Gilmore Thread

[thebandit27]

This was Gilmores assignment, if you look pre-snap and how fast Darby goes to the flat. Im not gonna crucify Gilmore off this one brain fart.

Might be worth another look...Darby was clearly playing zone, while Gilmore, NRC, Graham, and both Browns were in man (Zack was spying Kaep).

 

I think it's more likely that the one screwed up than the other 5.

[P51]

OK, great breakdown, but you fail to mention who Gilmore was covering if Darby f'd up? Because Gilmore had nothing but space around him on that play.

Thank you, Gilmore was covering #17 Dres Anderson who ran the quick/speed out (1 route as bandito pointed out) which is usually the main read on that route combination from what I know T. Smith clears out deep drawing the single high safety and field corner away deep, Patton (not Kerley...) takes the pressing corner inside and picks (NE who?) or forces the inside boundary cb to run over the top of him in man coverage, while the inside wr runs scot free on the quick out like he did on this play with Gilmore being put in a tough spot by design, notice how Anderson delays running his route, waiting for the other WRs to run infront of Gilmore before accelerating into his route, usually it's meant to attack the eye discipline of a particular db giving him 2 things obstructing his vision on his actual assignment, IMO it's a great play design as if the coverage goes deep like it should have, the guy in the flat is wide open meant to beat the man coverage but the coverage roles up mistakenly and Kap sees it, boom TD. There is no coverage I have ever heard of or seen where the inside CB in trips coverage has the coverage on the outside wr running any deep route in man. IMO Gilmore looks lost in space on that play by offensive design knowing Buffalo mans up a lot. 🤗

Might be worth another look...Darby was clearly playing zone, while Gilmore, NRC, Graham, and both Browns were in man (Zack was spying Kaep).

 

I think it's more likely that the one screwed up than the other 5.

+1

[Blokestradamus]

Having seen the All-22, I absolutely subscribe to the train of thought that Darby !@#$ed up.

 

As Bandit said, everyone else had a man assignment.

[3rdand12]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think you and mike are right and ypp.com needs to look a little deeper.

 

* I do not know the play call *

 

I played CB/SS (through 1AA under a great secondary coach) and have coached the secondary before (at the high school level), this is primarily Darby's fault all day IMO. He's not in zone (it doesnt make sense), there is no way watching the other players, AW is the SHS, Z. Brown Band is either a spy or a zone defender(possible robber concept), everyone else is manning up, head up on their coverage responsibility (Graham on the TE, P. Brown on the RB, R-C on the slot/Kerley and so on) and covers that guy post snap. I'd bet AW was peaking in the backfield or at something he shouldnt be, his single responsibility looking at it presnap and what happened post snap was to not let anyone get over the top of him (should be), and especially T. Smith... Which makes me believe secondarily he is culpable as well. Even if Darby was playing some sort of zone from that far off, it should still be his primary responsibility to cover the deep field.

 

p.s. I dont know the defensive play call, but roughly 20 years of secondary related experience tells me #28 and #23 were the responsible parties on this play not #24. Seconds 11-18 of the youtube video link sums all of this up, the all 22 should confirm it. Thats my .02...

Well dissected.

I admit i have learned quite a bit from you folks.

 

The bigger picture: our opponents' collective passer rating is 77.3, which is dismal. ALL teams and ALL corners give up big plays on occasion. Only five teams are better: KC (76.9), Seattle (74.9), and Denver (71.0), Arizona (69.7), and Minnesota (65.3). 26 teams are worse.

 

Always keep in mind that the NFL is currently designed to enhance the passing game. The bottom line: while they certainly aren't the entire reason the Bills' pass D is so good, it's pretty clear that they have good CBs. They aren't perfect, but they're a better group than what the vast majority of teams have.

Perspective realized !

[YoloinOhio]

Fwiw

 

@andy_benoit

#49ers Film: Smith 53-yd TD was bunch switch release on 1st-10. #Bills in man playing the releases, Gilmore and Darby both played same guy.

[Marty McFly]

Might be worth another look...Darby was clearly playing zone, while Gilmore, NRC, Graham, and both Browns were in man (Zack was spying Kaep).

 

I think it's more likely that the one screwed up than the other 5.

