Pine Barrens Mafia Posted May 18, 2016 Posted May 18, 2016 @JohnMurphyShow Are the #Bills a sleeper team for @SuperBowl LI? KC Joyner of http://ESPN.com says they are. He joins us tonight 830pm @KCJoynerTFS I'll have whatever narcotic he's on.
26CornerBlitz Posted May 18, 2016 Posted May 18, 2016 I'll have whatever narcotic he's on. Yeah. We should go with what you believe because you really know your football.
eball Posted May 18, 2016 Author Posted May 18, 2016 (edited) I agree and to me, it's inconceivable to even criticize the 2014 defense in comparison with the 2015 defense. It would help if you realized it isn't a "comparison" -- it's frustration with this pedestal the 2014 defense has been placed upon. Nearly every poster addressing this issue begins the conversation with "Rex didn't do a good job in 2015." Posters like you, ScottLaw, etc., simply don't listen. Read carefully: the 2014 defense was better, statistically, than the 2015 defense. Nobody disputes that. That doesn't also mean the 2014 defense was an elite defense, or the 2015 defense was absolute crap. It's also arguable to what extent 2015's failings are attributable to Rex vs. certain players. Edited May 18, 2016 by eball
BringBackFergy Posted May 18, 2016 Posted May 18, 2016 (edited) Come on Fergy, throw those numbers out. You saw this team play last year like I did. That d sucked. I'm willing to admit our defense lost us some games last year...but we were down two defensive linemen (KW and Mario). Other than that, the quote from the article still stands. Our pass D was above average. Middle linebacking and run stopping were the problems which are hopefully improved this year. I think we'll see a huge improvement year two of the Rex scheme. Edited May 18, 2016 by BringBackFergy
Nihilarian Posted May 18, 2016 Posted May 18, 2016 It would help if you realized it isn't a "comparison" -- it's frustration with this pedestal the 2014 defense has been placed upon. Nearly every poster addressing this issue begins the conversation with "Rex didn't do a good job in 2015." Posters like you, ScottLaw, etc., simply don't listen. Read carefully: the 2014 defense was better, statistically, than the 2015 defense. Nobody disputes that. That doesn't also mean the 2014 defense was an elite defense, or the 2015 defense was absolute crap. It's also arguable to what extent 2015's failings are attributable to Rex vs. certain players. It's not just about looking at the stats and comparing the two defenses. When you consider that the 2014 defense with it's highly paid defensive line players did exactly what was intended in leading the league in sacks with the best defensive line in the league. I'd call being the number #1 team in the league sacks elite! I'd also call the #4 in yards allowed and #4 in points allowed the best darn defense this team has seen in years. Also #3 in passing yards allowed and #1 in passing TD's allowed. You have to go back to 2003 to just about equal it and to 1999 to better it. Then when you think about the fact that Jim Schwartz with his wide-nine defensive scheme didn't even call many blitzes to lead the league in sacks as that front four did most of the work. Three of the four D-line players went to the pro bowl and the fourth (Jerry Hughes) could have gone with his 10 sacks and 33 tackles. How many Bills defensive players went in 2015? That 2014 defense shut down Peyton Manning at Denver and held him to 173 yards passing, no TD's and two INT's! Manning threw for 4737 yards and 39 TD's in 2014 leading his team to a 12-4 season. Then the very next week held the league's MVP in Aaron Rodgers to 185 yards passing, no TD's and two INT's! Rodgers threw for 4381 yards and 38 TD's in 2014 while leading his team to a 12-4 season. It certainly wasn't the defense that let the 2014 team down as the offense stunk it up being 20th in rushing attempts and 25 in rushing yards, 27th in rushing TD's. This with a pass happy offense and the worst offensive line in the league with 579 passing attempts vs 402 rushing attempts after being #1 in rushing attempts and #2 in rushing yards the previous year. That week 16 Raider game with a playoff berth on the line saw the Bills rush 13 times for 13 yards and every time Spiller got the ball he was tackled five yards behind the line and struggled just to get back to the line of scrimmage as he finished the day with 4 attempts for four yards! The point being that even the best defenses in the league can't stay on the field all game and still be successful. That Raider game went like this TD, INT, PUNT, PUNT, PUNT, PUNT, PUNT, FG, PUNT, PUNT, TD, PUNT, INT, TD and this was against the #32 defense in the league in points allowed, #21st in yards allowed and against a 3-12 team. The 2015 defensive team won games mostly against bad QB's all year in the Colts, Luck (2-5) Titan's rookie QB Mariota (3-9) Tallywhacker (6-10) Dallas Kellen Moore (0-2)with only the Texan's Brian Hoyer (5-4) and the Jets and Fitz as the exception at (10-6) with winning records and we all saw what Hoyer looked like in the playoffs under pressure. Ryan managed to beat Fitz with his Jets teams by going 5-1 in his three years against Buffalo. That 2014 defense should be put on a pedestal by fans and have the future Bills defenses hoping to do as well. The simple fact is that Rex Ryan inherited the league's best sacking defense and turned them into nearly the league's worst sacking defense (31st) by attempting to fit square pegs into round holes. It wasn't just the lack of sacks either as a confluence of crap flowed from that 2015 defense that I pointed out in the above post. Rex is the "mouth that roared." Frequently, as apparently is the case with Rex, roaring is a cover for an inability to figure out how to soar. I hope he's on a very short and tight leash as he deserves to be, as you suggest. Talent is one thing; knowing how to effectively utilize it is quite another and Ryan has shown no ability thus far to figuring that out. I also hope he and his coaching staff are on a very short leash as he has a lot to prove in my view.
