Are we sleeping on this team?

[FireChan]

I think this may be the most boom or bust of a season we have ever had. We will go 4-12 or 10-6. Neither would overly shock me.

[Magox]

As many of you know I can be one of the teams biggest critics/realists. I realize its only two weeks into the preseason games but what I realized Saturday was we have as much if not more speed/talent on this team as anyone in the NFL.

 

I think it's clear we have a true # 1 QB for the first time since signing Drew Bledsoe. We have a top 5 running back with great depth behind him. A star # 1 receiver with a bunch of fast, young, hungry guys behind him nearly all of whom have game breaking speed. A top 10 tight end with a solid # 2 (Gragg). A formidable offensive line with some young depth.

 

Rex seemed to be telling the truth with the problem last year being the players not learning the D fast enough/buying into the philosophy. It is pretty clear just by the camp reports and watching them perform that has changed. I think Ed Reed and possibly Rob Ryan have alot to do with that. Teams are not going to be able to throw the ball on us with this secondary and the depth we have. It appears we will be stout against the run as shown so far. The only ? mark i see on D is will we be able to generate a pass rush without having to blitz too often?

 

And when teams begin losing players with injuries we will be getting two of our stars back (Dareus, Shaq). In the meantime this will allow their backups and younger players to develop. The same could be said with Watkins not playing much allowing more reps for the other receivers. Injuries could be a blessing in disguise in this case. I think the injuries have caused us to sign some solid veteran depth players we might not have otherwise signed. With all of the injuries the only player that we lost for the year who will be missed is Ragland.

 

I just can't envision this team getting too far down in many games this year. If we do we have the game breakers on offense to get right back into it, starting with the QB.

 

 

I think you make good points and if we can somehow not get too many more key injuries, I do believe this team will outperform expectations and probably see a playoff bid.

[stony]

Even with all the drama, if all our playmakers are generally healthy and reaching potential (ie TT is a dynamic playmaker) -- we can compete with anyone.

 

It sounds so simple, but any sustained success this season is predicated upon this playing out favorably for the Bills. Our top three guys on O are all "big-chunk" players who can help overcome weaknesses in other areas.

[NoSaint]

 

It sounds so simple, but any sustained success this season is predicated upon this playing out favorably for the Bills. Our top three guys on O are all "big-chunk" players who can help overcome weaknesses in other areas.

yea, we have potential to be very explosive on offense with TT, Sammy, and Mccoy (and really on defense if KW and Hughes can get enough pressure to let the secondary get some turnovers).

 

but as FC said, that can be very boom or bust. i dont love this team in a grind it out situation sustaining 12 play drives and forcing a ton of 3 and outs --- but we have the potential to be at the top of the league in those big game changing plays.

[Mike in Horseheads]

Rehab is typically 28 days...

Then he gets his period and it ends

[thebandit27]

yea, we have potential to be very explosive on offense with TT, Sammy, and Mccoy (and really on defense if KW and Hughes can get enough pressure to let the secondary get some turnovers).

 

but as FC said, that can be very boom or bust. i dont love this team in a grind it out situation sustaining 12 play drives and forcing a ton of 3 and outs --- but we have the potential to be at the top of the league in those big game changing plays.

 

I'd like to hear more about your thinking on this, as I'm sure you've got your reasons.

 

For me, that's part-and-parcel to this team's winning model: use all of their running backs to grind out yards on the ground and force teams to commit to stopping the run, while at the same time using weapons like Sammy and Clay to hit big chunks of yards in the more open secondaries. Defensively, Rex is a 3-and-out kind of coach...force the ball out quickly and tackle. With a back-7 interior of P. Brown, Z. Brown, C. Graham, A. Williams, and NRC, that seems to be how they're built.

 

Not saying you're wrong; merely that you probably have thought of some issues that I haven't, as I'm worried about them having to score quickly to keep up with teams on offense and having to get sacks and force turnovers on defense.

[dollars 2 donuts]

There are four options here:

 

1. They make us feel good during the preseason and bad during the regular season.

2. They make us feel good during the preseason and good during the regular season.

3. They make us feel bad during the preseason and bad during the regular season.

4. They make us feel bad during the preseason and good during the regular season.

 

I'll take #2, just because that's how I roll.

Edited August 22, 2016 by dollars 2 donuts

[NoSaint]

 

I'd like to hear more about your thinking on this, as I'm sure you've got your reasons.

 

For me, that's part-and-parcel to this team's winning model: use all of their running backs to grind out yards on the ground and force teams to commit to stopping the run, while at the same time using weapons like Sammy and Clay to hit big chunks of yards in the more open secondaries. Defensively, Rex is a 3-and-out kind of coach...force the ball out quickly and tackle. With a back-7 interior of P. Brown, Z. Brown, C. Graham, A. Williams, and NRC, that seems to be how they're built.

 

Not saying you're wrong; merely that you probably have thought of some issues that I haven't, as I'm worried about them having to score quickly to keep up with teams on offense and having to get sacks and force turnovers on defense.

my thought is that mccoy as a back isnt that 4-5 yards every carry kind of guy (nor is reggie). I wouldve liked a healthy and engaged karlos a lot more in the "and short" situations.