Indeed, I have no access to the all 22s but will take the word of those of you who saw it

[JM57]

Having seen the All-22, I absolutely subscribe to the train of thought that Darby !@#$ed up.

 

As Bandit said, everyone else had a man assignment.

This is Two Bills Drive, you're supposed to always blame Gilmore.

[John from Riverside]

How you doing Bandit?

 

I've always liked your posts and its true, you are always positive and dont go down the " Trump " road.

 

Game 1: Flacco

Game 2 : Fitz

Game 3: Palmer

Game 4: 3rd stringer Rookie

Game 5: I couldnt even tell ya cuz I was working

Game 6: Kaepernick ( First game in 1 year )

 

 

During the games, if a QB wants to pass toward Gilmore, he will without worrying about SG24

 

Gilmore has not shown any flash. He does a good job but in his first 4 years he has taken stupid penalties, looked lost at times, looked disinterested at times, trouble tackling.

 

In my humble opinion he's a JAG.

 

All the best and keep your great posts coming.

I dont agree with much from you but I def agree here

 

If you are a top 5 NFL corner......QBs should NOT WANT TO THROW AT YOU.....they should literally be worried about a turnover because they threw that direction.

 

This is not happening.....to opposing NFL qbs Gilmore is JAG

[thebandit27]

I dont agree with much from you but I def agree here

 

If you are a top 5 NFL corner......QBs should NOT WANT TO THROW AT YOU.....they should literally be worried about a turnover because they threw that direction.

 

This is not happening.....to opposing NFL qbs Gilmore is JAG

QBs throw at everyone

 

Every week

[Magox]

No matter how you want to characterize him, he's not worth the top 1% CB money that he is seeking. If the Bills don't have someone who they don't believe can replace him adequately then they should franchise him until they do. The Bills do seem to have a knack for finding quality DB's, and Seymour is looking as if he could possibly be the guy.

[8-8 Forever?]

OK, here's another game where this so-called "elite" cornerback got burned BADLY and the result was a touchdown this time. I mean, this is supposed to be one of the best corners in the league and the play was amatuer and rookie-like. Tell me again why he's worth $100MM?

He's not, that's why they'll let him walk. write it down. this one is easy. Seymour will replace him.

Edited October 19, 2016 by 8and8-->NoMore

[thebandit27]

No matter how you want to characterize him, he's not worth the top 1% CB money that he is seeking. If the Bills don't have someone who they don't believe can replace him adequately then they should franchise him until they do. The Bills do seem to have a knack for finding quality DB's, and Seymour is looking as if he could possibly be the guy.

 

I don't know how anyone could come near this conclusion at this point; he's played 49 defensive snaps in 5 games. I'm fine if they don't re-sign Gilmore, instead choosing to spend the money elsewhere--they better have another plan for the starting RCB job aside from Seymour, as I don't know how they could be ready to rely upon him yet.

[JM57]

He's not, that's why they'll let him walk. write it down. this one is easy. Seymour will replace him.

The team went down this road in the past with Clements and Winfield. The backup is rarely as good as the starter once there's more tape on him.

 

If a DB is good enough that you KNOW he is going to get paid a lot if he becomes a UFA, he's good enough that you re-sign him, unless he's been thoroughly outplayed by his "successor" (which in this case, is not true)

[thebandit27]

He's not, that's why they'll let him walk. write it down. this one is easy. Seymour will replace him.

 

Again, I don't know how anyone can be confident in what they've seen (or, more appropriately, haven't seen) from Seymour. He's played ~10 snaps per game and made zero plays. Now don't be mistaken: I'm not picking on the guy. I'm merely saying that there's zero on-field, regular-season production that indicates that he's ready to be a starting corner, let alone a guy that can replace a top-10 corner like Gilmore.

[boyst]

Gilmore was probably at fault on that play, but it is impossible (without confirmation) to be sure. While football may not be a complicated game, defensive back coverage can be quite complicated (as can offensive line responsibilities, at times).

 

Letting AW go was a mistake, IMO. I understood it, but never liked it. Because he didn't get INTs , some thought he wasn't that good, They were wrong. He was a stud.

