Wayne Arnold Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 Okay, serious question: is it your belief that human bodies are intended to crash full speed into each other in perpetuity? File this under "he probably should've made a different choice of words", but let's not act like he doomed the league. If I ruled the world, football would be much different. I love so many aspects of it which is why I keep watching and supporting the NFL and Bills. But I hate the violence and adverse effects it can have on those who participate. I wish more of those in charge of the NFL and its teams would make a stronger effort to change the sport for the better. But if I truly believed that "humans are not supposed to play" football like Whaley literally stated then I couldn't in good conscience make my living off of those who do play the sport. "Embarrassed" isn't the same as "doomed." :doh: Resources like what? EA Madden player scores?? Seriously, You honestly believe being an evaluator of talent is something anyone can do?? I mean if everyone here does it so it, any moron can, right? Not just "anyone." But a helluva lot more than there are number of NFL GM positions. It's far from rocket science. It's proven fact that draft results are overwhelmingly luck and very little skill, for instance.
John from Riverside Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 (edited) If I ruled the world, football would be much different. I love so many aspects of it which is why I keep watching and supporting the NFL and Bills. But I hate the violence and adverse effects it can have on those who participate. I wish more of those in charge of the NFL and its teams would make a stronger effort to change the sport for the better. But if I truly believed that "humans are not supposed to play" football like Whaley literally stated then I couldn't in good conscience make my living off of those who do play the sport. "Embarrassed" isn't the same as "doomed." Not just "anyone." But a helluva lot more than there are number of NFL GM positions. It's far from rocket science. It's proven fact that draft results are overwhelmingly luck and very little skill, for instance. How is it a proven fact? Edited May 25, 2016 by John from Hemet
VABills Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 How is it a proven fact? The Bills have had how many GM's without making the playoffs in a thousand years?
Wayne Arnold Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 No.....not anyone can replace Whaley in the job requirements to "find talent".....that is why there are only so many of these jobs in the the world. I know there are a lot of armchair qbs that THINK they could do it but trust me.....they wont be getting a call. Show me a job description for NFL GM that says he must be a good public speaker. I will wait. Go on Twitter and you can find people like Chris Trapasso, Rob Quinn, etc. who could do exactly what Whaley does with regard to "finding talent." It's hilarious how complicated you think it is. And there are only 32 NFL GM jobs because there are only 32 NFL teams. Are you saying public speaking is not part of an NFL GM's job?
John from Riverside Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 The Bills have had how many GM's without making the playoffs in a thousand years? And we know for sure that is the GM's fault? It isnt ownership along the way? Demographics? And......as with every single time someone presents their arguement this way......while it may seem like one long beating to a bills fan....it really is not.....time starts and stops with each new GM.
USABuffaloFan Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 (edited) This is like a hospital CEO coming out and saying hospital's kill people. Stupid is as stupid does. Whaley should be fired! He can then do the talk circuit and explain what he means. He should have added in his 2016 Media rules that all dumb statements from GM be censored quickly! Edited May 25, 2016 by USABuffaloFan
John from Riverside Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 Go on Twitter and you can find people like Chris Trapasso, Rob Quinn, etc. who could do exactly what Whaley does with regard to "finding talent." It's hilarious how complicated you think it is. And there are only 32 NFL GM jobs because there are only 32 NFL teams. Are you saying public speaking is not part of an NFL GM's job? I bet you couldnt do it
Formerly Allan in MD Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 Why is honesty a big deal? All he's saying is that if you don't want your brain scrambled, don't play football because it's not necessarily kind to brains.
