BringBackOrton Posted October 16, 2016 Posted October 16, 2016 (edited) It's interesting that all of my veteran friends, all of them, have no problem at all with Kaepernick's displays. I think that's because they don't confuse symbols with what they symbolize. We've all witnessed far more egregious displays of disrespect during the anthem on a near weekly basis at various sport venues for decades. Imo, it isn't that Kaepernick is protesting, it's what he's protesting that incites the mob. I'd be interested in seeing examples of opinions being suppressed because from where I sit, nobody on either side of the issue has had their voice tamped down. Not in the least. We've heard from dozens of vets on TBD that they are upset at Kaep for when he's protesting, not what or why. Edited October 16, 2016 by jmc12290
K-9 Posted October 16, 2016 Posted October 16, 2016 We've heard from dozens of vets on TBD that they are upset at Kaep for when he's protesting, not what or why. Here's a link of Tiki Barber getting killed for his opinion. https://www.google.com/amp/www.vibe.com/2016/08/tiki-barber-controversial-opinion-on-colin-kaepernick%3famp=1?client=safari I understand, but this is not an example of Barber having his opinion suppressed. He's just being criticized, which is what we sign up for when we express them in public forums. We've also heard from vets in this forum who aren't offended. But again, that's not my point and really not something I'm interesting in debating. We can find offense everywhere. I am only interested in the Kaepernick protest from the symbol vs. what they symbolize aspect. I really couldn't care less about all the other extraneous debate.
BringBackOrton Posted October 16, 2016 Posted October 16, 2016 I understand, but this is not an example of Barber having his opinion suppressed. He's just being criticized, which is what we sign up for when we express them in public forums. We've also heard from vets in this forum who aren't offended. But again, that's not my point and really not something I'm interesting in debating. We can find offense everywhere. I am only interested in the Kaepernick protest from the symbol vs. what they symbolize aspect. I really couldn't care less about all the other extraneous debate. That's why I said "some vets."
What a Tuel Posted October 16, 2016 Posted October 16, 2016 (edited) It's interesting that all of my veteran friends, all of them, have no problem at all with Kaepernick's displays. I think that's because they don't confuse symbols with what they symbolize. We've all witnessed far more egregious displays of disrespect during the anthem on a near weekly basis at various sport venues for decades. Imo, it isn't that Kaepernick is protesting, it's what he's protesting that incites the mob. I'd be interested in seeing examples of opinions being suppressed because from where I sit, nobody on either side of the issue has had their voice tamped down. Not in the least. https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/aug/29/colin-kaepernick-national-anthem-protest-fundamentally-american "Furthermore, many of them are racist. And the backlash against Kaepernick displays how everyday Americans who would never consider themselves racist can get caught in acts of white supremacy." "We cannot choose when racism affects us, and it is cruel to insist on choosing when discussions of racism affect you. " Edited October 16, 2016 by What a Tuel
jester43 Posted October 16, 2016 Posted October 16, 2016 If you have a problem with CK, you're telling the world that unarmed black people being gunned down over and over by cops for, AT BEST, dubious reasons is less of a concern than what someone does while the national anthem is playing. that is so immoral it defies logic. that is also straight up fascism...or racism, depending on what is behind your objection. this is 'merica in the 21st century. hoo-ray. vote trump.
BringBackOrton Posted October 16, 2016 Posted October 16, 2016 If you have a problem with CK, you're telling the world that unarmed black people being gunned down over and over by cops for, AT BEST, dubious reasons is less of a concern than what someone does while the national anthem is playing. that is so immoral it defies logic. that is also straight up fascism...or racism, depending on what is behind your objection. this is 'merica in the 21st century. hoo-ray. vote trump. No. Stop talking.
jester43 Posted October 16, 2016 Posted October 16, 2016 i'm 100% right. are you a bigot or a fascist?
BringBackOrton Posted October 16, 2016 Posted October 16, 2016 i'm 100% right. are you a bigot or a fascist? You're 100% wrong and doing your cause a disservice by continuing.
jester43 Posted October 16, 2016 Posted October 16, 2016 i don't have a "cause"...i'm making a moral judgement about which is worse...and it's completely obvious that the lack of civilian outrage to cops blowing away unarmed black citizens for, AT BEST, dubious reasons is way worse than kneeling during the national anthem at a sports game. and if you have problem with CK's gesture, you're either a fascist or a racist. it's very clear.
