Maury Ballstein Posted May 30, 2016 Share Posted May 30, 2016 I suppose not. It may cost everyone their jobs over there. If he plays like the Texans starter who got yanked for Ryan Mallett it may cost everyone their jobs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted May 30, 2016 Share Posted May 30, 2016 Some perspective. $18 million puts him in a 3 way tie for 15th highest paid QB in the NFL for the 2016 season. By 2018 Luck, Carr, Bridgewater, Bortles and Stafford will all pass him. By 2019 Winston and Mariota pass him. You probably have Brady and Brees close to retirement. So if they give him $18 Million next year, by year 3 of the deal he will be no higher than the 20th highest paid QB in the NFL. I really dont know how this happened, where the bottom 3rd of the NFL is so close to the elite top 5 QB's. You look at any other position and the elite top 5 guys are paid about double or triple what the bottom 3rd starters are paid. Somehow paying QBs has gotten out of control. John Elway is right, there are no middle contracts for QBs anymore. Go back tp 2011, Peyton Manning made $18 million and the 20th paid starter made $6 million. Next year the highest paid will make $22 million and the 20th paid $18 million. What the heck happened? You make excellent points and well expressed. But let's use your Denver example to underscore the points I have made on the topic. The model is the Elway model. He told the fading Peyton that if he wanted to play for the Broncos last season he had to take a pay cut. He did. He placed a ceiling value on Osweiller and wasn't willing to go beyond that line on a contract offer. Osweiller moved on and Elway didn't seem to be bothered by the loss. Elway did have some interest in dealing for Kaepernick but not at his current contract level. Kaepernick was not willing to redo his contract so Elway moved on. Elway then used a first round pick to select a qb so he had a young qb in the pipeline. Kirby Jackson brought up qbs such as Collins, Kaepernick and Tannihill as qbs and contracts to compare with the Fitz situation. Collectively those contracts can be characterized as over-paid contracts relative to production. That's the model that the Jets don't want to follow. The model they are following is the Elway model: assign a value to talent level and then exhibit fortitude by sticking to your value rating. It appear that is what the Jets are doing. I'm not anti-Fitz. He is an admirable fellow. However, he is a limited qb who is very heady.He is also at the very end of his mostly middling career. The market has placed a value on him: No one but the Jets is interested in him. As it stands I consider the Jets stance as being very rational and reasonable. If there is a contract agreement odds are it will be skewed more toward the Jets' position than the Fitz position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted May 30, 2016 Share Posted May 30, 2016 (edited) Sometimes I feel like some posters aren't paying attention to the rest of the league. Fitz got paid for 5 good games in 2011. Tanny got hugely paid for 1 good season. Cutler got paid for having a decent season. Kaep got paid for 1 and 1/2 good seasons. Osweiler played a handful of games worse than Fitz and got paid. Not to say that Fitz has the potential of those other guys. But a certain performance level, dictates a certain price. I have to agree with you and Mr Kirby. i have said before, if they expect him to start he should be paid like one. and 12 mil is not going to cut it. And the 2-3 year salary appears an insult. 15 sounds reasonable, not sure what the rest of the contract should look like though ? How long before this becomes just bad blood within the team? Some perspective. $18 million puts him in a 3 way tie for 15th highest paid QB in the NFL for the 2016 season. By 2018 Luck, Carr, Bridgewater, Bortles and Stafford will all pass him. By 2019 Winston and Mariota pass him. You probably have Brady and Brees close to retirement. So if they give him $18 Million next year, by year 3 of the deal he will be no higher than the 20th highest paid QB in the NFL. I really dont know how this happened, where the bottom 3rd of the NFL is so close to the elite top 5 QB's. You look at any other position and the elite top 5 guys are paid about double or triple what the bottom 3rd starters are paid. Somehow paying QBs has gotten out of control. John Elway is right, there are no middle contracts for QBs anymore. Go back tp 2011, Peyton Manning made $18 million and the 20th paid starter made $6 million. Next year the highest paid will make $22 million and the 20th paid $18 million. What the heck happened? desperation for success and the focus of the NFL to make the QB the star of the team with this pass game trend. the common theme is that you cannot win big one without and elite QB , so everyone hopes they can mold one , perhaps ? Edited May 30, 2016 by 3rdand12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saxum Posted May 30, 2016 Share Posted May 30, 2016 Huh? The article says he was likely offered a 3-year $24M with $12M in the first year. Yes but has other details such as why Jest can not get around cap issues by using incentives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Stampede Posted May 30, 2016 Share Posted May 30, 2016 desperation for success and the focus of the NFL to make the QB the star of the team with this pass game trend. the common theme is that you cannot win big one without and elite QB , so everyone hopes they can mold one , perhaps ? Could be the pass happy NFL is fooling GMs. Today a 88 QB rating is pretty average. 2015 there were 24 QBs with a 88+ QB rating, that doesn't even include some of the highest paid QBs, Peyton, Flacco, Romo, and Kaepernick. 2014 there were18 QBs 88+, 2013 16 QBs 88+, 2012 11 QBs 88+. Teams need are being fooled by the big inflated #s of today's QBs. Fitz probably fits into the inflated numbers category. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted May 30, 2016 Share Posted May 30, 2016 Could be the pass happy NFL is fooling GMs. Today a 88 QB rating is pretty average. 2015 there were 24 QBs with a 88+ QB rating, that doesn't even include some of the highest paid QBs, Peyton, Flacco, Romo, and Kaepernick. 