Azalin Posted October 16, 2016 Share Posted October 16, 2016 Greatest in human history? In my opinion, yes. When you finish laughing, feel free to give me an example of a better one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#34fan Posted October 16, 2016 Share Posted October 16, 2016 (edited) NO! Like I said, that's another thread.... Start it, and I'll follow you over there to repeat what I'm about to say... Which is that the idea that your "guy" (or guys) made the SINGLE GREATEST contribution to human history makes for a pointless argument! -KEEP your opinion... I don't share it, but it's noted. Or maybe it's not about him? Meaning what, exactly? Edited October 16, 2016 by #34fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Man Posted October 16, 2016 Share Posted October 16, 2016 What enraged viewers was mostly the multifaceted hypocrisy of both Kaepernick and the NFL:a) A multiracial Kaepernick was raised by white suburban parents and is a $20 million–a–year pampered athlete, whose only prior racial editorialization earned him an NFL fine for using the N-word slur (Cura te ipsum), and who had little prior record of philanthropy to the African-American community. b) Kaepernick’s sudden activism and high public profile coincided with his demotion to second-string-quarterback status (though today he is schedule to start). A not implausible suggestion followed that personal frustration — or connived and preemptive career deterrence — explained his newfound professional grandstanding. c) Prestigious multimillionaire NFL athletes are nearly 70 percent African-American in an age when diversity is explained in a multiracial society as proportional representation — with few concessions given to the now obsolete idea of transcendent quantifiable merit — given the insidious role of “disparate impact” theory, which requires no demonstrable proof of racism to earn reparation hiring to meet correct ethnic and racial percentages. Yet somehow the NFL finds itself a sanctuary sport, exempt from civil-rights quota oversights that are ubiquitous on campus and in the workplace. d) The NFL has a long history of insisting that all political messaging and behavior remain taboo and absent from the turf, from expressing support for fallen police to patriotic demonstrations. Nothing enrages Americans more than the combination of sanctimony with rank hypocrisy. No matter. The postmodern NFL and media narrative can remain — for now. But there is no such thing as postmodern ratings, audience share — and money. When the last of these runs out, Kaepernick’s idealistic teammates will see that their contracts reflect their principles. Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/corner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted October 16, 2016 Share Posted October 16, 2016 Greatest in human history? That's another thread... Many people did many things to advance humanity to this stage... Many sacrifices were made by countless heroes unsung... In the last 24 hours, I rediscovered a part of history I thought I knew... I knew about the omitted verses in the SSB, but chose to put them in context of the times... The fact is, If you were a slave owner, you also owned part of the murder, rape, abuse, and degradation those people endured under that system... F. Scott Key, from all accounts wasn't the worst guy in the world... Some of the info I gathered speak of him freeing many of his own slaves... Even defending blacks in court on numerous occasions... However... He was an owner.... He helped perpetuate that greedy, heartless, blood-soaked, machine known as the slave trade... If our society truly represents freedom of choice, and expression, then we HAVE to respect the choice of some African- Americans NOT to observe a poem written by a white, slave-owning lawyer about a ferocious battle which he WATCHED from the safety of a ship EIGHT MILES away.... I have little issue with him not observing that poem for reasons that you cited above ... Perhaps he should protest as a way to get the anthem changed to " America the beautiful " . Fine . My issue is not his right to protest, but rather WHAT he is protesting and his overall message. To call it misguided is being kind. He paints Police as " pigs" and racists. Are there a few that are? Highly likely. Are people being shot and " dying in the streets" because of it. The numbers do not back that up at all. He' s confusing black folks who were unfortunately shot because they refused to follow instructions with being shot because they were black. It just shows a tremendous lack of understanding the law and what happened in each of these cases (many of which involve white or Hispanic suspects) . He doesn't even realize that paid leave is not the " punishment " for discharging a weapon. He is a racist to the core. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azalin Posted October 16, 2016 Share Posted October 16, 2016 NO! Like I said, that's another thread.... Start it, and I'll follow you over there to repeat what I'm about to say... Which is that the idea that your "guy" (or guys) made the SINGLE GREATEST contribution to human history makes for a pointless argument! -KEEP your opinion... I don't share it, but it's noted. You're the one that started this little tangent regarding Key, so don't act like you're trying to keep on topic now. You were being critical of Key and the national anthem, and attempted to diminish Key's work due to perceived character flaws and the fact that his lyrics were put to a drinking song. I pointed out that although the framers were also flawed individuals, their legacy - specifically the constitution - has been the basis for the greatest nation in human history. Disagree if you want, ignore it altogether - I don't care. I'm certainly not going to start a separate thread just to argue a point that's already being argued here. They are not "my guys", they're the founders of the nation, which makes them yours as well as mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meazza Posted October 16, 2016 Share Posted October 16, 2016 Shady!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted October 16, 2016 Share Posted October 16, 2016 Kaepernick: Ruth Bader Ginsburg's Criticism is Typical of 'White People in Power' Justice Ginsburg: My comments on Colin Kaepernick were ‘inappropriately dismissive and harsh’ What a country! Wow...even the "Notorious RBG" isn't allowed to step out of line these days! You're the one that started this little tangent regarding Key, so don't act like you're trying to keep on topic now. You were being critical of Key and the national anthem, and attempted to diminish Key's work due to perceived character flaws and the fact that his lyrics were put to a drinking song. I pointed out that although the framers were also flawed individuals, their legacy - specifically the constitution - has been the basis for the greatest nation in human history. Disagree if you want, ignore it altogether - I don't care. I'm certainly not going to start a separate thread just to argue a point that's already being argued here. They are not "my guys", they're the founders of the nation, which makes them yours as well as mine. Yes, but they didn't kowtow to the rules of the 21st Century morality police, so their morality is rightly called into question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keepthefaith Posted October 16, 2016 Share Posted October 16, 2016 (edited) Wow...even the "Notorious RBG" isn't allowed to step out of line these days! Yes, but they didn't kowtow to the rules of the 21st Century morality police, so their morality is rightly called into question. She's in a tough spot being a hard lefty but also being of a generation that is more patriotic and respectful of our country than CK's generation. Edited October 16, 2016 by keepthefaith Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Man Posted October 16, 2016 Share Posted October 16, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted October 16, 2016 Share Posted October 16, 2016 She's in a tough spot being a hard lefty but also being of a generation that is more patriotic and respectful of our country than CK's generation. Pop-Progressivism will eat itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbb Posted October 16, 2016 Share Posted October 16, 2016 Meaning what, exactly? That at this point, the anthem is not about the pros and cons of Francis Scott Key. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted October 16, 2016 Share Posted October 16, 2016 That at this point, the anthem is not about the pros and cons of Francis Scott Key. Of course not. Because the anthem was written THIRTY YEARS earlier than Key wrote it! Or something... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted October 16, 2016 Share Posted October 16, 2016 You're the one that started this little tangent regarding Key, so don't act like you're trying to keep on topic now. You were being critical of Key and the national anthem, and attempted to diminish Key's work due to perceived character flaws and the fact that his lyrics were put to a drinking song. I pointed out that although the framers were also flawed individuals, their legacy - specifically the constitution - has been the basis for the greatest nation in human history. Disagree if you want, ignore it altogether - I don't care. I'm certainly not going to start a separate thread just to argue a point that's already being argued here. They are not "my guys", they're the founders of the nation, which makes them yours as well as mine. Never mind the absolute idiocy of judging the colonial world through the prism of 21st century social justice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted October 16, 2016 Share Posted October 16, 2016 Never mind the absolute idiocy of judging the colonial world through the prism of 21st century social justice. Ever been to the Smithsonian Museum of American History? One great big building of "They oppressed people back then because they were ignorant and didn't know any better, not like us today." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#34fan Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 (edited) You're the one that started this little tangent regarding Key, so don't act like you're trying to keep on topic now. You were being critical of Key and the national anthem, and attempted to diminish Key's work due to perceived character flaws and the fact that his lyrics were put to a drinking song. I pointed out that although the framers were also flawed individuals, their legacy - specifically the constitution - has been the basis for the greatest nation in human history. Disagree if you want, ignore it altogether - I don't care. I'm certainly not going to start a separate thread just to argue a point that's already being argued here. They are not "my guys", they're the founders of the nation, which makes them yours as well as mine. Fine.. Call them the founding fathers... But I don't have to consider myself their son. That at this point, the anthem is not about the pros and cons of Francis Scott Key. I was one of the first to question Kaepernick's motivations on this board... The timing of the protest to me seemed odd... It still does, to be honest... It was only through some of the vitriol I witnessed here, that I decided to revisit the entire issue... My stance on Kaepernick remains unchanged... I question his sincerity, but fully back his, or anyone else's right to protest this way... What I uncovered about Key, and the war that spawned our national anthem changed me somewhat... Key was a middling lawyer from a wealthy family that showed up that day to secure the release of a prominent doctor taken prisoner by the English...) I found much evidence that he didn't support the hostilities against the Brits one bit... In fact, many Americans at the time, considered the declaration of war to be a move to annex more English territory. Key wasn't just a slave owner, he was also a fantastic bigot... One who didn't see a future for blacks in this young country... He literally wanted to send them ALL back to Africa! Even when I put this in context of the times, It doesn't leave me with a good feeling... Here was a privileged man who experienced a moment of inspiration while observing a battle he wasn't even CLOSE to fighting in, from a war he didn't really support... If I'm going to question Kaepernick's motivations for not singing this song, -why can't I question the motivations of the guy who wrote it? Edited October 17, 2016 by #34fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azalin Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 Fine.. Call them the founding fathers... But I don't have to consider myself their son. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keepthefaith Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 Pop-Progressivism will eat itself. I'd like to agree with you but the idiot European voters have shown us that in their countries the beat goes on even in the face of economic and social wreckage. Brexit being a recent exception but that's not a trend yet. U.S. Voters are not a wise bunch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 Ever been to the Smithsonian Museum of American History? One great big building of "They oppressed people back then because they were ignorant and didn't know any better, not like us today." Pretty much, yeah. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbb Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 I was one of the first to question Kaepernick's motivations on this board... The timing of the protest to me seemed odd... It still does, to be honest... It was only through some of the vitriol I witnessed here, that I decided to revisit the entire issue... My stance on Kaepernick remains unchanged... I question his sincerity, but fully back his, or anyone else's right to protest this way... What I uncovered about Key, and the war that spawned our national anthem changed me somewhat... Key was a middling lawyer from a wealthy family that showed up that day to secure the release of a prominent doctor taken prisoner by the English...) I found much evidence that he didn't support the hostilities against the Brits one bit... In fact, many Americans at the time, considered the declaration of war to be a move to annex more English territory. Key wasn't just a slave owner, he was also a fantastic bigot... One who didn't see a future for blacks in this young country... He literally wanted to send them ALL back to Africa! Even when I put this in context of the times, It doesn't leave me with a good feeling... Here was a privileged man who experienced a moment of inspiration while observing a battle he wasn't even CLOSE to fighting in, from a war he didn't really support... If I'm going to question Kaepernick's motivations for not singing this song, -why can't I question the motivations of the guy who wrote it? You can do whatever you want. I think Kap would have done this protest whether the national anthem is this song written by Francis Scott Key or if it was Pop Goes the Weasel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#34fan Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 (edited) You can do whatever you want. I think Kap would have done this protest whether the national anthem is this song written by Francis Scott Key or if it was Pop Goes the Weasel. -Funny! -If you were around in 1773 the melody would be the equivalent of "pop goes the weasel" People might find it hilarious that it was turned into a national anthem... Why do we sing this song? Is it to honor our country, or just it's fallen soldiers... If it's the latter, maybe it should be a different song... Edited October 17, 2016 by #34fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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