Bills Plan to improve the offense “The power of prayer"

[GunnerBill]

As a fan I hope you are right about Miller. I respect your beliefs and your opinion. I want him to succeed.

But my job is not to create a winning team. If it was my paying job I would not count on just "a hope & a prayer" to do my job to the best of my ability. I would have a plan B & C in place in case my prayers were not answered.

 

As I say I don't think they are on a hope and a prayer. I think there is evidence on tape to make them feel good about Miller's chances of taking the step.... and if he doesn't, they have a back up plan in Velasco... a man who started games as a solid depth guy the last two years on a play-off team. Right tackle is a bit more of a leap of faith but I am not at all worried about the guard play in all honesty.

[Doc]

Matt Ryan was a big factor in that. I like the Hankerson pick up don't get me wrong. But Chris Hogan is a better player than you and many others on this board have ever given him credit for.

 

I was slightly wrong. Hank got those stats in 7 games.

 

And we'll just have to agree to disagree on Hogan.

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

only so many draft picks. The overall quality at OL was poor beyond the first round, so better to get impact players at other positions.

This

[Beerball]

I think that it's safe to say that the Bills will be looking hard at all castoffs. They need depth/competition at both guard and tackle. I would have liked something in the draft, but, I can't complain about the picks. There wasn't one that caused a WTF moment wit me & each pick filled a need. Just couldn't fill all of them.

[TakeYouToTasker]

I am very comfortable with Miller being given a chance to grow in to the role in his second year, given the glimpses of excellence he showed last year.

 

Right tackle is clearly a concern, however I don't think it was an issue that could have reasonably been solved through the draft given Miller's own inexperience in a support position, without trading up to grab Staley, Tunsil, or Conklin; which I think we can all agree would have been terrible. I believe it likely that the organization will bring in a veteran to compete for the spot.

[Reed83HOF]

All in all this draft was a defensive loaded draft talent-wise and it matched well with what our biggest needs were. The OL talent wasn't great and didn't match up to what D players there were...

 

As most of us have said or thought the 2014 defense with last years offense we would have been a pretty good team. We went from 54 sacks to 21, had lots of injuries and lost some players - we needed to tend that side of the house.

 

Next year I expect it to be a more fair and balanced draft, but OL, WR, TE, DT and possibly CB/S will be on our list (I'm really hoping not a new starting QB so I am leaving that off). Remember they not only draft for the current year, they also have to look at what is coming up in next year's draft and make some judgements based on that as well. This team most likely isn't going to contend for the SB next year, but there should be a step forward with Taylor as the starter, a "fixed" defense and another year for all players in the systems. Should be about a 10 win team...

 

Note: Would I have liked some OL depth and a WR - you bet; it just wasn't in the cards during the draft. The right side of our line is a bit worry-some,,,,

[4merper4mer]

All I know is that Miller played like crap according to the metrics as well as by eye. Not to mention he was hurt for a good chunk of the season. Yet, some here will insist that he played well.

 

This team drafted as if were the '80s or '90s. And frankly, do we really need a rushing RB, no, we don't. It doesn't really matter, under Whaley we'll be fortunate to have even one player drafted from the 3rd round on out even be relevant at some point.

 

Meanwhile, they take Listenbee, as if they haven't learned, and they haven't, from the Graham, Goodwin, and Easeley picks of the past, that track stars rarely if ever do anything significant in the NFL. 12th time must be the charm tho.

 

So an injured rookie RG was supposed to be a pro bowler?

[klos63]

By any metric the right side of the Bill’s Offensive line was almost a tire fire last year.

 

In spite of the excellent running and passing talent last year, there was a big black hole on the right side.

 

An excellent RB tandem. Watkins, McCoy & Clay. TT’s natural ability to take of and run helped pad the stats and masked the weaknesses of the OL. Incognito played way out of his skull last year. Glen was his steady solid self again. The Bill’s pray that Incognito will still play insanely on fire and Glenn will stay solid & steady.

 

Yet this off-season Bills management has done nothing significant via FA or the draft to address the right side of the OL. The RT situation is still a mess. The RG situation was bad last year, and the team’s plan A, B & C is praying that Miller will have a 2^nd year where the light finally turns on for him. Unfortunately this plan is backed up by little more than faith and hope.

 

The team has Watkins at WR, with Woods as an average slot. Beyond that are a bunch of warm bodies at WR & ST players being counted in the offense. They lost a passable WR in Hogan & didn’t replace him with comparable talent. Harvin retired without comparable replacement. Talent wise the team has less talent than last year.

