Reks Ryan Posted November 28, 2016 Posted November 28, 2016 I think 3rd down conversion is something that definitely needs improvement and it will automatically improve other areas. As for the total drives, are we so low bc the opposing team sustains their drives on us and we dont get the ball back as often as other teams? Is that what that # entails? Yes the Bills are 22nd in 3rd down defense allowing over 42% of the time. And it sure seems like most of those are 3rd and 6 or more. The inability for the D to get off the field has been worse than the Offense's difficulty sustaining drives. BTW Miami is 1st in 3rd down D only allowing 33% and Oakland is 4th @ 35%.
Big Turk Posted November 28, 2016 Posted November 28, 2016 (edited) What concerns me about this chart (it's sortable) is Tyrod's 11 TD passes. I respect that he's done well with not turning the ball over. I'm not bashing him. But when "protecting the ball" becomes your claim to fame, there simply has to be more to it. Tyrod has the same numbers as Wilson does in Seattle...11 TDs and 4 INTs...why isn't he getting bashed? Cause his defense bails him out all the time when he puts up crap numbers? Edited November 28, 2016 by matter2003
section122 Posted November 29, 2016 Posted November 29, 2016 Tyrod has the same numbers as Wilson does in Seattle...11 TDs and 4 INTs...why isn't he getting bashed? Cause his defense bails him out all the time when he puts up crap numbers? I've done it myself but people should compare the start of Wilson's career with the start of tyrods. They are very similar. I think most if not all would be very happy to have Wilson starting for the Bills.
fansince88 Posted November 29, 2016 Posted November 29, 2016 (edited) What concerns me about this chart (it's sortable) is Tyrod's 11 TD passes. I respect that he's done well with not turning the ball over. I'm not bashing him. But when "protecting the ball" becomes your claim to fame, there simply has to be more to it. 15 Russell Wilson SEA 11 4 7 2.8 16 Tyrod Taylor BUF 11 4 7 2.8 Interesting stats.......Pretty comparable one is a SB champ and on is aspiring to be. Not that any of this means anything but I think you would have given up on Russell Wilson. Just saying. LGM and LGB! Edited November 29, 2016 by fansince88
Mango Posted November 29, 2016 Posted November 29, 2016 Adding in rushing TDs he is 4:1 tds to ints. That is something special. I knew the stat posted by jtsp was wrong but it still piqued my interest to do some digging. Tyrod is 23rd in the league in passing tds. Tied with "elite" Joe Flacco. Tyrod is 38th in passing attempts per game. 33rd if you limit it to 200+ passes. Tyrod is 15th in the league in rushing tds. More than Todd Gurley and Leveon Bell. Tyrod is 32nd in Rushing yards per game if you limit it to 70+ rushes or 37th if you don't. If you're going to do it for TT, make sure you add Dak, Newton, Rogers, Dalton, Smith,Bree's, Flacco, and Mariotta. About half of those are already ahead of TT. You can't add to one and not the group.
NoSaint Posted November 29, 2016 Posted November 29, 2016 Tyrod has the same numbers as Wilson does in Seattle...11 TDs and 4 INTs...why isn't he getting bashed? Cause his defense bails him out all the time when he puts up crap numbers? Because people are saying "wow that normally pretty good qb with a track record of better play is being hobbled by injury but they are still winning" instead of "that qb that runs hot and cold and has known deficiencies is suffering from not being able to overcome said deficiencies"
Samwell Tarly Posted November 29, 2016 Posted November 29, 2016 I've tried to hate him. I just can't. It's easier than you think. Let the hate flow through you..
