Whaley and the Pegulas do have this team "close" to the playoffs. We got woefully screwed in Seattle, otherwise we likely have a winning record now. Roman killed us the first 2 weeks, or once again, we likely have a winning record right now if Lynn had been the OC all year as the offense is significantly better under him than what Roman showed the first 2 weeks.

 

The roster is good enough to make the playoffs, but we have had most of our best starters go down with long and lingering injuries, and that is a LOT to overcome. Sure, there are other factors to the season like Tyrod missing opportunities, D breaking down, our DB's getting torched too often, etc...but overall, this team as is could win double digit games, but it can't do that if it doesnt have its best players on the field. Hopefully next year, we settle our QB decision (Tyrod needs to show he can be better these next 4 games) and we can fill some holes at WR, S, and CB to help round out the team and have a healthy Sammy for the season.

[klos63]

 

Sabres are FAR better off than the Bills.

Part of me agrees with you, but we are still in last place, or just above Toronto. Kinda weak at defense, unsure of goalies... forwards starting to look better. I'm more optimistic about the Sabres than the Bills. I don't have faith in Rex, and if he does, it may set things back a bit.

 

Ok, its statements like this that I find absurd. You dont know how close? Well lets see, last year we were close to the playoffs and challenged late despite the fact we had our starting QB miss 2 games (2 games that EJ lost us bringing us down to .500, Taylor had a winning record), our WR's 1-5 all go down with injuries, some for season or long periods of time, our best player McCoy miss games and battle a bad hammy most the season, lose ALL of the RB's on our roster to the point we had to sign guys off the street to start games because we didn't have a single healthy RB, had our prize DE quit on the team essentially, etc etc.

 

Now this year, we are still challenging late (I know its a long shot now after Raider game) for a playoff spot despite having Sammy out most the season and playing hurt in every game he has played while also missing Woods for a good chunk of the season, Harvin did nothing, and losing several other WR's to injuries...and of course McCoy missed almost 3 between sitting a game out and exiting early in 2 games, and we lost our best OL Wood for the season to go along with other injuries to our other good OL.

 

So, the reality is...Whaley and the Pegulas do have this team "close" to the playoffs. We got woefully screwed in Seattle, otherwise we likely have a winning record now. Roman killed us the first 2 weeks, or once again, we likely have a winning record right now if Lynn had been the OC all year as the offense is significantly better under him than what Roman showed the first 2 weeks.

 

The roster is good enough to make the playoffs, but we have had most of our best starters go down with long and lingering injuries, and that is a LOT to overcome. Sure, there are other factors to the season like Tyrod missing opportunities, D breaking down, our DB's getting torched too often, etc...but overall, this team as is could win double digit games, but it can't do that if it doesnt have its best players on the field. Hopefully next year, we settle our QB decision (Tyrod needs to show he can be better these next 4 games) and we can fill some holes at WR, S, and CB to help round out the team and have a healthy Sammy for the season.

by your logic, every team is 'close' to the playoffs. Basically, we need to settle our QB situation, fill holes at WR, S and CB.... you forgot RT. So we have major holes to fill in order to maybe make the playoffs. I'm not too thrilled right now.

[BringBackOrton]

 

Ok, its statements like this that I find absurd. You dont know how close? Well lets see, last year we were close to the playoffs and challenged late despite the fact we had our starting QB miss 2 games (2 games that EJ lost us bringing us down to .500, Taylor had a winning record), our WR's 1-5 all go down with injuries, some for season or long periods of time, our best player McCoy miss games and battle a bad hammy most the season, lose ALL of the RB's on our roster to the point we had to sign guys off the street to start games because we didn't have a single healthy RB, had our prize DE quit on the team essentially, etc etc.

 

Now this year, we are still challenging late (I know its a long shot now after Raider game) for a playoff spot despite having Sammy out most the season and playing hurt in every game he has played while also missing Woods for a good chunk of the season, Harvin did nothing, and losing several other WR's to injuries...and of course McCoy missed almost 3 between sitting a game out and exiting early in 2 games, and we lost our best OL Wood for the season to go along with other injuries to our other good OL.

