Brady suspension reinstated!

[Gugny]

True, they indeed did and it was a great accomplishment for that team. The defense they have now and the offense is completely different. If Brady were to go down for the season they would be fortunate to reach 8-8. That being said, he is only missing the first 4 barring injury. Cardinals, Texans, Phins, and the Bills. I expect them to be 1-3 after 4 weeks if not 0-4.

 

To clarify, I wasn't trying to compare the 2008 Pats to the 2016 Pats and I agree that they're not nearly as talented now, as then.

 

However, they still have a phenomenal coaching staff, excellent receivers and a "better than good" defense. I see AZ as the only likely loss out of those four games. I predict 3-1; 2-2 at worst.

[eball]

 

Are you really trivializing the absence of (arguably) the best QB in the history of the NFL and what the impact of that absence was? Most rational people (I'll go ahead and count myself in) would say that going 11-5 - regardless of strength of schedule - in the NFL, with a backup, without the best QB in the NFL. Well, that's pretty damn good.

 

Trivializing? Just the opposite! Brady* means more to that team than Belichick!

[Gugny]

 

Trivializing? Just the opposite! Brady* means more to that team than Belichick!

 

But you said, "It's not relevant to the discussion of whether Belichick or Brady* mean more to the team by mentioning that a 16-0 team dropped to 11-5 with a ridiculously easy schedule -- the only "real" difference being no Brady?"

 

No Brady was the ONLY difference.

[eball]

 

But you said, "It's not relevant to the discussion of whether Belichick or Brady* mean more to the team by mentioning that a 16-0 team dropped to 11-5 with a ridiculously easy schedule -- the only "real" difference being no Brady?"

 

No Brady was the ONLY difference.

 

Yes, I did -- in direct response to your post that comparing the 16-0 and 11-5 teams was "pointless." Read it again.

[H2o]

 

To clarify, I wasn't trying to compare the 2008 Pats to the 2016 Pats and I agree that they're not nearly as talented now, as then.

 

However, they still have a phenomenal coaching staff, excellent receivers and a "better than good" defense. I see AZ as the only likely loss out of those four games. I predict 3-1; 2-2 at worst.

The coaching is good, but my personal opinion is they are trying to polish a turd with Garofalo. I think 2-2 would be a best case scenario for them. I see them losing to AZ with Chandler Jones proving a point, Houston with their good defense and improved offense, then I believe we or Miami sneak one from them if not both of us. It's going to be a rough start for the Pats***.

[IDBillzFan]

 

 

The photo below was my screensaver for, like, ever....

 

[Deranged Rhino]

I work with a guy that spent 7 years with the Pats (he left there about 6 or 7 years ago). He is getting hell from me today (and he is in a "Patriots Alumni" shirt). This is a day to celebrate!!

[Doc]

To clarify, I wasn't trying to compare the 2008 Pats to the 2016 Pats and I agree that they're not nearly as talented now, as then.

 

However, they still have a phenomenal coaching staff, excellent receivers and a "better than good" defense. I see AZ as the only likely loss out of those four games. I predict 3-1; 2-2 at worst.

 

Without Brady, their receivers aren't nearly as good (except Gronk) and their OL looks as bad as it really is. And their defense took a hit with trading Jones and losing Easley. I see them going 1-3 with Garppooopllolo at the helm.

[CommonCents]

Bill B. is a sub .500 coach without Brady.

[Buffalo Barbarian]

Tom needs nothing else

 

http://www.beautyrest.com/dream-in-black

 

Edited July 13, 2016 by Buffalo Barbarian

[4merper4mer]

 

 

 

The rest of your post is drivel. The Bills' roster --- is just as talented as anyone else's roster in the division,

 

 

Correct

 

 

 

and they have a pretty good stable of coaches as well.

 

 

 

Incorrect

[Jerry Jabber]

 

This. If not for a miraculous David Tyree catch that team probably would have gone done as the best ever.

 

Thank goodness for David Tyree!

At worst they go 2-2 w/ Jimmy. I mean, how many games did they win with Cassel? Nothing phases them, as long as Belichick is there they will be favs to win the Bowl and nothing changes this year. Sure, I'm happy Brady will miss time but in the grand scheme we know the story remains the same.

 

I'm thinking they go 1-3 with Janeane. Brady has always been a slow starter, so with him sitting the first four games favors the rest of the AFC.

[YoloinOhio]

 

Thank goodness for David Tyree!

 

 

I'm thinking they go 1-3 with Janeane. Brady has always been a slow starter, so with him sitting the first four games favors the rest of the AFC.

i have been watching some clips of JG that are being tweeted out from last preseason. He holds the ball forever and throws YOLO passes. Edited July 13, 2016 by YoloinOhio

[Ronin]

At worst they go 2-2 w/ Jimmy. I mean, how many games did they win with Cassel? Nothing phases them, as long as Belichick is there they will be favs to win the Bowl and nothing changes this year. Sure, I'm happy Brady will miss time but in the grand scheme we know the story remains the same.