 

that sammy is a big play threat but behind him we have a lot of question marks in the WR group as far as being able to move the chains 4-5 times in a drive (will we see drops, field awareness issues, etc... out of 3-5 at WR?). i do like clay in that role but likewise behind him - big question marks.

 

then on defense -- until they show me that the LBs and safeties are up for the task, its hard to buy that we will dominate in that way. especially if missing MD, shaq, ragland, manny.....

 

and then discipline.... will we extend opponents drives and shorten our own with penalties?

 

if we have a WR3 and maybe even WR4 show reliability, and the defenders step up... learn how to harness our emotions -- i could quickly change my tune on being a team that grinds things out -- but until proven im looking at the explosive nature of the team as its identity. i do agree with you on what a rex and roman coached offense and defense should be expected to be, but... we havent seen it yet.

 

last year we were 20th in plays per drive, and led the league in offensive 3 and outs per drive. on defense we were 11th in 3 and outs per drive, which was better than my gut expected going into looking it up.

Edited August 22, 2016 by NoSaint

[thebandit27]

my thought is that mccoy as a back isnt that 4-5 yards every carry kind of guy (nor is reggie). I wouldve liked a healthy and engaged karlos a lot more in the "and short" situations.

 

that sammy is a big play threat but behind him we have a lot of question marks in the WR group as far as being able to move the chains 4-5 times in a drive (will we see drops, field awareness issues, etc... out of 3-5 at WR?). i do like clay in that role but likewise behind him - big question marks.

 

then on defense -- until they show me that the LBs and safeties are up for the task, its hard to buy that we will dominate in that way. especially if missing MD, shaq, ragland, manny.....

 

and then discipline.... will we extend opponents drives and shorten our own with penalties?

 

if we have a WR3 and maybe even WR4 show reliability, and the defenders step up... learn how to harness our emotions -- i could quickly change my tune on being a team that grinds things out -- but until proven im looking at the explosive nature of the team as its identity.

 

Gotcha--thanks for explaining.

 

I think some of those points are well-placed, especially regarding the lack of reliable targets in the passing game outside of Sammy and Clay and the penalty issues.

 

I think I have a bit more faith in the defense--it's mostly based upon what Rex was able to to with the Jets with personnel that was mostly lesser than what he's got here (IMO).

 

Of course, my whole idea for their "winning identity" could be completely blown up if Taylor develops into a more complete passer, so that's a consideration as well.

[NoSaint]

 

Gotcha--thanks for explaining.

 

I think some of those points are well-placed, especially regarding the lack of reliable targets in the passing game outside of Sammy and Clay and the penalty issues.

 

I think I have a bit more faith in the defense--it's mostly based upon what Rex was able to to with the Jets with personnel that was mostly lesser than what he's got here (IMO).

 

Of course, my whole idea for their "winning identity" could be completely blown up if Taylor develops into a more complete passer, so that's a consideration as well.

i actually just added a few stats i pulled to the end of the post and the defensive 3 and outs was better than i expected. the offense mirrored expectations though, leading in 3 and outs per drive.

[metzelaars_lives]

I haven't read through this whole thread but I tend to agree with the OP. IF Taylor, McCoy, Watkins and Clay stay healthy all season and Glenn and Incognito are good to go, then this is one of the better offenses in the NFL. Problem is, as we all know, the odds of them remaining relatively injury-free are incredibly low.

[Captain Caveman]

I sleep in a big bed with my wife.

[26CornerBlitz]

I haven't read through this whole thread but I tend to agree with the OP. IF Taylor, McCoy, Watkins and Clay stay healthy all season and Glenn and Incognito are good to go, then this is one of the better offenses in the NFL. Problem is, as we all know, the odds of them remaining relatively injury-free are incredibly low.

 

How do we all know this? Is it predetermined by the fate of BBFS?

[Captain Caveman]

I will assume Dareus will be back for the Patriots game. That being said we have the talent on offense to beat them in Foxboro without brady IF the refs allow it. Although if history is any indicator they will not. The cardinals are not looking all that healthy right now with an aging QB making a rare east coast visit. I think Rex great opening day record continues and we handle the Ravens. Fitzy and the Jets can't beat us on a Thursday night in Buffalo. I honestly think we start 3-1.

Isn't he suspended 4 games?

[Marty McFly]

I will assume Dareus will be back for the Patriots game. That being said we have the talent on offense to beat them in Foxboro without brady IF the refs allow it. Although if history is any indicator they will not. The cardinals are not looking all that healthy right now with an aging QB making a rare east coast visit. I think Rex great opening day record continues and we handle the Ravens. Fitzy and the Jets can't beat us on a Thursday night in Buffalo. I honestly think we start 3-1.

Normally "if the refs allow it" is such a bull **** cop out excuse but, I saw every Bills game last season and your marklars are wise and true. Without Brady on the field they might be less biased. If our offense is healthy and clicking I really like our chances vs the Pats in week 4. I agree we could be 3-1 with the only teams im lookin out for would be the Cards and Ravens. Remember the Ravens developed Tyrod so they know his strengths and weaknesses better then any team in the league. With the right game plan though, we have the talent to win wk1.