 

So, the reality is...Whaley and the Pegulas do have this team "close" to the playoffs. We got woefully screwed in Seattle, otherwise we likely have a winning record now. Roman killed us the first 2 weeks, or once again, we likely have a winning record right now if Lynn had been the OC all year as the offense is significantly better under him than what Roman showed the first 2 weeks.

 

The roster is good enough to make the playoffs, but we have had most of our best starters go down with long and lingering injuries, and that is a LOT to overcome. Sure, there are other factors to the season like Tyrod missing opportunities, D breaking down, our DB's getting torched too often, etc...but overall, this team as is could win double digit games, but it can't do that if it doesnt have its best players on the field. Hopefully next year, we settle our QB decision (Tyrod needs to show he can be better these next 4 games) and we can fill some holes at WR, S, and CB to help round out the team and have a healthy Sammy for the season.

The excuse train goes choo choo.

 

The Pegulas effectively destroyed any progress we had in our best season in a decade (2014), by making mistakes. They are unequivocally to blame for our sucky defense and our team treading water.

 

Also, "close" in 2015 is a total joke. We were destroyed in our do-or-die game and looked like we were sleep walking, then beat a garbage team and played spoiler to get to .500.

Edited December 9, 2016 by jmc12290

[BaaadThingsMan]

not off to a good start with either franchise.

I disagree. They took the patient approach with both franchises. After an initial review period they cleaned house with the Sabres and have them on the right track for sustained success.

 

As far as the Bills go, its early in their tenure and they are taking the same approach, patience. By looking for a "football czar" they are showing that they are willing to make the changes they see fit to make and it's similiar to what they did with the Sabres during their GM search which worked out pretty well.

[klos63]

I disagree. They took the patient approach with both franchises. After an initial review period they cleaned house with the Sabres and have them on the right track for sustained success.

 

As far as the Bills go, its early in their tenure and they are taking the same approach, patience. By looking for a "football czar" they are showing that they are willing to make the changes they see fit to make and it's similiar to what they did with the Sabres during their GM search which worked out pretty well.

I guess I look at things differently, maybe having watched these teams for over 40 years has me a little more results oriented. The first big decision was to hire Rex and give him 5 years... I think that's a big mistake. With the Sabres, should have let go of Regier immediately, hiring Lafontaine and Nolan was a joke. He went for good PR, not good quality. I think I like Murray, but the Winnipeg trade will likely turn out a loser, Lehner is still up in the air, and we really need to turn it on soon to have a legitimate playoff chance. It's too soon to say the Sabres on the right track for sustained success and the Bills have huge question marks with the HC and QB, not a good place for question marks.

[Alphadawg7]

Part of me agrees with you, but we are still in last place, or just above Toronto. Kinda weak at defense, unsure of goalies... forwards starting to look better. I'm more optimistic about the Sabres than the Bills. I don't have faith in Rex, and if he does, it may set things back a bit.

by your logic, every team is 'close' to the playoffs. Basically, we need to settle our QB situation, fill holes at WR, S and CB.... you forgot RT. So we have major holes to fill in order to maybe make the playoffs. I'm not too thrilled right now.

 

When you are a .500 team, you are clearly close to the playoffs as another game or two can get you in. That is close. And when you factor in the loss of your best players both those seasons for large chunks of those seasons, and playing hurt the times they are on the field...well then you realize this team is closer than many doom and gloomers love to state and over exaggerate. This board over reacts to each situation and put the last 16 years on a regime that has only been here 2.

 

All I ever here about is the 16 years when it comes to this current team. I dont care about this teams 16 years of misery...logic doesnt care about it...reality doesnt care about it...the present doesnt care about it. No one on this roster and barely anyone in the FO had anything to do with any of that time, it has zero relevancy.