Big Turk Posted November 29, 2016 Posted November 29, 2016 There's a middle-ground. I don't believe if this team has Marcus Mariota under center, we only call 17 pass plays per game. Maybe we call only 24-26, but there's no way we take the ball out of his hands for quarters of a game. Not to mention it's a chicken and egg scenario. Are we super run dominant because we are deficient at QB and it's worked out for us? Or it's worked and in reality TT can actually shine as a passer? I tend to the former. A different game, but Michigan didn't run the offense they did with Denard Robinson just because they scored a lot. To your question, no. Because that stat doesn't tell the whole story. EJ put us in the top 5 for scoring over the two weeks he played last season and you'd "expect" us to have been in a winning team if that was the only stat you got. When you throw the rest of the stats in the pot, as well as what you see with your eyes, we're right were I expected to be. Some games where we hit a bunch of HR's and blow teams out. Other games where we sputter for 3Q's and our defense dies on the field. And right around .500. Except we aren't talking about 2 weeks,we are talking about 25 weeks and the numbers are similar from last year to this year...
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted November 29, 2016 Posted November 29, 2016 So as has been pointed out the data for this list was completely wrong as there are really only 12 QB's with a TD/Int of greater than 3.0 and TT is #17. Looking at that list, if you were to ask 100 people to name the top three QB's over the past say five years, likely the names of Beg Ben, Brady, Brees, and Rodgers would be on everyone's list. So if anything when looking at those names, that tells me not turning over the ball absolutely IS an indicator of a top QB. Not saying TT is anywhere near those names, but when you add in that the Bills are one of the top scoring teams over the past two seasons, that does start to say, maybe TT isn't nearly as bad as some are making him out to be. If anything the Bills are losing games due to poor defensive play as they are scoring enough points for most teams to win with. I'm, no TT lover, if the Bills could find a better QB I'm all for it, but doubt that is going to happen as there just aren't enough to go around. But do find it kind of funny in that the purpose of this thread was to point out how bad TT is, but if anything this data shows he really is something special and likely needs to be kept here as not going to find anyone better. So thank you for starting this thread in support of TT!! 27 starting QB have a 3:1 TD:Int ratio or better. 27. So, it kinda looks like not turning the ball over isn't necessarily an indicator of a solid NFL starter. It looks like it's a quality just about EVERY qb has. Not hardly. 2 or better is close. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2016/passing.htm NAME Team Age Pos G GS Cmp Att Cmp% Yds TD TD% Int Int% TD/INT Ratio Rate QBR Sk Yds Tom Brady NWE 39 qb 7 7 175 256 68.4 2201 18 7 1 0.4 18.0 116.7 89 11 62 Dak Prescott DAL 23 QB 11 11 231 340 67.9 2835 18 5.3 2 0.6 9.0 108.6 82.8 15 89 Derek Carr OAK 25 QB 11 11 281 423 66.4 3115 22 5.2 5 1.2 4.4 100.5 62.8 13 50 Matt Ryan ATL 31 QB 11 11 262 380 68.9 3516 26 6.8 6 1.6 4.3 114.3 85.3 27 182 Sam Bradford MIN 29 QB 10 10 248 348 71.3 2415 12 3.4 3 0.9 4.0 98.3 72.9 26 189 