2014 there were18 QBs 88+, 2013 16 QBs 88+, 2012 11 QBs 88+. Teams need are being fooled by the big inflated #s of today's QBs. Fitz probably fits into the inflated numbers category. I feel quite sure that GMs are each and everyone looking hard for the next franchise QB. Whether it be GB NO Pats** Ravens etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted May 30, 2016 Share Posted May 30, 2016 Let's forget about the market for a second. Fitz's leverage is someone else wanting him. No one has placed any interest at a contract even close to what 2nd tier starting QB in the league. At best he's going to sign for $12-13 mil / yr for a couple of years with only so much guaranteed. They need to place incentives in his contract for winning in the playoffs. Let him bet on his arm and brain. Some compromise will work out. You can tell from the releases of information it's getting closer. They don't really need him until training camp so my bet is we see him in early July. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted May 30, 2016 Share Posted May 30, 2016 Let's forget about the market for a second. Fitz's leverage is someone else wanting him. No one has placed any interest at a contract even close to what 2nd tier starting QB in the league. At best he's going to sign for $12-13 mil / yr for a couple of years with only so much guaranteed. They need to place incentives in his contract for winning in the playoffs. Let him bet on his arm and brain. Some compromise will work out. You can tell from the releases of information it's getting closer. They don't really need him until training camp so my bet is we see him in early July. The flip side is that he has just as much leverage as they do (which is why the market matters). They can't enter the year with their current QB depth chart. Decker & Marshall already skipped the OTAs in protest. It's a 2 way street. It's true that someone has to want to pay him but he also has to be willing to accept their offer. They need each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 The flip side is that he has just as much leverage as they do (which is why the market matters). They can't enter the year with their current QB depth chart. Decker & Marshall already skipped the OTAs in protest. It's a 2 way street. It's true that someone has to want to pay him but he also has to be willing to accept their offer. They need each other. Marriage can be an interesting proposition can't it ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Both pretty passes, but neither 50 yards. The Stevie pass was thrown from the 50 and hit Stevie at about the two yard line the first time he touched it, and the T.O. pass was thrown from about three yards deep and caught at the 45. He threw one ball over 50 that I ever saw, it went around 56 yards and was on a kind of a little bootleg to the left motion and he was going at a full run towards the LOS when he threw it. Other than that nobody's ever shown a 50 yard pass with the Bills by Fitz. 48 yards is a pretty long ball, though. If you say so dude. I rewatched both of them. On t!he first one Fitz threw it 5 yards deep in the EZ and TO caught it on the 47. The other Fitz threw it standing on the 50 and bounced off of SJ's hands at the goal one. But whatever ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 But whatever ... Exactly. LaDanian Tomlinson threw a number of TD passes in his career........does that make him a great red-zone QB? It's not about the handful of deep passes he completed......it's about the high number of them that he did not. Somewhat less compelling youtube material. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted May 31, 2016 Author Share Posted May 31, 2016 @rapsheet While #Jets have OTAs, this offer waits for Ryan Fitzpatrick: 3 yrs, $24M that can be $36M with incentives. $12M in yr 1. More than $15M gtd @profootballtalk But base value of $24M over three years. $8M/year average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 @MMehtaNYDN Jets sources: Ryan Fitzpatrick could sign elsewhere for less on principle. Story: http://nydn.us/1RIXwgG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 @MMehtaNYDN Jets sources: Ryan Fitzpatrick could sign elsewhere for less on principle. Story: http://nydn.us/1RIXwgG I have had this strange feeling that he will sign a 2-year deal in Denver. With Fitz at the helm they are still Super Bowl contenders (can't believe I just typed that). They can use Fitz as the bridge to Lynch and let Sanchez back him up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 @SiriusXMNFL Brandon Marshall and Eric Decker at #Jets OTA's today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristocrat Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 I have had this strange feeling that he will sign a 2-year deal in Denver. With Fitz at the helm they are still Super Bowl contenders (can't believe I just typed that). They can use Fitz as the bridge to Lynch and let Sanchez back him up. the broncos could cut sanchez and save about 3.5 mil against the cap giving them close to 10 mil in space. i'm sure they could figure out another move to slide fitzy in there. I just wonder how the von miller deal is gonna go as they could tag him 2 years in a row and still be less per than what he's asking for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 @MMehtaNYDN Jets sources: Ryan Fitzpatrick could sign elsewhere for less on principle. Story: http://nydn.us/1RIXwgG Or he could do it just to spite the JESTS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benderbender Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 @MMehtaNYDN Jets sources: Ryan Fitzpatrick could sign elsewhere for less on principle. Story: http://nydn.us/1RIXwgG It's exactly what he did to us. His principles told him to be a backup on another team for less money. I see him doing the same thing again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iinii Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 @MMehtaNYDN Jets sources: Ryan Fitzpatrick could sign elsewhere for less on principle. Story: http://nydn.us/1RIXwgG Could being the operative word here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 @domcosentino Time for Ryan Fitzpatrick to put up or shut up with #Jets: http://www.nj.com/jets/index.ssf/2016/05/time_for_ryan_fitzpatrick_to_put_up_or_shut_up_wit.html #nyj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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