 

The reality is we have toyed with the playoffs despite a ton of bad luck to our best players. Add in the fact that Roman was clearly a problem and a heavy contributed to our slow start and the Seattle screw job (and I dont ever complain about Refs, but that was the biggest screw job I have seen in a long time and we should have been the winners) and you can see this team can compete for the playoffs.

 

As far as filling holes, we also dont need a great player at every position on the field to be a playoff team or even a SB winner. We need more WR depth for sure as injuries have killed us there 2 years in a row and have been brutal. We need a S because an injury likely ended the career of our best one, but its not like we wont go anywhere if we dont find a pro bowler or something. And sure, we can use an upgrade at RT but we can also be fine without as this offense has shown it can be one of the highest scoring in the league with what we have.

Edited December 9, 2016 by Alphadawg7

[CodeMonkey]

I guess I look at things differently, maybe having watched these teams for over 40 years has me a little more results oriented. The first big decision was to hire Rex and give him 5 years... I think that's a big mistake. With the Sabres, should have let go of Regier immediately, hiring Lafontaine and Nolan was a joke. He went for good PR, not good quality. I think I like Murray, but the Winnipeg trade will likely turn out a loser, Lehner is still up in the air, and we really need to turn it on soon to have a legitimate playoff chance. It's too soon to say the Sabres on the right track for sustained success and the Bills have huge question marks with the HC and QB, not a good place for question marks.

 

I absolutely agree with everything you said, particularly on Ryans contract and Regier, except for 2 things.

1) Nothing up in the air about Lehner to me. He at best is a backup goalie at the NHL level.

2) I have written them off (sabres) for playoffs this season.

[klos63]

 

When you are a .500 team, you are clearly close to the playoffs as another game or two can get you in. That is close. And when you factor in the loss of your BEST players both those seasons for large chunks of those seasons, and playing hurt the times they are on the field...well then you realize this team is closer than many doom and gloomers love to state and over exaggerate. This board over reacts to each situation and put the last 16 years on a regime that has only been here 2.

 

All I ever here about is the 16 years when it comes to this current team. I dont care about this teams 16 years of misery...logic doesnt care about it...reality doesnt care about it...the present doesnt care about it. No one on this roster and barely anyone in the FO had anything to do with any of that time, it has zero relevancy.

 

The reality is we have toyed with the playoffs despite a ton of bad luck to our best players. Add in the fact that Roman was clearly a problem and a heavy contributed to our slow start and the Seattle screw job (and I dont ever complain about Refs, but that was the biggest screw job I have seen in a long time and we should have been the winners) and you can see this team can compete for the playoffs. So to say we are not close is just a bunch of whining nonsense from 16 years of missing the playoffs and isn't reflective of the reality of whether or not this team is close to the playoffs.

 

And news flash, you dont need a great player at every position on the field to be a playoff team or even a SB winner. So to act like we must fill the holes with good players at WR, S, CB and RT to do so is ridiculous. We need more WR depth for sure as injuries have killed us there 2 years in a row and have been brutal. We need a S because an injury likely ended the career of our best one, but its not like we wont go anywhere if we dont find a pro bowler or something. And sure, we can use an upgrade at RT but we can also be fine without as this offense has shown it can be one of the highest scoring in the league with what we have.

Don't quite know how to respond to this, but I think this line of yours says it all. "So to act like we must fill the holes with good players at WR, S, CB and RT to do so is ridiculous." I have egg on my face, I actually fell for your act. I thought you were being serious. Jokes on me.

 

I absolutely agree with everything you said, particularly on Ryans contract and Regier, except for 2 things.

1) Nothing up in the air about Lehner to me. He at best is a backup goalie at the NHL level.

2) I have written them off (sabres) for playoffs this season.

I'm a little more optimistic than you are, just a little though.

