26CornerBlitz Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 Seems like he could be the next Welker. He's nothing like Welker in stature or playing style.
Kirby Jackson Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 Seems like he could be the next Welker.This is why I hate Hogan. He was like 99th in the league in catches and 95th (or something) in yards. What is it besides for his skin color that reminds you of Welker (who averaged 112 catches a year over a 6 year stretch)?
GunnerBill Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 (edited) When I said two summers ago that Hogan would be a good fit in New England I was accused of "just saying that because he is a white guy who can play in the slot." It wasn't that at all. It was based on watching him play. I will have a friendly $20 charity bet with anyone on here that he catches more balls than Amendola and Bennett this year. Edleman and Gronk will be 1a and 1b and I don't count Lewis because his touches in the passing game don't come at the expense of other pass catchers they come at the expense of rushing attempts by running backs. New England throw to Lewis where most teams run it. I was also never a "Chandler will take off there" guy. Chandler was what he was.... a #2 TE who started in Buffalo due to a talent defecit at the position. I just cannot buy that Hogan is a "below average" NFL talent. He is right where Robert Woods is for me, a guy you probably want to upgrade as your #2 but are very happy with as your #3, putting him squarely in the middle (if not just above the middle) of the pack for NFL receivers. I don't agree with Kirby that you forgo that for a guy who might have one special skill (like Goodwin) but who you simply cannot trust or rely on. I keep the guy who I know can produce every time. Where I agree with Kirby (and we are pretty far apart on Hogan) is that if you have elite NFL talent you want to keep then you don't pay a Chris Hogan. You pay Sammy and you churn around him... that is the right approach and the Bills took the right approach, but Hogan has already proven most of his detractors on this thread wrong in the past 2 years compared to what they were saying two years ago. Edited August 19, 2016 by GunnerBill
DrDawkinstein Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 Edelman was the next Welker. They are looking for the next Edelman, and it sure aint Amendola, nor will it be Hogan.
thebandit27 Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 This is why I hate Hogan. He was like 99th in the league in catches and 95th (or something) in yards. What is it besides for his skin color that reminds you of Welker (who averaged 112 catches a year over a 6 year stretch)? His efficiency is pretty lousy. As a side note: has anyone else seen the advanced stats site "Player Profiles"? Pretty solid stuff here: http://www.playerprofiler.com/nfl/chris-hogan/ Just for fun, and not for comparison's sake, look at Sammy's efficiency: http://www.playerprofiler.com/nfl/sammy-watkins/
Bubba Gump Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 Wonder how Brady and Belichick will react the first time Hogan comes up a yard short on a big third down play. Brady will most like yell at him and BB will most likely bench him for a while, like he does with guys that fumble.
Kirby Jackson Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 His efficiency is pretty lousy. As a side note: has anyone else seen the advanced stats site "Player Profiles"? Pretty solid stuff here: http://www.playerprofiler.com/nfl/chris-hogan/ Just for fun, and not for comparison's sake, look at Sammy's efficiency: http://www.playerprofiler.com/nfl/sammy-watkins/ I don't know about all that Bandit. They compared Hogan to a black guy. I'm pretty sure that Welker, Largent and Raymond Berry are more appropriate comparisons.
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 This is why I hate Hogan. He was like 99th in the league in catches and 95th (or something) in yards. What is it besides for his skin color that reminds you of Welker (who averaged 112 catches a year over a 6 year stretch)? It's a lazy comparison but their production before joining the Pats is pretty similar. Walker had 1 receiving td before he played with Brady.
CommonCents Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 He's nothing like Welker in stature or playing style. People don't get it, Hogan is playing outside!!! They lost Lafell and are about to cut Dobson. Who I think could end up here if he does get cut.
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 Wonder how Brady and Belichick will react the first time Hogan comes up a yard short on a big third down play. Brady will most like yell at him and BB will most likely bench him for a while, like he does with guys that fumble. It's hilarious how people keep repeating this. Let's not fault the coaches for calling routes that are run short of the first down on 3rd down. People don't get it, Hogan is playing outside!!! They lost Lafell and are about to cut Dobson. Who I think could end up here if he does get cut. If there's one thing the Bills need, it's another scrub receiver with questionable hands.
Kirby Jackson Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 It's a lazy comparison but their production before joining the Pats is pretty similar. Walker had 1 receiving td before he played with Brady.He also returned 8 punts for TDs in college (NCAA record). He was a great college player too. They play a very, very different game. The way people only compare white receivers to white receivers and black QBs to black QBs drives me nuts!! I'm waiting for someone to say that Tyrod reminds them of Byron Leftwich. It's a big pet peeve. People don't get it, Hogan is playing outside!!! They lost Lafell and are about to cut Dobson. Who I think could end up here if he does get cut.Facing a team's #1 or #2 corner
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 (edited) He also returned 8 punts for TDs in college (NCAA record). He was a great college player too. They play a very, very different game. The way people only compare white receivers to white receivers and black QBs to black QBs drives me nuts!! I'm waiting for someone to say that Tyrod reminds them of Byron Leftwich. It's a big pet peeve. Facing a team's #1 or #2 corner Oh, I know. They are much different players. I met their production as NFL players before NE. And college production is pretty meaningless or else D'Rick would be a star. Edited August 19, 2016 by C.Biscuit97
CommonCents Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 It's hilarious how people keep repeating this. Let's not fault the coaches for calling routes that are run short of the first down on 3rd down. If there's one thing the Bills need, it's another scrub receiver with questionable hands. I agree with that, it just wouldn't surprise me.