The Big Cat Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 Again, do you think Mr. Pegula is happy about these comments, which btw are now the talk of Sirius Radio? He left the door WIDE open for civil suits. Also on Sirius, they are talking about how he declared 3 rookies to be "starters" even before training camp. This probably wasn't very motivational to the other players, right, or is this me being petty? On TSW, we are talking about him knowingly drafting an injured player in round one. Darby WAS a great draft selection ya know, but Whaley is causing harm to the team that just might take time to undo. The stupidity is pushing any positive moves to the side, or so I think. Of course, the above is nothing more than my opinion. I am sure that many here think Whaley is great. If we win football games, I will be one of them. I haven't evaded the question of whether the Pegula's are happy. I doubt they are. I think it's just as likely they're not terribly UNhappy with his comments either. I doubt for them that this is an issue. But I will ask you again, how does this leave the door open for civil suits? What nature of civil suits does this spawn? And how are his poor choice of words so unique that they make the suits more likely? I am certain the Pegulas have attorneys on retainer in addition to the ones working in house. You shouldn't be concerned with them having to get into any sort of legal scuffle, unlikely to occur though it may be. I assure you. They'll be fine.
thebandit27 Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 If I ruled the world, football would be much different. I love so many aspects of it which is why I keep watching and supporting the NFL and Bills. But I hate the violence and adverse effects it can have on those who participate. I wish more of those in charge of the NFL and its teams would make a stronger effort to change the sport for the better. But if I truly believed that "humans are not supposed to play" football like Whaley literally stated then I couldn't in good conscience make my living off of those who do play the sport. "Embarrassed" isn't the same as "doomed." If the endeavour is to cherry-pick one single sentence and criticize based on it, then yes, the sentiment you're expressing here is valid. On the other hand, applying context to the entire interview, it's quite clear that he's saying that human bodies aren't meant to handle repeated collisions at high speeds, and thus injuries are inevitable. The real sentiment that he expressed is neither dooming or embarrassing IMO... Go on Twitter and you can find people like Chris Trapasso, Rob Quinn, etc. who could do exactly what Whaley does with regard to "finding talent." It's hilarious how complicated you think it is. And there are only 32 NFL GM jobs because there are only 32 NFL teams. Are you saying public speaking is not part of an NFL GM's job? As someone that intensely watches and grades players, I often wonder how my work stacks up against NFL GMs. The thing is, we're only able to grade based on what we see in games. We don't have access to the "underbelly" of the process. We can't quantify how a kid will respond to certain situations, what his college teammates say about him both on and off the field, etc. GMs do, and it's as much part of the evaluation as anything else. All that said, I've spent a lot of time the past few days looking over the recent track record of NFL GMs with regard to drafting and scouting, and honestly, there are very few that have set themselves apart from their peers in terms of drafting prowess. For example, Ozzie Newsome hasn't produced a draft with more than 2 contributors since 2011, yet he's considered one of the best in the business. John Schneider was lauded as the architect of Seattle's Superbowl team, but he hasn't drafted a single starting player since 2012. I guess if your point is that there really isn't much of a difference in drafting ability between personnel guys, then yes, I agree. This is like a hospital CEO coming out and saying hospital's kill people. Stupid is as stupid does. Whaley should be fired! He can then do the talk circuit and explain what he means. He should have added in his 2016 Media rules that all dumb statements from GM be censored quickly! No, it's not like that at all. Hospitals exist solely to treat the sick/injured. For a hospital CEO to say that is not only criminally negligent and idiotic, it's career suicide. By contrast, football is a sport that involves a high risk of injury. The fact that a guy said it is neither news nor even the slightest bit interesting.