[Alphadawg7]

You know what I find interesting...is that people clamor for a certain player, or a better player at a particular position. They essentially acknowledge it takes talent on the field to win games. But then those same people completely disregard the impact of injuries to our good players and say blanket statements like "All teams have injuries" even though no teams injuries are the same as the next. Losing backups or ST's guys isn't the same as losing stud WR's, good OL, your top 4 WR's, one of the best RB's in the NFL, your elite DT, your only decent Safety, your starting DB's, the NFL sack leader, your top 2 draft picks expected to start and pay big roles, etc etc.

 

So how can some of you sit back and say we need this and that and its all Whaleys fault, and at the same time completely ignore and disregard the impact of having our best talent off the field for large chunks of the season due to injuries and suspensions?

[BringBackOrton]

You know what I find interesting...is that people clamor for a certain player, or a better player at a particular position. They essentially acknowledge it takes talent on the field to win games. But then those same people completely disregard the impact of injuries to our good players and say blanket statements like "All teams have injuries" even though no teams injuries are the same as the next. Losing backups or ST's guys isn't the same as losing stud WR's, good OL, your top 4 WR's, one of the best RB's in the NFL, your elite DT, your only decent Safety, your starting DB's, the NFL sack leader, your top 2 draft picks expected to start and pay big roles, etc etc.

 

So how can some of you sit back and say we need this and that and its all Whaleys fault, and at the same time completely ignore and disregard the impact of having our best talent off the field for large chunks of the season due to injuries and suspensions?

Because other teams have had similar amount of injuries and are successful. If no one on this team got hurt but Taylor, you'd say "a starting QB is worth more than anyone else on the roster and that's why we're losing."

[Alphadawg7]

Don't quite know how to respond to this, but I think this line of yours says it all. "So to act like we must fill the holes with good players at WR, S, CB and RT to do so is ridiculous." I have egg on my face, I actually fell for your act. I thought you were being serious. Jokes on me.

I'm a little more optimistic than you are, just a little though.

 

If you notice in your reply to me, the one you replied to was edited. After I wrote I realized I was responding in one post to two different people in my head and edited my reply to me more appropriate to your post. It was on me, my bad, and I made the edit. Even the quote you put in there I had already taken out. My apologies, and that is also why I had already made the edit.

[klos63]

You know what I find interesting...is that people clamor for a certain player, or a better player at a particular position. They essentially acknowledge it takes talent on the field to win games. But then those same people completely disregard the impact of injuries to our good players and say blanket statements like "All teams have injuries" even though no teams injuries are the same as the next. Losing backups or ST's guys isn't the same as losing stud WR's, good OL, your top 4 WR's, one of the best RB's in the NFL, your elite DT, your only decent Safety, your starting DB's, the NFL sack leader, your top 2 draft picks expected to start and pay big roles, etc etc.

 

So how can some of you sit back and say we need this and that and its all Whaleys fault, and at the same time completely ignore and disregard the impact of having our best talent off the field for large chunks of the season due to injuries and suspensions?

So what happened in the 2nd half against the Raiders that didn't happen in the first half. And remember , the Raiders were missing starters on defense.

 

If you notice in your reply to me, the one you replied to was edited. After I wrote I realized I was responding in one post to two different people in my head and edited my reply to me more appropriate to your post. It was on me, my bad, and I made the edit. Even the quote you put in there I had already taken out. My apologies, and that is also why I had already made the edit.

fair enough. ok.

[Formerly Allan in MD]

First, beg belichick to come. Offer him whatever he wants. When he laughs in their face, immediately call Jim Harbaugh and do the same.

When he laughs in their face, offer him more. What about Mike McCarthy?

[Alphadawg7]

Because other teams have had similar amount of injuries and are successful. If no one on this team got hurt but Taylor, you'd say "a starting QB is worth more than anyone else on the roster and that's why we're losing."

 

Can you read dude? I just said no two teams injuries are the same.

