That's No Moon Posted August 24, 2016 Posted August 24, 2016 (edited) I don't agree. We really have no idea what a holdout would do to Bosa's 2017 draft stock; this is an unprecedented situation. Assuming he stays in shape, doesn't get arrested and doesn't get injured playing pickup basketball, I don't know why Bosa would fall more than a few slots, although I suppose the perceived strength of the 2017 draft class might affect him, too. On the other hand, the Chargers lose out forever on a premium pick, a guy they supposedly thought was the best player in the entire draft, a potential superstar edge rusher that they could have had at the rookie pay scale. Plus, there is the damage to the team's reputation, and I'm sure a great deal of unhappiness among their fan base. I can't imagine the anger and frustration there would have been around here (and rightfully so) if the Bills had jerked Sammy Watkins around like this and lost his rights over something so insignificant. It's not unprecedented, it's just not happened recently. Bo Jackson was selected #1 overall one year and in the 6th round the next. I am comfortable saying that Bo Jackson was a heluva lot better football player than Joey Bosa. There's no way Bosa goes top 3 next year after a year off. Even if he does, he wasted a year of earnings (and earning on those earnings) and he's still 5 years away from contract number two instead of 4. Since the point of wanting the bonus money up front is the compound investment potential, not getting anything at all for a year is dumb. Let's say you're right and he's selected in a comparable slot with a comparable bonus and his second team capitulates and gives him his whole 14 million dollar bonus in 2017. The Chargers, IIRC, were willing to give him the 14 million by 2017 as well, just not all in 2016. While Bosa will still have the 14 million he'll miss on any investment potential on that money. Like I said, that's why he wants it now. Any scenario in this case Bosa loses. The other reason he could use for wanting it all in 2016 is if his agent has trepidation about the tax code changing in 2017. If he "wins" and is redrafted in 2017 that reason for holding out is moot - it will already be 2017 and the tax code will be whatever it is. Edited August 24, 2016 by That's No Moon
Augie Posted August 24, 2016 Posted August 24, 2016 Eli is looking smarter. I am SOOOO glad they are not my team!
That's No Moon Posted August 24, 2016 Posted August 24, 2016 Eli is looking smarter. I am SOOOO glad they are not my team! Yeah I saw Philip Rivers picking up cans in the park for gas money the other day. it's a shame. If they were your team and went through the Ryan Leaf debacle I'd bet you'd be siding with the team on covering your arse.
Augie Posted August 24, 2016 Posted August 24, 2016 Yeah I saw Philip Rivers picking up cans in the park for gas money the other day. it's a shame. If they were your team and went through the Ryan Leaf debacle I'd bet you'd be siding with the team on covering your arse. No, no I wouldn't. I actually didn't fully understand this originally. Now it's clear to the world the Chargers (aka Spanos) are fools. Looks like a crazy old man is calling the shots. I was anti-Bosa until I had a better understanding though. And they hope to get a stadium deal approved? Looks more like they don't want to win the vote. This is just such a bad move for so many reasons in my mind. I just finished an 8 hour drive listening to Sirius and most of the sports world agrees on this. And their statement today negotiating in the press was silly too.
papazoid Posted August 24, 2016 Posted August 24, 2016 Bosa really has no leverage his only threat is to sit out a year.....if he does that, he loses.
mannc Posted August 24, 2016 Posted August 24, 2016 It's not unprecedented, it's just not happened recently. Bo Jackson was selected #1 overall one year and in the 6th round the next. I am comfortable saying that Bo Jackson was a heluva lot better football player than Joey Bosa. There's no way Bosa goes top 3 next year after a year off. Even if he does, he wasted a year of earnings (and earning on those earnings) and he's still 5 years away from contract number two instead of 4. Since the point of wanting the bonus money up front is the compound investment potential, not getting anything at all for a year is dumb. Let's say you're right and he's selected in a comparable slot with a comparable bonus and his second team capitulates and gives him his whole 14 million dollar bonus in 2017. The Chargers, IIRC, were willing to give him the 14 million by 2017 as well, just not all in 2016. While Bosa will still have the 14 million he'll miss on any investment potential on that money. Like I said, that's why he wants it now. Any scenario in this case Bosa loses. The other reason he could use for wanting it all in 2016 is if his agent has trepidation about the tax code changing in 2017. If he "wins" and is redrafted in 2017 that reason for holding out is moot - it will already be 2017 and the tax code will be whatever it is. The Bo Jackson situation was completely different because (a) it was 30 years ago and (b) he played another sport and a lot of people thought he did not really need or want to play football. That being said, you are right that Bosa has a lot to lose too, because it is uncertain what would happen if he reenters the draft and, as you point out, even under the best case scenario, he loses the use of the money for a year. There is just too much for each side to lose if this does not get done. That's why I think it will get done before the season starts.
Augie Posted August 24, 2016 Posted August 24, 2016 The Bo Jackson situation was completely different because (a) it was 30 years ago and (b) he played another sport and a lot of people thought he did not really need or want to play football. That being said, you are right that Bosa has a lot to lose too, because it is uncertain what would happen if he reenters the draft and, as you point out, even under the best case scenario, he loses the use of the money for a year. There is just too much for each side to lose if this does not get done. That's why I think it will get done before the season starts. Absolutely, and what a fine start to the relationship. They may have the leverage, but who wants to be "that team"? Who wins there in the long run?