Mat Stafford DET 28 QB 11 11 261 391 66.8 2883 19 4.9 5 1.3 3.8 99.3 70.1 25 147 Drew Brees NOR 37 QB 11 11 326 456 71.5 3587 30 6.6 8 1.8 3.8 109.1 66.1 18 123 Aaron Rodgers GNB 33 QB 10 10 259 410 63.2 2761 25 6.1 7 1.7 3.6 96 72.9 24 157 C. Kaepernick SFO 29 qb 7 6 115 208 55.3 1440 10 4.8 3 1.4 3.3 87 73.2 18 110 Roethlisberger PIT 34 QB 10 10 242 373 64.9 2745 23 6.2 7 1.9 3.3 99.5 73.5 14 123 Marcus Mariota TEN 23 QB 12 12 243 378 64.3 2998 25 6.6 8 2.1 3.1 101.9 54.4 18 129 Cody Kessler CLE 23 qb 8 8 126 192 65.6 1369 6 3.1 2 1 3.0 92.6 55.6 19 129 Jared Goff LAR 22 qb 3 2 37 63 58.7 348 3 4.8 1 1.6 3.0 83.3 4 45 Kirk Cousins WAS 28 QB 11 11 299 437 68.4 3540 20 4.6 7 1.6 2.9 101.4 58.2 14 108 Russell Wilson SEA 28 QB 11 11 238 368 64.7 2865 11 3 4 1.1 2.8 93.9 59.6 26 205 Tyrod Taylor BUF 27 QB 11 11 193 313 61.7 2101 11 3.5 4 1.3 2.8 87.8 67.3 30 136 Alex Smith KAN 32 QB 10 10 229 346 66.2 2297 10 2.9 4 1.2 2.5 89.7 50.7 24 124 Andrew Luck IND 27 QB 10 10 236 375 62.9 2827 19 5.1 8 2.1 2.4 93.9 68.3 35 219 Trevor Siemian DEN 24 QB 10 10 195 325 60 2396 15 4.6 7 2.2 2.1 89.2 55.2 24 136 Eli Manning NYG 35 QB 11 11 261 413 63.2 2902 20 4.8 10 2.4 2.0 90.1 60.2 13 75 Andy Dalton CIN 29 QB 11 11 259 408 63.5 3043 12 2.9 6 1.5 2.0 89.7 64.5 32 188 Jameis Winston TAM 22 QB 11 11 249 406 61.3 2900 22 5.4 11 2.7 2.0 89.7 59.7 23 155 Paxton Lynch DEN 22 qb 2 1 37 59 62.7 393 2 3.4 1 1.7 2.0 86.3 38.1 7 40 Philip Rivers SDG 35 QB 11 11 251 399 62.9 3128 23 5.8 12 3 1.9 93.9 74.4 26 142 Ryan Tannehill MIA 28 QB 11 11 217 329 66 2574 15 4.6 8 2.4 1.9 94.7 43.1 26 194 Cam Newton CAR 27 QB 10 10 189 338 55.9 2432 13 3.8 8 2.4 1.6 81.6 56 27 208 Carson Wentz PHI 24 QB 10 10 225 356 63.2 2339 11 3.1 7 2 1.6 84.2 54.1 21 118 Blake Bortles JAX 24 QB 11 11 263 441 59.6 2749 20 4.5 13 2.9 1.5 80.6 50.6 23 132 Carson Palmer ARI 37 QB 10 10 252 414 60.9 2931 15 3.6 11 2.7 1.4 83.3 51.2 32 222 Joe Flacco BAL 31 QB 11 11 285 450 63.3 2877 11 2.4 10 2.2 1.1 80.4 57.1 23 176 Josh McCowan CLE 37 qb 5 3 90 165 54.5 1100 6 3.6 6 3.6 1.0 72.3 63.8 18 126 Landry Jones PIT 27 qb 6 1 29 49 59.2 281 1 2 1 2 1.0 73.6 3.3 0 0 Drew Stanton ARI 32 qb 4 1 17 44 38.6 184 2 4.5 2 4.5 1.0 47.9 27.6 1 8 Bryce Petty NYJ 25 qb 2 1 21 34 61.8 182 1 2.9 1 2.9 1.0 73.4 1 6 Brock Osweiler HOU 26 QB 11 11 238 400 59.5 2307 12 3 13 3.3 0.9 72.2 50 20 152 Blaine Gabbert SFO 27 qb 5 5 87 150 58 890 5 3.3 6 4 0.8 69.6 62 10 40 Case Keenum LAR 28 qb 9 9 191 313 61 2169 9 2.9 11 3.5 0.8 76.8 46.4 23 140 Jay Cutler CHI 33 qb 5 5 81 137 59.1 1059 4 2.9 5 3.6 0.8 78.1 40.4 17 104 R Fitzpatrick NYJ 34 qb 10 9 190 330 57.6 2252 10 3 13 3.9 0.8 72.2 55.9 18 73 Matt Barkley CHI 26 qb 2 1 34 69 49.3 397 3 4.3 4 5.8 0.8 57.5 1 10 Derek Anderson CAR 33 qb 3 1 36 52 69.2 453 2 3.8 4 7.7 0.5 76.8 28.3 0 0 Scott Tolzien IND 29 qb 1 1 22 36 61.1 205 1 2.8 2 5.6 0.5 62.8 3 21 Brian Hoyer CHI 31 qb 6 5 134 200 67 1445 6 3 0 0 6 TDs 0 INTs 98 63.7 4 18 Jimmy Garoppolo NWE 25 qb 4 2 42 60 70 496 4 6.7 0 0 4 TDs 0 INTs 117.1 91.6 3 15 Nick Foles KAN 27 qb 2 1 36 55 65.5 410 3 5.5 0 0 3 TDs 0 INTs 105.9 4 34 Jacoby Brissett NWE 24 qb 3 2 34 55 61.8 400 0 0 0 0 0 TDs 0 INTs 83.9 48 6 46
r00tabaga Posted November 29, 2016 Posted November 29, 2016 Okay so I missed this one. JSP is actually giving Tyrod credit? Cuz his 2.8 td/int % is better than Cam, Flacco, Tanny, Blake, Daulton, Luck, Carson, Jameis, Eli, etc, etc. Oops.