 

Do me a favor, stand by your points. I would like you show me a playoff team that has lost its 1, 2, 3, and #4 WR's...its starting C, its other good OL, an Elite top 3 DT, the NFL sack leader, its starting S, its starting DB, one of the 3 best RB's in the NFL that is a lock for the playoffs, its top 2 draft pick starters, etc. Most those players have missed more than 1 game, and some have missed large chunks of the season and even the whole season.

 

Show me one. Just one, that has lost that many key players and is in the playoffs. You can't, so stop already with this non sense.

[BringBackOrton]

 

Can you read dude? I just said no two teams injuries are the same.

 

Do me a favor, stand by your points. I would like you show me a playoff team that has lost its 1, 2, 3, and #4 WR's...its starting C, its other good OL, an Elite top 3 DT, the NFL sack leader, its starting S, its starting DB, one of the 3 best RB's in the NFL that is a lock for the playoffs, its top 2 draft pick starters, etc. Most those players have missed more than 1 game, and some have missed large chunks of the season and even the whole season.

 

Show me one. Just one, that has lost that many key players and is in the playoffs. You can't, so stop already with this non sense.

We didn't lose all those players for the year. You're being hysterical.

[Alphadawg7]

So what happened in the 2nd half against the Raiders that didn't happen in the first half. And remember , the Raiders were missing starters on defense.

fair enough. ok.

 

I am not saying without injuries we go 16-0. What I am saying is that to clamor for more talent and to also disregard the impact of when that talent is missing doesnt make sense. We have lost a lot of talent this year, and a lot of starters that we can't afford to lose. Its already hard to win in the AFC, especially when you are in our division. To also expect this team to withstand that significant amount of losses its had to its core players, not reserves, not backups, not special teams guys...but its entire core and best players is asking a LOT and not commonly over come. To disregard that makes no sense, especially if you are someone who thinks the solution is to get more good players. How about having our current good players on the field, dont you think that would help?

 

And the Raider game was against a really good team, and we got lucky more in the first half like when they only got 3 points when they dropped a gimme TD in the end zone. We came out and got 2 quick scores, but they have an Elite offense and the moment we stalled that offense came roaring down the defense.

We didn't lose all those players for the year. You're being hysterical.

Ragland, Wood, AW are not out for the season? 2 key starters and a rookie brought in to be a key player? Ragland missed the whole season, AW the bulk of it, and Wood half of it.

 

And I did NOT say all those players were out for the season...so once again, instead of blasting around blanket statements, show me ONE team in the playoffs that has lost as many starters and key players we have at similar positions. Just one...and again you can't.

[BringBackOrton]

The Ravens have lot more players, and lost better quality players, and are leading their division.

 

I am not saying without injuries we go 16-0. What I am saying is that to clamor for more talent and to also disregard the impact of when that talent is missing doesnt make sense. We have lost a lot of talent this year, and a lot of starters that we can't afford to lose. Its already hard to win in the AFC, especially when you are in our division. To also expect this team to withstand that significant amount of losses its had to its core players, not reserves, not backups, not special teams guys...but its entire core and best players is asking a LOT and not commonly over come. To disregard that makes no sense, especially if you are someone who thinks the solution is to get more good players. How about having our current good players on the field, dont you think that would help?

 

And the Raider game was against a really good team, and we got lucky more in the first half like when they only got 3 points when they dropped a gimme TD in the end zone. We came out and got 2 quick scores, but they have an Elite offense and the moment we stalled that offense came roaring down the defense.

Ragland, Wood, AW are not out for the season? 2 key starters and a rookie brought in to be a key player? Ragland missed the whole season, AW the bulk of it, and Wood half of it.

 

And I did NOT say all those players were out for the season...so once again, instead of blasting around blanket statements, show me ONE team in the playoffs that has lost as many starters and key players we have at similar positions. Just one...and again you can't.

The Ravens. You keep saying "lost" as though they are all done. Miller missing a Q does not count as a "lost" starter unless you're being hysterical.

Edited December 9, 2016 by jmc12290