 

The Bills plan to improve offensive performance, praying TT will make a major improvement this year. Wow, I’m impressed with all this team has done to improve the offense this year. The “power of prayer”, the plan A,B.C, D and F for the Bills to get better on offense in 2016.

 

* Remember the stats are padded by TT's running ability & the guard stats are padded by Incognito having a stellar year at guard.

 

 

I apologize, I created some really nice tables from stats from Football Outsiders to back all this up,and inserted them here but TBD does not appear to support uploading images or tables. And preview mode showed them fine before actual posting. And it is not obvious if the my media function is even enabled for the board.

 

Quote from PFF

“… it’s really a tale of two sides. On the left, their pairing is as good as any in the league, and on the right, it’s as bad as any.”

Just because you don't understand the thinking at OBD doesn't mean it's a bad plan. They drafted Miller in the 3rd round last year, teams don't generally give up on draft picks after 1 season, not all draft picks are solid players in their rookie years. Henderson will be in his 3rd year, last year was riddled with a serious illness, this is a big year for him, but you need to give players time. We have picked up a few FA linemen, Mills and Velasco, and probably some more yesterday as UFA. If the expectation that a linemen must succeed as a rookie or he's a bust, you will draft linemen every year and lose opportunities to upgrade in other areas.

[White Linen]

The point is you need to have a better plan than a belief (or a prayer) that someone may improve. Where is the plan B,C,D? A player may improve, or he may get worse or backslide. Henderson is what he is, an acceptable backup. He has had years to prove otherwise and the statistics show exactly what he is. As you say, taking someone even in the 1st round is nothing more than a gamble. Not taking anyone in the draft at all is throwing your money on the table and folding before the cards are even dealt. You are guaranteed to lose.

 

You think you're smarter than Whaley?

[BaaadThingsMan]

Bills will be a top 10 offense leading the league in explosive plays of 20 yards or more. Mark it down.

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

Players can improve. The right side of our line was pretty injured all year too. And they're both like 24, so one might suggest improvement.

 

Sure we can use a wr, but I don't agree with spending tons of draft capital to get one. We already used two 1sts. Would any of these 2nd and 3rd round guys be better than woods, or any of the castoffs we signed? Who the hell knows.

[RyanC883]

Bills will be a top 10 offense leading the league in explosive plays of 20 yards or more. Mark it down.

 

 

Totally agree. Roman is a great OC. We've given him some good-great additions. Baby Gronk can lineup at TE, RB, FB. Shady of course we know is good. The Williams are good. And Watkins, Woods, Salas, and Listenbee will give secondary fits. We have a very versatile offense and defense that can give match-up problems to most other teams.

[klos63]

The point is you need to have a better plan than a belief (or a prayer) that someone may improve. Where is the plan B,C,D? A player may improve, or he may get worse or backslide. Henderson is what he is, an acceptable backup. He has had years to prove otherwise and the statistics show exactly what he is. As you say, taking someone even in the 1st round is nothing more than a gamble. Not taking anyone in the draft at all is throwing your money on the table and folding before the cards are even dealt. You are guaranteed to lose

I would say the 'belief' a player will improved isn't just a prayer, it's based on research and watching a player practice and play in games and understanding what his weaknesses are. Based on what they see and their combined decades of coaching and evaluation experience they determine that a player should improve after his rookie season enough to warrant not using another high draft choice on the same position the next season. I'm sure they have a plan B or C or D, (backups, FA's, trades...), but obviously those choices aren't as good as Plan A. I think you either don't understand how teams plan their roster or just look to criticize. It's not bad to not understand, none of us really do, but most , I think , have a better understanding than you do.

[HuSeYiN_NYC]

Excellent post simpleman!!

 

You're one of the few that seems to get it.

 

Despite all of that, not one draft expert, nor any of the team's "experts," and I use the term tremendously loosely as they're only experts in collecting large paychecks, had WR as even a depth concern going into the draft when as with you I see a glaring hole at one starting WR spot since as we agree, Woods is at best a reliable 3rd/slot.

 

Meanwhile, two seasons ago Whaley sold the farm to get Watkins, when this year comparable talent was sitting right there without the run on WRs having yet occurred, and we could have had a WR equal to or perhaps even better than Watkins in traffic as there were several, all taken in the run immediately following our first pick.

 

We could have then had Cody Whitehair to solidify the OL and give our RT a shot at goodness as well.