 

Gilmore isn't having a great year, but I think that's mostly because of his missed tackles, this year. Very odd for an OSU cornerback. He will get huge money in the offseason. And, while I like him, I'm not sure the Bills should pay what he will be offered by other teams. Players can be worth more to some teams, than they are to others. It's the nature of just about every sport. The Panthers are getting a lot of flack for letting Norman go. I don't necessarily blame them for not giving Norman the contract he got elsewhere, but I do blame them for not having a contingency plan. I'd like to think Whaley is a bit better than that.

Gilmore went to USC

[Mr. WEO]

So...

 

Against the Jets, it wasn't Gilmore's fault--he was expecting "safety help over the top".

 

Against NE, he avoided contact...and therefore wisely avoided injury.

 

Against the 49ers, it was the other guys fault.

 

This kid IS "elite"!! They should swap out his name for "WASNTME" on his jersey.

[thebandit27]

 

Against the Jets, it wasn't Gilmore's fault--he was expecting "safety help over the top".

 

 

Phenomenal job of totally mischaracterizing 90% of the board. There was an entire thread about how bad he was in that game, and pretty much everyone agreed. In fact, most of the comments were that he and Darby were so bad that they should've given them safety help.

 

 

 

Against NE, he avoided contact...and therefore wisely avoided injury.

 

 

Nitpicking at its finest. Please Stephon, go head-first into a guy that's kicking at your face in the final moments of a game that's in the bag...now that's smart football.

 

 

 

Against the 49ers, it was the other guys fault.

 

 

It's not anyone's fault that you don't know how to identify coverages. Anyone with half a clue looked at the two views of the play and saw that everyone but Darby was in man coverage...what's more likely: that Darby got the coverage wrong, or that everyone else on the field that had a coverage role got it wrong?

 

I know you're crusading here, but a little common sense wouldn't hurt.

[Mr. WEO]

 

Phenomenal job of totally mischaracterizing 90% of the board. There was an entire thread about how bad he was in that game, and pretty much everyone agreed. In fact, most of the comments were that he and Darby were so bad that they should've given them safety help.

 

 

 

Nitpicking at its finest. Please Stephon, go head-first into a guy that's kicking at your face in the final moments of a game that's in the bag...now that's smart football.

 

 

 

It's not anyone's fault that you don't know how to identify coverages. Anyone with half a clue looked at the two views of the play and saw that everyone but Darby was in man coverage...what's more likely: that Darby got the coverage wrong, or that everyone else on the field that had a coverage role got it wrong?

 

I know you're crusading here, but a little common sense wouldn't hurt.

 

 

Can you show us that guy kicking at the other guy's face?

[Magox]

 

I don't know how anyone could come near this conclusion at this point; he's played 49 defensive snaps in 5 games. I'm fine if they don't re-sign Gilmore, instead choosing to spend the money elsewhere--they better have another plan for the starting RCB job aside from Seymour, as I don't know how they could be ready to rely upon him yet.

 

Let me restate that, based on his preseason performance and how the coaches communicated to the press the upside they see in him, there is optimism that he could possibly be a replacement for Gilmore. However, I did qualify the post by saying that if they didn't believe they had that replacement in place, they could Franchise him.

[thebandit27]

 

 

Can you show us that guy kicking at the other guy's face?

 

Nice job zeroing in on the one borderline-salvageable nuance of your previous post.

 

Excuse my mistake, it was a headbutt and not a kick:

 

https://twitter.com/YardsPerPass/status/783107646341668864

 

If this is the single thing that holds up from your previous post, then your entire point is still completely invalid...assuming you had one to begin with.

 

 

Let me restate that, based on his preseason performance and how the coaches communicated to the press the upside they see in him, there is optimism that he could possibly be a replacement for Gilmore. However, I did qualify the post by saying that if they didn't believe they had that replacement in place, they could Franchise him.

 

Yeah, I wasn't really trying to take you to task for that opinion, but rather the idea that some folks feel confident enough in Seymour to say we can simply let Gilmore walk.

 

I'm not a huge fan of franchising a guy unless you plan to extend him...the tag can often breed acrimony and a holdout, which in turn can lead to injury and poor performance. I wouldn't necessarily be opposed to tagging Gilmore, but I'd rather get a deal done or get a long-term replacement here.