BringBackOrton Posted October 16, 2016 Posted October 16, 2016 (edited) i don't have a "cause"...i'm making a moral judgement about which is worse...and it's completely obvious that the lack of civilian outrage to cops blowing away unarmed black citizens for, AT BEST, dubious reasons is way worse than kneeling during the national anthem at a sports game. and if you have problem with CK's gesture, you're either a fascist or a racist. it's very clear. Sounds like just what a fascist would say. If you don't agree with me, you're evil! Way to present yourself as open-minded. Edited October 16, 2016 by jmc12290
keepthefaith Posted October 16, 2016 Posted October 16, 2016 (edited) Oh, sweet. I reckon this is where someone explains the difference between a black person and a n*gger. Hang on while I go get some tabacky and put on my overalls. No you're way off base here. I'm genuinely interested in your answer. You made a very broad statement earlier. I'm simply looking for some additional detail. If you have a problem with CK, you're telling the world that unarmed black people being gunned down over and over by cops for, AT BEST, dubious reasons is less of a concern than what someone does while the national anthem is playing. that is so immoral it defies logic. that is also straight up fascism...or racism, depending on what is behind your objection. this is 'merica in the 21st century. hoo-ray. vote trump. Anyone regardless of color being gunned down without cause by the police is a concern. Any such incident is tragic for sure. We have a justice department which stands at the ready to prosecute any such incidents that involve race and excessive force. Has there been a successful prosecution of any police officer in recent years for such an act? One or more where an officer was found guilty of excessive use of force motivated by race? I'm not saying it hasn't happened, just can't recall any at the moment. Edited October 16, 2016 by keepthefaith
gumby Posted October 16, 2016 Posted October 16, 2016 So I turn on NFL Network after the game to see the Bills highlights. After waiting 45 minutes they finally get around to it. Do we get to see McCoy, Tyrod? Yes, but they were overwhelmed but "highlights" of Kaep. You would think from the way they were singing his praises he actually played a good game and didn't just get shellacked by 29 points. This guy pisses enough people off and then to have his substandard performance shoved down your throat is it any wonder why the NFL ratings are taking a hit?
bklnpete Posted October 16, 2016 Posted October 16, 2016 I think that you missed the point. I know that you wanted to take a cheap shot at the Bills but since they have won 3 in a row that's the best that you could do. McCoy's point has NOTHING to do with good teams or bad teams. It is a reminder that Kaep is a human and has a family. Whether you like what he's doing or not, basic human decency should come first. It doesn't matter if you are the '72 Dolphins or the '08 Lions. People should be respected by fans of ALL football teams. Ditto.
jester43 Posted October 16, 2016 Posted October 16, 2016 Sounds like just what a fascist would say. If you don't agree with me, you're evil! Way to present yourself as open-minded. nope. That's not what fascism is. Read a little and come back.
bbb Posted October 16, 2016 Posted October 16, 2016 nope. That's not what fascism is. Read a little and come back. Tell me what fascism is.
EasternOHBillsFan Posted October 16, 2016 Posted October 16, 2016 i don't have a "cause"...i'm making a moral judgement about which is worse...and it's completely obvious that the lack of civilian outrage to cops blowing away unarmed black citizens for, AT BEST, dubious reasons is way worse than kneeling during the national anthem at a sports game. and if you have problem with CK's gesture, you're either a fascist or a racist. it's very clear. Outrage is still outrage, no matter if it is kneeling during the anthem, stealing out of a register, assault, killing PERIOD, rape... it's all bull **** and an outrage, period.
DC Tom Posted October 16, 2016 Posted October 16, 2016 i don't have a "cause"...i'm making a moral judgement about which is worse...and it's completely obvious that the lack of civilian outrage to cops blowing away unarmed black citizens for, AT BEST, dubious reasons is way worse than kneeling during the national anthem at a sports game. and if you have problem with CK's gesture, you're either a fascist or a racist. it's very clear. What if you don't really care what Kaepernick does? Because I don't...but last time I said that, I was told I was promoting the genocide of blacks.
Augie Posted October 16, 2016 Posted October 16, 2016 I don't blame the guy for expressing his opinion for a second. He has every right to do so. I'm happy he has that right! I think it exposes his ignorance and lack of inward perspective, or maybe his willingness to follow what he's heard from others without proper consideration, but that's up to him. Bringing it up is part of the process, as is the following (which I have previously posted elsewhere): http://insider.foxnews.com/2015/08/25/grandmother-peggy-hubbard-takes-down-black-lives-matter-viral-video I don't think the conversation can be summed up much better than what this amazing lady has done.
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted October 16, 2016 Posted October 16, 2016 i don't have a "cause"...i'm making a moral judgement about which is worse...and it's completely obvious that the lack of civilian outrage to cops blowing away unarmed black citizens for, AT BEST, dubious reasons is way worse than kneeling during the national anthem at a sports game. and if you have problem with CK's gesture, you're either a fascist or a racist. it's very clear. It's this kind of "logic" that makes rational conversation impossible.
What a Tuel Posted October 17, 2016 Posted October 17, 2016 I'd be interested in seeing examples of opinions being suppressed because from where I sit, nobody on either side of the issue has had their voice tamped down. Not in the least. I realize this is the internet and the below things will happen, but this kind of suppression is what happens. Unless you admit this is an epidemic you are a racist who doesn't care. There is no middle ground where the isolated incidents are a problem, and the solution is more training is necessary, and awareness that police have the authority so you must comply. If you feel your rights are being abused, take it up with the proper channels. The proper channels are not to ignore, verbally abuse, resist detainment/arrest, or run from police. Nope that view is racist because "police are gunning black people down over and over, and no one cares" which is a false narrative that people who have a problem with Kaepernick wish he wouldn't promote. It is leading to more distrust, and more division with police. If you have a problem with CK, you're telling the world that unarmed black people being gunned down over and over by cops for, AT BEST, dubious reasons is less of a concern than what someone does while the national anthem is playing. that is so immoral it defies logic. that is also straight up fascism...or racism, depending on what is behind your objection. this is 'merica in the 21st century. hoo-ray. vote trump.
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