26CornerBlitz Posted August 25, 2016 Posted August 25, 2016 @AdamSchefter Official Statement from Joey Bosa's representatives: It is unfortunate the San Diego Chargers have decided to... http://fb.me/3mQYejTGn
eme123 Posted August 25, 2016 Posted August 25, 2016 Spanos- "It's absolutely asinine" http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000689877/article/chargers-exec-bosas-stance-absolutely-asinine
vegas baller Posted August 25, 2016 Posted August 25, 2016 Bosa can be a good player but will never be a good teammate, so I applaud San Diego, and wish more NFL teams would use the leverage that they have to deny astronomical salaries to selfish punks like him. I was a Dallas fan for many years but that changed when Jerry Jones caved and gave Emmitt Smith exactly what he wanted. Smith wanted to be the highest paid running back even though he probably wasn't a top 10 RB talent. Screw the players. Make them earn it. Let them walk. Never give in.
3rdand12 Posted August 25, 2016 Posted August 25, 2016 It's not unprecedented, it's just not happened recently. Bo Jackson was selected #1 overall one year and in the 6th round the next. I am comfortable saying that Bo Jackson was a heluva lot better football player than Joey Bosa. There's no way Bosa goes top 3 next year after a year off. Even if he does, he wasted a year of earnings (and earning on those earnings) and he's still 5 years away from contract number two instead of 4. Since the point of wanting the bonus money up front is the compound investment potential, not getting anything at all for a year is dumb. Let's say you're right and he's selected in a comparable slot with a comparable bonus and his second team capitulates and gives him his whole 14 million dollar bonus in 2017. The Chargers, IIRC, were willing to give him the 14 million by 2017 as well, just not all in 2016. While Bosa will still have the 14 million he'll miss on any investment potential on that money. Like I said, that's why he wants it now. Any scenario in this case Bosa loses. The other reason he could use for wanting it all in 2016 is if his agent has trepidation about the tax code changing in 2017. If he "wins" and is redrafted in 2017 that reason for holding out is moot - it will already be 2017 and the tax code will be whatever it is. This is a very nice bit of clarity. Bosa has lost his leverage possibly for up front money by now. Which seemingly was his goal. Unless he just hated the idea of playing for the Chargers that much. which means he might be unbalanced thinking he is elite before and NFL snap has occurred for him? Absolutely, and what a fine start to the relationship. They may have the leverage, but who wants to be "that team"? Who wins there in the long run? corporate america. there are plenty more Bosa's in the pipeline. don't think there aren't Aug. when Corporations win BTW no one wins. I live it. Margin baby.
Augie Posted August 25, 2016 Posted August 25, 2016 Bosa can be a good player but will never be a good teammate, so I applaud San Diego, and wish more NFL teams would use the leverage that they have to deny astronomical salaries to selfish punks like him. I was a Dallas fan for many years but that changed when Jerry Jones caved and gave Emmitt Smith exactly what he wanted. Smith wanted to be the highest paid running back even though he probably wasn't a top 10 RB talent. Screw the players. Make them earn it. Let them walk. Never give in. If that's the case and they still took him third overall, so I'm not too impressed with that either. They thought enough of him to take him then brag about what a great player they got. Hmmm
3rdand12 Posted August 25, 2016 Posted August 25, 2016 Spanos- "It's absolutely asinine" http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000689877/article/chargers-exec-bosas-stance-absolutely-asinine I am starting to feel this way. Not that i am taking sides at all. But Bosa is being obtuse about this
Augie Posted August 25, 2016 Posted August 25, 2016 corporate america. there are plenty more Bosa's in the pipeline. don't think there aren't Aug. Bosa may be easy to replace, but a 3rd overall pick should be precious. Either way, they look bad.
3rdand12 Posted August 25, 2016 Posted August 25, 2016 Bosa may be easy to replace, but a 3rd overall pick should be precious. Either way, they look bad. Well, it sure should be. But is he unobtanium good? i say no. Which points to the Chargers FO . Honestly Augie, this is just whatevs for me. A chuckle at best. He may not be EASY to replace, but there are more where he came from in the pipeline. stupid bosa stupid chargers.
Augie Posted August 25, 2016 Posted August 25, 2016 Well, it sure should be. But is he unobtanium good? i say no. Which points to the Chargers FO . Honestly Augie, this is just whatevs for me. A chuckle at best. He may not be EASY to replace, but there are more where he came from in the pipeline. stupid bosa stupid chargers. That sums it up nicely. And, I'm still uncertain on whether he's "unobtanium good", for a variety of reasons.
Freddie's Dead Posted August 25, 2016 Posted August 25, 2016 That sums it up nicely. And, I'm still uncertain on whether he's "unobtanium good", for a variety of reasons. He would be one of their "Core" players...
3rdand12 Posted August 25, 2016 Posted August 25, 2016 He would be one of their "Core" players... In theory, right ? all about building a mentality
vegas baller Posted August 25, 2016 Posted August 25, 2016 If that's the case and they still took him third overall, so I'm not too impressed with that either. They thought enough of him to take him then brag about what a great player they got. Hmmm Drafting someone third is not a guarantee of riches and it shouldn't be. All 31 other first rounders probably would've taken the deal offered had they been drafted #3. Maybe San Diego realizes they made a mistake and are bent on teaching this bozo Bosa a lesson. He is not a future Hall of Famer. He's a wannabe. I would tell him to sign or get ready for the 2017 draft.
Augie Posted August 25, 2016 Posted August 25, 2016 Drafting someone third is not a guarantee of riches and it shouldn't be. All 31 other first rounders probably would've taken the deal offered had they been drafted #3. Maybe San Diego realizes they made a mistake and are bent on teaching this bozo Bosa a lesson. He is not a future Hall of Famer. He's a wannabe. I would tell him to sign or get ready for the 2017 draft. Well, then maybe they should have picked someone else. Again, stupid either way. And I generally lean toward the owner/employer. But this was just poorly handled all around. The third pick should be a difference maker (but no guarantees) and most teams manage to sign them. These days, it's almost paint by numbers. Hard to mess up....
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