JW sez Bills going D with first pick

[section122]

Let's have this discussion after this season and without the locker room cancer on the squad

The thing is....

 

I don't place last year's performance solely on Mario. Him quitting was certainly a detriment. The biggest change in the 2 years was injuries. 2014 saw an incredible situation with regards to staying injury free. 2015 not so much. Also, even though Crayonz is on another crusade (I thought these violated the TOS) most of us aren't excusing Rex. He came in and tried to blend his and Scwartz's defense and it didn't work. Then he tried to go full bore into his defense and it was too late in the year. He shares some of the blame but just as he wants to say it is dumb to put it all on Mario, it is dumb to put it all on Rex.

[FireChan]

 

Oops my apologies. I thought it came out much earlier.

 

I think the writing was on the wall that he was gone pretty much no matter what. That money was used on Glenn and Gilmore. Where would they have found the money to keep either Bradham or Mario? Those moves were going to be made regardless.

We have a $7M dead cap hit from cutting Mario. I think there's a good chance we could've extended him and dropped his ungodly cap number closer to that.

 

Maybe it wouldn't have possible. All I'm saying is that it wasn't a sure thing, until 2015 happened.

[GG]

Richardson and Wilkerson, barring injury, will both be worth $100M deals. Dispute that if you dare. And how much did Snacks get? A cool $9M per?

 

Unless RR's scheme invented UDFA and rookie wage scales, I don't see how it's the reason they were so cheap.

That's the point, they're both worth that much and that's why Jets won't keep both. Do you wonder why Jets used a Forrest doing luck last year on dl despite having two of the best players at that position?

 

Schwartz's defense is dependent on having the stars upfront, but that defense can't be sustained because it's insane to invest that much money the DL.

 

So it gets back to the inane point that D wouldn't have been a priority if Schwartz was still around.

[FireChan]

That's the point, they're both worth that much and that's why Jets won't keep both. Do you wonder why Jets used a Forrest doing luck last year on dl despite having two of the best players at that position?

 

Schwartz's defense is dependent on having the stars upfront, but that defense can't be sustained because it's insane to invest that much money the DL.

 

So it gets back to the inane point that D wouldn't have been a priority if Schwartz was still around.

Are you being intentionally obtuse? RR's defense is no more sustainable if his 3 stars would all leave for huge contracts. After all, we all saw how he did without his "guys."

 

If Schwartz found a top 10 DT in UDFA, and had two top 10 DE's out of the box as draft picks, his defense would be "cheap" too. It's apples to orangutans.

 

What the Jets do next year has no bearing on this, just because they can't afford Mo and Richardson means nothing.

 

Unless RR's scheme invented UDFA and rookie wage scales, I don't see how it's the reason they were so cheap.

Edited April 27, 2016 by FireChan

[Coach Tuesday]

That's the point, they're both worth that much and that's why Jets won't keep both. Do you wonder why Jets used a Forrest doing luck last year on dl despite having two of the best players at that position?

 

Schwartz's defense is dependent on having the stars upfront, but that defense can't be sustained because it's insane to invest that much money the DL.

 

So it gets back to the inane point that D wouldn't have been a priority if Schwartz was still around.

Correct, tho it's coincidental that this works out in Rex's favor. But pass rush specialists get overpaid. Olivier Vernon just got major coin and he's nothing special. Whereas a scheme that can generate pressure without being overly reliant on individual pass rushers is much more cap-friendly.

[billsfan89]

I see the Bills either going DT or pass rusher. But if they go offense I see it being a WR. They need some more punch on the outside and it's honestly the best position to go if they go offense (RT could be nabbed in round 2 or 3).

[GG]

Correct, tho it's coincidental that this works out in Rex's favor. But pass rush specialists get overpaid. Olivier Vernon just got major coin and he's nothing special. Whereas a scheme that can generate pressure without being overly reliant on individual pass rushers is much more cap-friendly.

And this is precisely the history of his defenses compared to Schwartz. His defense is easier to restock than Schwartz's once the base is set. Schwartz walked into an ideal situation in buffalo. Will be interesting to see how he does in Philly without three Pro bowlers.

Are you being intentionally obtuse? RR's defense is no more sustainable if his 3 stars would all leave for huge contracts. After all, we all saw how he did without his "guys."

 

If Schwartz found a top 10 DT in UDFA, and had two top 10 DE's out of the box as draft picks, his defense would be "cheap" too. It's apples to orangutans.

 

What the Jets do next year has no bearing on this, just because they can't afford Mo and Richardson means nothing.

 

Unless RR's scheme invented UDFA and rookie wage scales, I don't see how it's the reason they were so cheap.

But that defense isn't sustainable because you have to pay therm all eventually or draft a replacement.

 

And it reinforces the inane point that D wouldn't be a priority in this draft if Schwartz was around.

We have a $7M dead cap hit from cutting Mario. I think there's a good chance we could've extended him and dropped his ungodly cap number closer to that.

 

Maybe it wouldn't have possible. All I'm saying is that it wasn't a sure thing, until 2015 happened.

Mario's total hit for 2015 was $25 million. Outside of taking a big cut, he was not going to stay on the roster

[FireChan]

But that defense isn't sustainable because you have to pay therm all eventually or draft a replacement.

 

And it reinforces the inane point that D wouldn't be a priority in this draft if Schwartz was around.

Let me ask again.

 

Did we have the strong man CB play for cheap in 2015 because we ran Rex Ryan's defense or because we had two top 10 CB's playing on rookie deals?

 

Defense would be less of a priority than it is now. Every team loses players every year. You trying to hammer home that the salary cap exists is embarrassing.