 

Meanwhile, Watkins has struggled with injuries since he's been on the team and Woods was hurt for a significant portion of last season, yet, our marvelous brainiacs at OBD apparently haven't thought about what happens if in the high likelihood that one of the two gets hurt and misses significant time.

 

Meanwhile, they bolster the rushing game with a RB that doesn't catch the ball, and stockpile the D with run defenders as if this is 1988.

 

All the while not one person in the Bills sports media bothers to point out that 35 sacks from Schwartz's D were gotten from players still on this team, it's just that Ryan can't get them from those players. Apparently run defenders will help.

 

Prior to the draft the talk, here and elsewhere, was about how we needed pass rushers. So we get run defenders and everyone applauds Whaley.

 

5-7 wins this season, if Taylor, Watkins, Woods, or Glenn go down, we'll be lucky to win any games at all from that point onward.

 

Wait. Did you just say there was "Watkins type talent" sitting right there at our pick at 19? WHO? No for real. I mean honestly. Who the hell are you talking about and why didn't I get the damn memo?

[Guest K-GunJimKelly12]

I obviously don't post on here often but I had to chime in here real quick. All in all I was a fan of this draft for sure, that said some of the posters on this board are borderline insane. "All Hail Doug Whaley", "Best Bills Draft Ever", people saying Whaley is the best GM we ever had when Bill Polian built a team that went to 4 straight Super Bowls and was in the playoffs consistently for over a decade. Seriously get a grip people. I like what they did but we still haven't made the playoffs in 16 years and the draft has been over for a day. This is without a doubt the board for homers.

Edited May 1, 2016 by K-GunJimKelly12

[Beerball]

So I get a reprimand the other day for saying someone was clueless, but this is acceptable? Next time I'll call him a dick or just say he's too stupid if he doesn't agree with me. Nice.

I'd recommend you don't, but, you can always give it a try. (and you weren't reprimanded, you were asked to not take personal shots at people)

[Hapless Bills Fan]

They do. You're just too simple to know how to use them.

 

Images, I got. Tables, I will confess, I must also be too simple to know how to use them.

 

I really feel PFF's OL statistics have to be taken with a grain of salt. The fact is, we were the top rushing team in the NFL, and if you take out all the QB rushing yards (not just TT's, every teams), we were still in the top 10, maybe top 5. TT was taking a freakin' long time to throw. You don't get there with a total tire fire at OL.

 

The OP says "Yet this off-season Bills management has done nothing significant via FA or the draft to address the right side of the OL." The devil is always in the weasel words like "nothing significant".

 

Yes, they let Urbik go in what was very likely a cap move. They signed C-G Fernando Velasco from the Panthers, presumably because they think he may be an upgrade to Urbik. They resigned Jordan Mills - I thought he had a good rookie year at OT for the Bears under Aaron Kromer before breaking his foot and requiring surgery. Not so good in 2014, bounced around in 2015 before the Bills signed him. Did the foot require a full year to recover and the Bills have hopes he'll return to form?

 

Then there are the UDFA linemen the Bills signed: Marquis Lucas (G), Jamison Lalk (G-C), Keith Lumpkin (T), Robert Kugler © - so far

In 2014, when the Bills drafted 3 OL, 2 LB, and a DB, their UDFA signings included 2 LB, 3 DB, and 2 DLmen - nothing on the offensive side of the line.

In 2015, when the Bills drafted a CB, a late LB, and otherwise all O (G, RB, TE, WR), their UDFA included 2 OT as well as several more DB

It seems pretty clear that the Bills try, year by year, to balance the draft by taking a shot on positions they didn't draft from the UDFA pool.

 

My point is it can be weasel-worded whether or not the FA and UDFA signings on OL are "significant" or not, but it seems pretty clear that the Bills didn't sign 2 vet and 4 rookie FA because they're relying upon "the power of prayer" to improve the OL. Rather, with major holes on D and the D being the team's weakness and with salary cap tight, they're doing the best they can to find gems where they can, in 2nd tier FA and undrafted players.

 

Moreover, when one places something in quotes, it implies that it's something someone has said, around here, either someone from the Bills organization or news media, which is clearly from the OP's article not the case - shoddy.

Edited May 1, 2016 by Hopeful

[White Linen]

 

Images, I got. Tables, I will confess, I must also be too simple to know how to use them.

 

I really feel PFF's OL statistics have to be taken with a grain of salt. The fact is, we were the top rushing team in the NFL, and if you take out all the QB rushing yards (not just TT's, every teams), we were still in the top 10, maybe top 5. TT was taking a freakin' long time to throw. You don't get there with a total tire fire at OL.