3rdand12 Posted November 29, 2016 Posted November 29, 2016 It's easier than you think. Let the hate flow through you.. om
boyst Posted November 29, 2016 Posted November 29, 2016 The guy eats nothing but organic mushrooms and avocado ice cream. Who would want to live that way anyway.he also sucks richard
rockpile Posted November 29, 2016 Posted November 29, 2016 A valid criticism. And the last time I make that mistake Today?
Buffalo_Stampede Posted November 29, 2016 Posted November 29, 2016 (edited) Tyrod Taylor has 16 total TDs and 5 total turnovers. In 25 starts he has 40 total TDs and 12 total turnovers. The Bills haven't had a QB close to this efficiency ever. He isnt the best passer, but people need to back off him. Edited November 29, 2016 by TheTruthHurts
MAJBobby Posted November 29, 2016 Posted November 29, 2016 Tyrod Taylor has 16 total TDs and 5 total turnovers. In 25 starts he has 40 total TDs and 12 total turnovers. The Bills haven't had a QB close to this efficiency ever. He isnt the best passer, but people need to back off him. Why? Because our QB isn't the best passer so we need to back off because he is so risk adverse he doesn't take shots. Ok nah but thanks for the advice
Dr. K Posted November 29, 2016 Posted November 29, 2016 Well it is true that 22 have a ratio of 2.0 or better.
Simon Posted November 29, 2016 Posted November 29, 2016 Why? Because our QB isn't the best passer so we need to back off because he is so risk adverse he doesn't take shots. Ok nah but thanks for the advice Sometimes having a guy who is too worried about the turnover is just as bad as having a guy who isn't worried enough
Kirby Jackson Posted November 30, 2016 Posted November 30, 2016 Why? Because our QB isn't the best passer so we need to back off because he is so risk adverse he doesn't take shots. Ok nah but thanks for the adviceI think that the point was more 40 TDs to 12 INTs isn't worth the criticism that he gets. I tend to agree. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but there aren't a lot of guys that are accounting for almost 4 times as many TDs as turnovers. Again, it doesn't mean that he is perfect but there are a lot of teams that would love to have that ratio.
MAJBobby Posted November 30, 2016 Posted November 30, 2016 I think that the point was more 40 TDs to 12 INTs isn't worth the criticism that he gets. I tend to agree. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but there aren't a lot of guys that are accounting for almost 4 times as many TDs as turnovers. Again, it doesn't mean that he is perfect but there are a lot of teams that would love to have that ratio. 31 to 12 is a 2.58 ratio passing the ball. And yes a lot of QBs in the NFL have that ratio passing the ball and are nearly not as risk adverse with throwing the football.
Kirby Jackson Posted November 30, 2016 Posted November 30, 2016 31 to 12 is a 2.58 ratio passing the ball. And yes a lot of QBs in the NFL have that ratio passing the ball and are nearly not as risk adverse with throwing the football.So we are deciding that the stats when he carries the ball don't count even though that it a central part of what he does? Why should we exclude fumbles and TD runs when he is asked to be a ball carrier? No one holds that against Cam....
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