Chuck Wagon Posted May 18, 2016 Posted May 18, 2016 The good thing about Joyner is all of his analysis is deeply rooted in statistical study. The bad thing about Joyner is all of his analysis is deeply rooted in statistical study. He's really good with his numbers, but sometimes they can completely lack any sort of context.
bigdogtim Posted May 18, 2016 Posted May 18, 2016 Joyner does make us hopeful. We can talk about 2014 and 2015 all we want, but what matters most is what is going to happen in 2016. Nobody knows for sure, but it is fun to speculate. Unfortunately, speculation is an opinion and opinions are like buttholes - everyone has one. I don't know if the D will be better in 2016 or not, but you can bet I will be sitting there at 1:00 every Sunday at 1 with my big jug of Kool-Aid. To loosely paraphrase Van Miller, where else would you rather be? Go Bills!!!
26CornerBlitz Posted May 18, 2016 Posted May 18, 2016 Joyner does make us hopeful. We can talk about 2014 and 2015 all we want, but what matters most is what is going to happen in 2016. Nobody knows for sure, but it is fun to speculate. Unfortunately, speculation is an opinion and opinions are like buttholes - everyone has one. I don't know if the D will be better in 2016 or not, but you can bet I will be sitting there at 1:00 every Sunday at 1 with my big jug of Kool-Aid. To loosely paraphrase Van Miller Marv Levy, where else would you rather be? Go Bills!!! FTFY.
eball Posted May 18, 2016 Author Posted May 18, 2016 Joyner does make us hopeful. We can talk about 2014 and 2015 all we want, but what matters most is what is going to happen in 2016. Nobody knows for sure, but it is fun to speculate. Unfortunately, speculation is an opinion and opinions are like buttholes - everyone has one. I don't know if the D will be better in 2016 or not, but you can bet I will be sitting there at 1:00 every Sunday at 1 with my big jug of Kool-Aid. To loosely paraphrase Van Miller, where else would you rather be? Go Bills!!! I guess you haven't heard Medicated Pete's PSA for babies born without anuses.
Buffalo_Stampede Posted May 18, 2016 Posted May 18, 2016 I'll have whatever narcotic he's on.It's called crystal math.
iinii Posted May 18, 2016 Posted May 18, 2016 KC Joyner: "a pioneer in the analytical football revolution." "I think they can definitely make the playoffs." That makes it official then!
Talley56 Posted May 18, 2016 Posted May 18, 2016 As enjoyable as those teams were to watch, it's worth remembering the NFL has had its fair share of surprise Super Bowl winners over the years: the 1980 Oakland Raiders, 1981 San Francisco 49ers, 1999 St. Louis Rams and 2001 New England Patriots. In most of these cases it was basically the beginning to a great career for the winning QB. Would be great for this to happen to us.
26CornerBlitz Posted May 18, 2016 Posted May 18, 2016 Why KC Joyner has Bills as Super Bowl Sleepers ESPN Senior Insider KC Joyner has the Bills as one of two teams as his Super Bowl sleeper picks. He appeared on the John Murphy Show to explain why. Joyner basically explained that in every decade of NFL football power football has always been successful. He believes Buffalo is strong in this area based on the following. That combined with Buffalo’s strong metrics in pass defense and Tyrod Taylor’s efficiency as a passer (70 QBR or higher in eight of his 14 starts) has him optimistic about the Bills.
What a Tuel Posted May 18, 2016 Posted May 18, 2016 Come on Fergy, throw those numbers out. You saw this team play last year like I did. That d sucked. The D sucked in comparison to 2014, and in particular games in 2015. However on its own merit in 2015, the D was not nearly as bad as people think it was.
White Linen Posted May 18, 2016 Posted May 18, 2016 I don't think I ever said the 2014 defense was elite. I said it was very good. The 2015 defense was not absolute crap. It was slightly below average which is horrible considering what we saw the year prior. I blame most of that on the coach responsible for the defense in 2015. That is all. Injuries had very little to do with it?
White Linen Posted May 19, 2016 Posted May 19, 2016 Sure they played a part, but not as much as coaching in my opinion. They lost Aaron Williams in Week 2 and Kyle Williams in week 6. Two solid players but the defense and in particular the defensive line(the reason why the defense was so good in 2014)/linebackers were not nearly as effective prior to these injuries and for the remainder of the year. Outside of the corners, every player regressed defensively. That tells me it was more scheme/coaching then anything else. Doesn't mean it can't be fixed in 2016 as yes, the 2015 season has no barring on the 2016 season. The argument could equally be made that players regressed because they were not a healthy defense and the unproven players like Brown and Bradham didn't play well enough. Add in that arguably their best player quit on the team.
Nihilarian Posted May 20, 2016 Posted May 20, 2016 The argument could equally be made that players regressed because they were not a healthy defense and the unproven players like Brown and Bradham didn't play well enough. Add in that arguably their best player quit on the team. Yet the Patriots were riddled with injuries to so many starters all last year. They had only three starters from their entire team that played a full 16 games last year and still were one game away from the SB. In 2008, the Patriots lost Brady after the first game and still went 11-5. Funny how the Bills still had enough talent on it to beat the 10-5 NY Jets (who had just beaten the Patriots in OT the week before) for the last game of the season to knock them out of the playoffs. The defense seemed to play well in games that mattered most to the head coach.
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