John from Riverside Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 I haven't evaded the question of whether the Pegula's are happy. I doubt they are. I think it's just as likely they're not terribly UNhappy with his comments either. I doubt for them that this is an issue. But I will ask you again, how does this leave the door open for civil suits? What nature of civil suits does this spawn? And how are his poor choice of words so unique that they make the suits more likely? I am certain the Pegulas have attorneys on retainer in addition to the ones working in house. You shouldn't be concerned with them having to get into any sort of legal scuffle, unlikely to occur though it may be. I assure you. They'll be fine. I think that Pegula might have made mention because Whaley put out a official statement...... but To me this is a blimp on the radar screen probably forgotten by the end of the week This is like a hospital CEO coming out and saying hospital's kill people. Stupid is as stupid does. Whaley should be fired! He can then do the talk circuit and explain what he means. He should have added in his 2016 Media rules that all dumb statements from GM be censored quickly! hyperbowl ..... hyperbowl .... hyperbowl
The Big Cat Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 (edited) I think that Pegula might have made mention because Whaley put out a official statement...... but To me this is a blimp on the radar screen probably forgotten by the end of the week hyperbowl ..... hyperbowl .... hyperbowl The statement was inevitable. Whether it was decreed by the Pegulas is uncertain, and whether it was decreed by the Pegulas because they were angry is even less certain. As someone who issues statements for a living and has for quite some time, you can either take my informed perspective on that speculation or not. EDIT: It's just as likely that the decree from the shield itself. Edited May 25, 2016 by The Big Cat
Wayne Arnold Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 Shouldn't this be common sense?? The human body is not made to handle that kind of pounding on an every day basis year after year. Is there anyone in their right mind that would disagree with this comment? Pretty sure all the players in their 50s, 60s and 70s that can barely walk without use of a cane or walker, have mangled fingers, have had uncountable surgeries to replace knees, hips, etc, and can't pick up their grandkids would agree wholeheartedly...not to mention the ones dealing with concussion related issues and/or the ones who have taken their own lives due to the loss of their brain functioning... And this doesn't even include all the weight training, conditioning, etc that goes on all year round now... Doesn't anyone stop to wonder why so many non-contact ACL injuries keep occurring? Doesn't common sense tell you that a body part only has so much use built into it over its life before it gives out? You can only forcefully cut so many times on an ACL before it simply weakens to the point of breaking. 20 and 30 years ago when players actually had off-seasons, these non-contact ACL injuries were almost unheard of. Their body had enough time to rest and recover, which is not the case anymore. Is it any different than all these factory workers that end up with severe shoulder, wrist or carpal tunnel issues due to repeating the same motion every day over and over again? Anyone arguing that humans somehow are "meant" to take this kind of abuse or repetitive trauma over and over again must have a screw loose somewhere. So now its a big deal simply because someone who works in a high position in the NFL comes out and tells the truth? Why? Because now it might open the NFL up for further lawsuits? I mean get over it...anyone with half a brain is going to come to the same conclusion pretty easily. People need to get off this "Political Correctness" bullcrap that is ruining the world. You can't say anything anymore without it "offending" someone in some way. These people need to get a life...they obviously don't have enough going on in theirs that they have time to worry so much about what is simply the truth. No one is "offended." Some people think his idiotic comments are comical, others are either puzzled or annoyed by them. Then others think it's indicative of his incompetence.
DrDawkinstein Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 No one is "offended." Some people think his idiotic comments are comical, others are either puzzled or annoyed by them. Then others think it's indicative of his incompetence. And all of them would be wrong, or at best misinformed.