 

Someone will also need to explain to me how having two above average 4-3 LB's in Bradham and Brown is equal to having terrible 3-4 LB's who are basically camp bodies.

Edited April 27, 2016 by FireChan

[4merper4mer]

Let's have this discussion after this season and without the locker room cancer on the squad

And if Rex's stuff works feel free to excoriate me. Link my posts and mock me to the ends of the Earth. I won't care because I will be thrilled that the Bills were successful. I may even come on here and mock myself. What the heck, I'll start right now:

 

Last year I created a thread where I asked people to pick one team and predict their record, but only if you wildly disagreed with the Vegas O/U on their win total. I went first. My choice was Denver going 5-11.

 

 

I hope I need 1000 of those smileys after Rex's genius kicks in. I also hope to do a triple lindy when I go to the pool this summer and would really like to see a rainbow farting unicorn capture a UFO and give it to Greggy.

[boyst]

 

no names, too many possibilities, including trade-down option to pin things down.

 

jw

you should have said cornerback just to !@#$ with Bill.

..your arguments...

rex ryan might have a lot of young talent but they have invested a ton in their drafts. they had something like an average of 5-6 first rounders starting while he was there. at one point, they had 7 or 8. i did the whole thing looking it up... it was amazing how much talent was there, and how much they struck out a few times with that talent was remarkably low. the cornerback, for example, was their worst first round pick. the rest have been phenomenal. idzik drafted well.

[3rdand12]

That is accurate.

 

jw

[YoloinOhio]

Big if true

[3rdand12]

Most logical way to go given the needs and hopefully they can facilitate a trade down before making their 1st selection.

Yes please, still get two D and indulge a bit along the way. say WR?

[boyst]

Yes please, still get two D and indulge a bit along the way. say WR?

the drop off of the top 2 or 3 wr's is tremendous and there are no eye dropping, mouth watering prospects at wr this year. hell, watkins could have been the first pick this year if he was going out.

[3rdand12]

Makes sense. I'd like them to stay at 19 and take BPA. Trading down is risky and they'll just be getting a weaker player, in theory.

 

Taking the best LB at 19 and a DL in the 2nd seems like a great scenario to me.

Saw a mock today with 4 qbs taken before 19. Stay in the first round and Bills can can some quality stock

the drop off of the top 2 or 3 wr's is tremendous and there are no eye dropping, mouth watering prospects at wr this year. hell, watkins could have been the first pick this year if he was going out.

There are some nice players in the 3rd though. and we already have two 4ths

the drop off of the top 2 or 3 wr's is tremendous and there are no eye dropping, mouth watering prospects at wr this year. hell, watkins could have been the first pick this year if he was going out.

 

Saw a mock today with 4 qbs taken before 19. Stay in the first round and Bills can can some quality stock

There are some nice players in the 3rd though. and we already have two 4ths

and 62 i was not thinking stars just something better than Hogan and Goodwin : )

[BuffaloHokie13]

And if Rex's stuff works feel free to excoriate me. Link my posts and mock me to the ends of the Earth. I won't care because I will be thrilled that the Bills were successful. I may even come on here and mock myself. What the heck, I'll start right now:

 

Last year I created a thread where I asked people to pick one team and predict their record, but only if you wildly disagreed with the Vegas O/U on their win total. I went first. My choice was Denver going 5-11.

 

 

I hope I need 1000 of those smileys after Rex's genius kicks in. I also hope to do a triple lindy when I go to the pool this summer and would really like to see a rainbow farting unicorn capture a UFO and give it to Greggy.

I'm pretty sure I took SD in that thread as winning 11 or 12 games. They're obviously picking 3rd tomorrow.

[Augie]

you should have said cornerback just to !@#$ with Bill.

rex ryan might have a lot of young talent but they have invested a ton in their drafts. they had something like an average of 5-6 first rounders starting while he was there. at one point, they had 7 or 8. i did the whole thing looking it up... it was amazing how much talent was there, and how much they struck out a few times with that talent was remarkably low. the cornerback, for example, was their worst first round pick. the rest have been phenomenal. idzik drafted well.

That's the way I remembered it. Rex drafted heavily for D. It helped to perpetuate his perception (or myth, depending upon your view point). There's a reason their offense stunk. The D should have been even better for all those picks. I want Doug in charge this weekend.

[K-9]

The thing is....

 

I don't place last year's performance solely on Mario. Him quitting was certainly a detriment. The biggest change in the 2 years was injuries. 2014 saw an incredible situation with regards to staying injury free. 2015 not so much. Also, even though Crayonz is on another crusade (I thought these violated the TOS) most of us aren't excusing Rex. He came in and tried to blend his and Scwartz's defense and it didn't work. Then he tried to go full bore into his defense and it was too late in the year. He shares some of the blame but just as he wants to say it is dumb to put it all on Mario, it is dumb to put it all on Rex.

Good post.

 

Rex screwed the pooch.

 

Mario screwed his teammates.

 

Rex made changes after the bye. Especially with how he used Dareus. At least he tried to change things up.

 

Mario continued to screw his teammates.

 

And the idea that we could have or would have retained MW this season is ludicrous. He DELIBERATELY played his way off the team and the Bills didn't want him for league minimum after that.

 

Mario Joe Hobert.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[4merper4mer]

I'm pretty sure I took SD in that thread as winning 11 or 12 games. They're obviously picking 3rd tomorrow.

Here's the link.

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

Not a fan of going away from BAP.

 

Just take the best player; if we don't have an immediate need this year at a position, we will probably have one soon enough.