Kirby Jackson Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 (edited) Oh, I know. They are much different players. I met their production as NFL players before NE. And college production is pretty meaningless or else D'Rick would be a star. Naw, he had 1 great year and then was kicked out of school. He was an undrafted guy. A large part of my Da'Rick argument is that if you get 2 guys for nothing I'll take the guy that I've seen lead the SEc in receiving 8 days a week. You don't often get guys like that as undrafted players (Striker too but he's little). It's very rare these days that great college players don't translate (with the exception of spread QBS). There is such an emphasis on recruiting that the top players are going from high school to college to the pros pretty seemlessly (for the most part). The Khalil Mack's of the world are the exceptions (but he was a great college player). The Information Age and technology in general have revolutionized scouting. The "hit rate" now is as high as it's ever been. Watkins is a great example. Edited August 19, 2016 by Kirby Jackson
Malazan Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 (edited) Danny Amendola didn't put up welker like numbers and he was way more accomplished than Hogan... Watkins is a great example. You're obviously new around here, but Watkins is a bust. He has missed 6.25% of his games. You can't call anyone a success who has missed 6.25% of his games. It's like he's only on the field 93.75% of the time. Edited August 19, 2016 by jeremy2020
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 Naw, he had 1 great year and then was kicked out of school. He was an undrafted guy. A large part of my Da'Rick argument is that if you get 2 guys for nothing I'll take the guy that I've seen lead the SEc in receiving 8 days a week. You don't often get guys like that as undrafted players (Striker too but he's little). It's very rare these days that great college players don't translate (with the exception of spread QBS). There is such an emphasis on recruiting that the top players are going from high school to college to the pros pretty seemlessly (for the most part). The Khalil Mack's of the world are the exceptions (but he was a great college player). The Information Age and technology in general have revolutionized scouting. The "hit rate" now is as high as it's ever been. Watkins is a great example. Fair points. I don't think people took Welker serious because of his size and it's Texas Tech, who's receivers struggle to translate to the pros (Crabtree was a big bust for a lot of years). But you are right about the spread helping the transition for college Wrs. Whatever the personal stuff you got with Hogan is your business. Honestly, his story just blows my mind. I think he was a defensive player in his extra college year. And now he got millions to play receiver for Brady. It's crazy. I think, barring injury, he could have 600+ yards and 5tds. He gets open and let's be honest. He has played with Qbs who can scan the field half as good as Brady. A guy like Hogan should be easily replaceable but I could see him becoming a weapon for the Pats. We will see.
Maury Ballstein Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 Lol at all the hogan will be welker guys. Thanks for the laughs.
Kirby Jackson Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 Fair points. I don't think people took Welker serious because of his size and it's Texas Tech, who's receivers struggle to translate to the pros (Crabtree was a big bust for a lot of years). But you are right about the spread helping the transition for college Wrs. Whatever the personal stuff you got with Hogan is your business. Honestly, his story just blows my mind. I think he was a defensive player in his extra college year. And now he got millions to play receiver for Brady. It's crazy. I think, barring injury, he could have 600+ yards and 5tds. He gets open and let's be honest. He has played with Qbs who can scan the field half as good as Brady. A guy like Hogan should be easily replaceable but I could see him becoming a weapon for the Pats. We will see. I don't disagree with any of that. He has a chance to be pretty productive there but you are right you can replace that production. I said it upthread but you can't spend a lot for the middle - bottom of your roster. His deal seems reasonable to me but not one that I would have made. I have a feeling Woods will be the same next year. Someone will offer him $6M a year and the Bills will be drafting his replacement. You commit your $$ to your stars and the Bills have done a good job of that (Gilmore next hopefully). The best players on the team are the guys that they have locked up.
Jerry Jabber Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 Hogan trying to find the first down marker... That's 100% accurate! 😂😃👍🏻👍🏻
3rdand12 Posted August 19, 2016 Posted August 19, 2016 When I said two summers ago that Hogan would be a good fit in New England I was accused of "just saying that because he is a white guy who can play in the slot." It wasn't that at all. It was based on watching him play. I will have a friendly $20 charity bet with anyone on here that he catches more balls than Amendola and Bennett this year. Edleman and Gronk will be 1a and 1b and I don't count Lewis because his touches in the passing game don't come at the expense of other pass catchers they come at the expense of rushing attempts by running backs. New England throw to Lewis where most teams run it. I was also never a "Chandler will take off there" guy. Chandler was what he was.... a #2 TE who started in Buffalo due to a talent defecit at the position. I just cannot buy that Hogan is a "below average" NFL talent. He is right where Robert Woods is for me, a guy you probably want to upgrade as your #2 but are very happy with as your #3, putting him squarely in the middle (if not just above the middle) of the pack for NFL receivers. I don't agree with Kirby that you forgo that for a guy who might have one special skill (like Goodwin) but who you simply cannot trust or rely on. I keep the guy who I know can produce every time. Where I agree with Kirby (and we are pretty far apart on Hogan) is that if you have elite NFL talent you want to keep then you don't pay a Chris Hogan. You pay Sammy and you churn around him... that is the right approach and the Bills took the right approach, but Hogan has already proven most of his detractors on this thread wrong in the past 2 years compared to what they were saying two years ago. Amendola and Bennett ? I do enjoy donating. even more so with your twenny. I would think Bennet alone might eclipse Hogan. any fine print here? Like injuries etc. I am your huckleberry. Because i think this stuff is fun more than i want to win the wager. anyone care to witness ?
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