CommonCents Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 If the endeavour is to cherry-pick one single sentence and criticize based on it, then yes, the sentiment you're expressing here is valid. On the other hand, applying context to the entire interview, it's quite clear that he's saying that human bodies aren't meant to handle repeated collisions at high speeds, and thus injuries are inevitable. The real sentiment that he expressed is neither dooming or embarrassing IMO... As someone that intensely watches and grades players, I often wonder how my work stacks up against NFL GMs. The thing is, we're only able to grade based on what we see in games. We don't have access to the "underbelly" of the process. We can't quantify how a kid will respond to certain situations, what his college teammates say about him both on and off the field, etc. GMs do, and it's as much part of the evaluation as anything else. All that said, I've spent a lot of time the past few days looking over the recent track record of NFL GMs with regard to drafting and scouting, and honestly, there are very few that have set themselves apart from their peers in terms of drafting prowess. For example, Ozzie Newsome hasn't produced a draft with more than 2 contributors since 2011, yet he's considered one of the best in the business. John Schneider was lauded as the architect of Seattle's Superbowl team, but he hasn't drafted a single starting player since 2012. I guess if your point is that there really isn't much of a difference in drafting ability between personnel guys, then yes, I agree. No, it's not like that at all. Hospitals exist solely to treat the sick/injured. For a hospital CEO to say that is not only criminally negligent and idiotic, it's career suicide. By contrast, football is a sport that involves a high risk of injury. The fact that a guy said it is neither news nor even the slightest bit interesting. Don't kid yourself Bandit, the hardest part of being an NFL GM is getting into the fraternity. Times have changed a plenty, the days are long gone when GM's and scouts could find value because players lack exposure. People like yourself and a few others on here that put in the time and effort could do just as well as many of these GM's do in drafts. They have one distinct advantage as you have mentioned, they get to know the players and can better evaluate their personalities and how that may or may not affect them as professionals. Whaley and this scouting staff is a prime example...they draft big time prospects from big time schools and haven't done anything outside of that and are still around the league average. You could do that and never leave your office. This was meant as a compliment and to diminish the notion that GM's are smarter than the average bear. Sincerely Ryan Grigson
USABuffaloFan Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 (edited) No, it's not like that at all. Hospitals exist solely to treat the sick/injured. For a hospital CEO to say that is not only criminally negligent and idiotic, it's career suicide. By contrast, football is a sport that involves a high risk of injury. The fact that a guy said it is neither news nor even the slightest bit interesting. I happen to work in a hospital environment for the past 30 years in over 200 hospitals over 8 states. Hospitals don't exist to kill people but are the 3rd largest single personal loss in the country. It is a byproduct of what happens when you treat sick people. The NFL is entertainment that is extremely physical, the byproduct can be severe injury and even at times later in life early death. People representing either can't go around saying their place of employment leads to negative results for human beings. Those words from high level employees can be shown to represent that business. There are legal implications. Why did every sport station from Steven Smith to Mike and Mike report this event today? Why did Whaley immediately come out and say he used poor choice of words. The facts support both circumstances but employees must represent the company first, if they truly believe otherwise they should quit. Edited May 25, 2016 by USABuffaloFan
Wayne Arnold Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 How is it a proven fact? Has there ever been an NFL GM in the history of the league who has hit on every draft? Bill Polian was a genius when he landed Bruce, Andre, Kelly, Bennett, etc. He was a bum when he was fired from the Colts after putting together a team that picked first overall. That's just one example but there are many studies that show how much of a crapshoot the NFL Draft is.
The Big Cat Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 Why did every sport station from Steven Smith to Mike and Mike report this event today? Why did Whaley immediately come out and say he used poor choice of words. Because their job is to foment sensationalism. Because it's been sensationalized to the point of absurdity, but absurdity far-reaching enough that it required a response. I'd caution you to gauge something's importance based on whether or not Stephen A. Smith says it's a big deal.
Wayne Arnold Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 And all of them would be wrong, or at best misinformed. If you say so!
thebandit27 Posted May 25, 2016 Posted May 25, 2016 I happen to work in a hospital environment for the past 30 years in over 200 hospitals over 8 states. Hospitals don't exist to kill people but are the 3rd largest single personal loss in the country. It is a byproduct of what happens when you treat sick people. The NFL is entertainment that is extremely physical, the byproduct can be severe injury and even at times later in life early death. People representing either can't go around saying their place of employment leads to negative results for human beings. Those words from high level employees can be shown to represent that business. There are legal implications. Why did every sport station from Steven Smith to Mike and Mike report this event today? Why did Whaley immediately come out and say he used poor choice of words. The facts support both circumstances but employees must represent the company first, if they truly believe otherwise they should quit. Obviously people die in hospitals...no employee would get themselves in legal trouble for saying as much. Now, if said employee were to imply negligence, then it'd be a different story. Whaley didn't imply any type of negligence; he said that football is a sport in which the participants are exposed to injury. It's not news.
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