 

The OP says "Yet this off-season Bills management has done nothing significant via FA or the draft to address the right side of the OL." The devil is always in the weasel words like "nothing significant".

 

Yes, they let Urbik go in what was very likely a cap move. They signed C-G Fernando Velasco from the Panthers, presumably because they think he may be an upgrade to Urbik. They resigned Jordan Mills - I thought he had a good rookie year at OT for the Bears under Aaron Kromer before breaking his foot and requiring surgery. Not so good in 2014, bounced around in 2015 before the Bills signed him. Did the foot require a full year to recover and the Bills have hopes he'll return to form?

 

Then there are the UDFA linemen the Bills signed: Marquis Lucas (G), Jamison Lalk (G-C), Keith Lumpkin (T), Robert Kugler © - so far

In 2014, when the Bills drafted 3 OL, 2 LB, and a DB, their UDFA signings included 2 LB, 3 DB, and 2 DLmen - nothing on the offensive side of the line.

In 2015, when the Bills drafted a CB, a late LB, and otherwise all O (G, RB, TE, WR), their UDFA included 2 OT as well as several more DB

It seems pretty clear that the Bills try, year by year, to balance the draft by taking a shot on positions they didn't draft from the UDFA pool.

 

My point is it can be weasel-worded whether or not the FA and UDFA signings on OL are "significant" or not, but it seems pretty clear that the Bills didn't sign 2 vet and 4 rookie FA because they're relying upon "the power of prayer" to improve the OL. Rather, with major holes on D and the D being the team's weakness and with salary cap tight, they're doing the best they can to find gems where they can, in 2nd tier FA and undrafted players.

 

Moreover, when one places something in quotes, it implies that it's something someone has said, around here, either someone from the Bills organization or news media, which is clearly from the OP's article not the case - shoddy.

 

Excellent post

[klos63]

I'd recommend you don't, but, you can always give it a try. (and you weren't reprimanded, you were asked to not take personal shots at people)

my post was deleted, i considered that a reprimand. You said the posters you disagreed with were either stupid or dicks, I said someone was clueless. Your comments are acceptable, but mine is not?

Edited May 1, 2016 by klos63

[YoloinOhio]

 

Images, I got. Tables, I will confess, I must also be too simple to know how to use them.

 

I really feel PFF's OL statistics have to be taken with a grain of salt. The fact is, we were the top rushing team in the NFL, and if you take out all the QB rushing yards (not just TT's, every teams), we were still in the top 10, maybe top 5. TT was taking a freakin' long time to throw. You don't get there with a total tire fire at OL.

 

The OP says "Yet this off-season Bills management has done nothing significant via FA or the draft to address the right side of the OL." The devil is always in the weasel words like "nothing significant".

 

Yes, they let Urbik go in what was very likely a cap move. They signed C-G Fernando Velasco from the Panthers, presumably because they think he may be an upgrade to Urbik. They resigned Jordan Mills - I thought he had a good rookie year at OT for the Bears under Aaron Kromer before breaking his foot and requiring surgery. Not so good in 2014, bounced around in 2015 before the Bills signed him. Did the foot require a full year to recover and the Bills have hopes he'll return to form?

 

Then there are the UDFA linemen the Bills signed: Marquis Lucas (G), Jamison Lalk (G-C), Keith Lumpkin (T), Robert Kugler © - so far

In 2014, when the Bills drafted 3 OL, 2 LB, and a DB, their UDFA signings included 2 LB, 3 DB, and 2 DLmen - nothing on the offensive side of the line.

In 2015, when the Bills drafted a CB, a late LB, and otherwise all O (G, RB, TE, WR), their UDFA included 2 OT as well as several more DB

It seems pretty clear that the Bills try, year by year, to balance the draft by taking a shot on positions they didn't draft from the UDFA pool.

 

My point is it can be weasel-worded whether or not the FA and UDFA signings on OL are "significant" or not, but it seems pretty clear that the Bills didn't sign 2 vet and 4 rookie FA because they're relying upon "the power of prayer" to improve the OL. Rather, with major holes on D and the D being the team's weakness and with salary cap tight, they're doing the best they can to find gems where they can, in 2nd tier FA and undrafted players.

 

Moreover, when one places something in quotes, it implies that it's something someone has said, around here, either someone from the Bills organization or news media, which is clearly from the OP's article not the case - shoddy.

very informative post!