 

People don't realize that w/ Cassel, other than divisional opponents, the best team that they beat was the 9-7, besides the Jets and who were also overrated that season because the Pats weren't very good, they beat only teams that finished .500 or worse.

 

Their schedule is tougher this year like ours. Two divisional teams, Houston who has a great D unlike any of the teams mentioned above, and Arizona who has a great D, are their first four opponents.

 

People don't realize that it's Brady, not Belichick who was 5-13 with the Pats using Bledsoe, that has been the reason for their winning.

 

Same thing last season, when Brady averaged only 1.25 TDs/game over his last four, they went 2-2 beating the Titans and Texans only, losing to the Jets and Fins.

 

Garoppolo had one prolific season in a non-FBS school playing against small time schools. Throwing 7 TDs against a school like Illinois St. or 5 TDs against Appalachian State, schools that are warm-up fodder for FBS schools, hardly qualifies him to play in the NFL.

 

He's a craps shoot at best. Who knows, maybe he'll shine, but my money says he's going to struggle. Everyone thinks that the Pats are automatically a 11-5 team with Brady and 13-3/14-2 otherwise. IMO they're a ballpark .500 team w/o Brady, plus/minus. Belichick has almost no history of success apart from Brady. He made the playoffs only once w/o him on the merits of having had a #1 ranked D, had the fortune of playing Bledsoe, Santa Claus, in the playoffs, before having the Steelers mop the floor with him.

 

In 7 seasons of coaching, w/o Brady, Belichick has made the playoffs once, is 1-1 in the playoffs, and is 52-62 otherwise, and as I mentioned earlier, his season with Cassel was not impressive. He didn't beat any good teams unless you happen to think that the Pennington-led Fins or Favre-led Jets were good.

 

This is going to be interesting and it wouldn't surpise me that if after that stretch the Pats are 1-3 and everyone's talking about this very topic.

 

In other news, everyone still considers Belichick to be some sort of defensive genius, but in his last eight seasons his defenses simply haven't been great. When he had top talent he had a top D, shouldn't surprise anyone. Typical for a lot of coaches, better talent, better play.

 

Since 2008 he's had the following ranked yardage Ds: 10th, 11th, 25th, 31st, 25th, 26th, 13th, 9th

Since 1008 he's had the following ranked scoring Ds: 8th, 5th, 8th, 15th, 9th, 10th, 8th, 10th.

 

That might look good initially, but when we consider that he's played in a division that has had QBs like Pennington, Penne, Moore, Tannehill, Sanchez, Smith, Fitzpatrick, Edwards, Manuel, Orton, and Taylor, most playing a one or two and done season, it's hardly impressive when that's 40% of your schedule.

 

Thank goodness for David Tyree!

 

I'm thinking they go 1-3 with Janeane. Brady has always been a slow starter, so with him sitting the first four games favors the rest of the AFC.

 

All I know is that the Pats' D is massively overrated. They can't rely on their D like other teams with no QB. So figure that they're like any other team with an above average but not great D, a highly questionable QB, a suspect rushing game, a suspect OL, and WRs that typically have only been good while playing for Brady. ... besides Gronk that is who's exceptional, but also injury prone. Besides, teams will double him now.

 

Amendola sucked before he went to NE. Edelman's a starter there and his numbers as a starter have hardly been impressive. He's also questionable to start the season. Brady's skill is spreading the ball around. If JP can do that I'll eat my shorts during halftime. That would be a miracle.

 

The more I think about it, middle of the road D, marginal OL, quite frankly and apart from Gronk mediocre receiving corps, no RB capable of dominating, non-stellar secondary, ... wouldn't stun me to see them go 0-4.

[Saxum]

i have been watching some clips of JG that are being tweeted out from last preseason. He holds the ball forever and throws YOLO passes.

 

YOLO passes? That must mean he just throws and throws and throws hoping for a catch.

[Ronin]

 

They went 11-5 the last time. Missing the playoffs that year was a fluke.

 

What was a fluke was their schedule. Look at it sometime that season.

 

I've said this, they beat no one, unless you happen to think that the Pennington-led Fins or geriatric Favre-led Jets were forces to be reckoned with, which is a laugh. Neither had a great D.

 

Without an easy schedule that season the Pats would have been .500 easily.

 

Why are you defending NE?

Just because the Bills beat the Jets twice, doesn't make the Bills a better team (not by a long shot, really, as the Jets played a meaningful week 17 game). All that means is that our head coach put all of his eggs into the "revenge" basket, but forgot that there were 14 other games to prepare for. Hence the crap record at the end of the season.

 

Agreed.

 

Divisional games are different. I remember during the Cowboys' 1-15 season, their sole win was against the 10-6 Skins. Happens all the time. Rex has played the Pats well with a dearth of talent in comparison. He can't seem to piece together a consistent season though.

 

BTW, having said that, this also highlights how much of an advantage the Pats have had during the Brady era having been fortunate enough to have been nestled in the AFCE with three other poorly run teams that haven't had decent QBs since the '90s.