 

How do we all know this? Is it predetermined by the fate of BBFS?

I think hes going on the history of the Billsiest twists of fate in our recent history, im lookin at the glass half full but, I can see how hard it is for the rest to shake off the memories of us starting boom herron cierre wood and some other jag at RB last season with sammy out and a gimpy woods out there.

[JoeF]

I see positive signs like extra meetings called by the players. Everybody in the league has talent and the Bills have a lot of playmakers at skill positions on O and D--but talent only shines when everyone carries out their assignments..

 

Shady can create something from nothing but either point of attack or down field blocks need to be made

Sammy can separate with the best -- but others have to execute play fakes, sell routes, pass block, deliver the ball to make it happen

Gilmore can shut down the other teams #1 receiver but it matters little if the front seven doesn't get pressure or clog run lanes

 

The Bills haven't had all 22 in a lot of years...I have seen signs that this year might be different but talk to me after the murders row stretch ends on November 20th..

[Dorkington]

 

How do we all know this? Is it predetermined by the fate of BBFS?

He named 6 starters on the offense, considering the rate of injuries in the NFL, odds are one of them will miss time this year.

[stony]

He named 6 starters on the offense, considering the rate of injuries in the NFL, odds are one of them will miss time this year.

 

Agreed. A reality most teams should've realized by now.

 

Game done changed. Game the same, just got a whole lot more fierce.

[Bill from NYC]

This team will be fun to watch as long as TT is on the field, and that makes me happy. Even without MD (for awhile) and the draft picks, Rex will still field a competent D. Unleash TT, pray that he stays healthy, and see what happens.

I fully agree wrt Tyrod. Did you see the move he put on that pass rusher when he made the guy fall? I think the kid can be great, I really do.

 

Rex? How about we agree to disagree and hope that your take and not mine is correct.

[Alphadawg7]

As many of you know I can be one of the teams biggest critics/realists. I realize its only two weeks into the preseason games but what I realized Saturday was we have as much if not more speed/talent on this team as anyone in the NFL.

 

I think it's clear we have a true # 1 QB for the first time since signing Drew Bledsoe. We have a top 5 running back with great depth behind him. A star # 1 receiver with a bunch of fast, young, hungry guys behind him nearly all of whom have game breaking speed. A top 10 tight end with a solid # 2 (Gragg). A formidable offensive line with some young depth.

 

Rex seemed to be telling the truth with the problem last year being the players not learning the D fast enough/buying into the philosophy. It is pretty clear just by the camp reports and watching them perform that has changed. I think Ed Reed and possibly Rob Ryan have alot to do with that. Teams are not going to be able to throw the ball on us with this secondary and the depth we have. It appears we will be stout against the run as shown so far. The only ? mark i see on D is will we be able to generate a pass rush without having to blitz too often?

 

And when teams begin losing players with injuries we will be getting two of our stars back (Dareus, Shaq). In the meantime this will allow their backups and younger players to develop. The same could be said with Watkins not playing much allowing more reps for the other receivers. Injuries could be a blessing in disguise in this case. I think the injuries have caused us to sign some solid veteran depth players we might not have otherwise signed. With all of the injuries the only player that we lost for the year who will be missed is Ragland.

 

I just can't envision this team getting too far down in many games this year. If we do we have the game breakers on offense to get right back into it, starting with the QB.

 

i think there is a lot of people sleeping on this team, both fans and the media. A full and healthy roster and this team is a serious threat in the AFC IMO. Unfortunately, injuries, suspensions, etc have thinned us out in some key areas leaving a lot of question marks on how the guys stepping will work out.

 

I think Rex has this team on track and people are foolish to dismiss the accomplishment of going 8-8 after one of the worst years of injuries I have seen...not to mention, all the other challenges already in play besides the injuries with a first year starting QB, new offensive and defensive systems, playing in a tough division last year, etc.

 

If we can avoid any more critical injuries, especially long term injuries, then I think this team can and will make the playoffs. Divisional title is going to take 12 wins IMO at least, so not going to go there yet as i think the Pats still put up 12 wins this year or better. Jimmy is gonna go 2-2 probably and that Brady led team wont lose more than 2 games, and could lose 1 or even 0 with a pissed off Brady under center (assuming no major injuries of course).

 

So winning the division still seems a bit out of our reach because I don't see the Pats losing much after a pissed off Brady comes back with even more weapons than he had last year. Our best hope at winning the division is that Jimmy led Pats go 1-3 or 0-4. I think we can potentially win 11 or 12 games this year if our key guys can stay healthy like Sammy, McCoy, Taylor, Gilmore, etc. And of course, if we are to have any shot at the divisional crown (again barring major injuries to the Pats of course) I feel we MUST win week 4 game against NE. If we lose that game, then its quite possible that means Jimmy led Pats went at least 2-2 or even 3-1 and we wont be able to catch them once Brady comes back IMO.