Edited July 13, 2016 by TaskersGhost

[Gugny]

 

What was a fluke was their schedule. Look at it sometime that season.

 

I've said this, they beat no one, unless you happen to think that the Pennington-led Fins or geriatric Favre-led Jets were forces to be reckoned with, which is a laugh. Neither had a great D.

 

Without an easy schedule that season the Pats would have been .500 easily.

 

Why are you defending NE?

 

Agreed.

 

Divisional games are different. I remember during the Cowboys' 1-15 season, their sole win was against the 10-6 Skins. Happens all the time. Rex has played the Pats well with a dearth of talent in comparison. He can't seem to piece together a consistent season though.

 

BTW, having said that, this also highlights how much of an advantage the Pats have had during the Brady era having been fortunate enough to have been nestled in the AFCE with three other poorly run teams that haven't had decent QBs since the '90s.

 

They had an easy schedule with a backup QB and went 11-5. I think that's what someone would expect an elite team, which is missing its QB (just Tom Brady in 2008, no biggie), to do with an easy schedule.

 

You guys act as if every team with an easy schedule should win 16 games. That's stupid.

[Ronin]

i have been watching some clips of JG that are being tweeted out from last preseason. He holds the ball forever and throws YOLO passes.

 

All I know is that he last played for an FCS school, Eastern Illinois. Heaving 7 TDs against teams like Illinois St. doesn't matter.

 

He played against third-rate opponents there, the kinds of teams that are in week one for good FBS schools as warmup games.

 

His best four games there were against Illinois St., Northern Illinois, Tennessee-Martin, and Appalachian St. Big deal. That was about half of his 53 TD total that season.

 

He's completely unproven in the NFL, has an average D to help him, no significant support in the running game, receivers that are probably only as good as they are because they play with Brady, Amendola being a prime example. Even then, their receivers are average at best besides Gronk.

 

Gronk isn't enough to carry a team that won five games by 7 points last season to victory w/ Garoppolo under center behind a dicey OL.

 

They had an easy schedule with a backup QB and went 11-5. I think that's what someone would expect an elite team, which is missing its QB (just Tom Brady in 2008, no biggie), to do with an easy schedule.

 

You guys act as if every team with an easy schedule should win 16 games. That's stupid.

 

Point taken, but my angle is that they had the easiest, truly, the 32nd ranked, schedule in the league that year.

 

If Belichick were all that he should have been able to do a little bit more than the Fins with Pennington, the Jets with a washed up Favre, or us with Edwards than he did.

 

I mean do you really think that any of those teams were better than the Pats with Cassel? Remember, Cassel's put together one other much better season with the Chiefs too.

 

The Pats had the best scoring D in the AFCE, the most points scored too, against lesser teams in the AFCE, with the easiest schedule in the league, and still couldn't prevent the Fins from winning the division. The Fins who were 1-15 the season prior and 7-9 the season following.

 

Still think that's impressive? I don't. What it says to me is that if the Pats had had a middle-of-the-road schedule they may have been 6-10 or 7-9 and any talk of who is more important, Brady or Belicheat, would have been ended after that season.

 

Anyway, I think we're going to see that in September this season. I think that discussion is going to rear its head in NFL circles.

[Gugny]

 

All I know is that he last played for an FCS school, Eastern Illinois. Heaving 7 TDs against teams like Illinois St. doesn't matter.

 

He played against third-rate opponents there, the kinds of teams that are in week one for good FBS schools as warmup games.

 

His best four games there were against Illinois St., Northern Illinois, Tennessee-Martin, and Appalachian St. Big deal. That was about half of his 53 TD total that season.

 

He's completely unproven in the NFL, has an average D to help him, no significant support in the running game, receivers that are probably only as good as they are because they play with Brady, Amendola being a prime example. Even then, their receivers are average at best besides Gronk.

 

Gronk isn't enough to carry a team that won five games by 7 points last season to victory w/ Garoppolo under center behind a dicey OL.

 

I wish I could be this optimistic about the demise of the Pats. As longs as Bill B. and Josh M. are there, however, I won't hold my breath.

[Ronin]

 

I wish I could be this optimistic about the demise of the Pats. As longs as Bill B. and Josh M. are there, however, I won't hold my breath.

 

Bill B hasn't done squat in the NFL w/o Brady. He SUCKED with Bledsoe. 5-13 with essentially the same team that Brady took to the playoffs.

 

I don't even credit Belicheat with knowing that Brady was better. If he had known he would have tossed that bum and put in Brady w/o having had his hand forced. He's just lucky that Bledsoe had that injury or Brady probably would have been playing for some other team long ago like most of their backups that come in for one contract and never get resigned.

 

BTW, I already cited this, but the Pats went 2-2 last season with Brady's late-season diminished play. They needed 3 TD games from him to beat both the Texans and Broncos, neither of which had great offenses last season and with Osweiler playing for Denver.

 

If Belicheat is smart he'll retire when Brady finishes to keep any tarnish off of his legacy. Between the cheating and a post-Brady demise, plenty of questions would arise.

Edited July 13, 2016 by TaskersGhost