hondo in seattle Posted March 27, 2016 Posted March 27, 2016 (edited) I thought Dunne's article about Sammy was great. Much like his article about TT where he got together a panel of current and former NFL players, and a former coach. I'd much, much rather read the opinion of subject matter experts than suffer through another uninformed Sully rant. By putting together a panel, we get exposed to a variety of POVs. TV does this all the time but we don't often see this approach in print media. At least, not in Buffalo... not until Dunne joined the BN. Granted it's too many if's but... if TT takes the next step, if Sammy lives up to his awesome potential, and if Shady stays healthy, this offense could be very productive in '16. Edited March 27, 2016 by hondo in seattle
BarleyNY Posted March 27, 2016 Posted March 27, 2016 Not worth what the FO should have been able to do with those picks, but definitely worth what the FO would have done with those picks. Why keep obsessing? It's over. Move on.
GunnerBill Posted March 27, 2016 Posted March 27, 2016 Yes, it was a good trade. I thought Watkins was the best player in that draft class.........and my guess is that OBJ will fade and Sammy will be the better player over the long haul. It's interesting to note that Watkins didn't overwhelm in the 40 pre-draft but was arguably the fastest receiver in pads in the NFL last year. His skill level is under-appreciated nationally because he plays on a bad team that has been one of the worst passing teams in the league in his first couple seasons. Their mistake at the WR position has been passing over talented players at the position while reaching for need with the picks they've had since. +1
Augie Posted March 27, 2016 Posted March 27, 2016 (edited) The BN editors should take a cue from the TSW mods and suggest Tyler use the search function as this topic has been discussed ad nauseam. Writers gotta write..... Edited March 27, 2016 by Augie
3rdand12 Posted March 27, 2016 Posted March 27, 2016 Sammy will be as good/great as TT and Roman allow him to be. I was not a fan of the pick because as some have mentioned, it was unlikely he was going to get enough opportunity. And that is exactly what we saw. I was not a fan of him speaking out. Till TT started chucking the ball to him in some risky coverages. and Sammy made the play. again and again. Now, i wonder if he even has a ceiling ? Hindsight is a funny animal. Watkins is one hell of a football player and i am now fine with the pick. Yet another reason, why I am not a GM !!
Augie Posted March 27, 2016 Posted March 27, 2016 Measured against optimal draft picks with the benefit of hindsight? No. Measured against almost anything else? Yes. That sounds about right.
3rdand12 Posted March 27, 2016 Posted March 27, 2016 I thought Dunne's article about Sammy was great. Much like his article about TT where he got together a panel of current and former NFL players, and a former coach. I'd much, much rather read the opinion of subject matter experts than suffer through another uninformed Sully rant. By putting together a panel, we get exposed to a variety of POVs. TV does this all the time but we don't often see this approach in print media. At least, not in Buffalo... not until Dunne joined the BN. Granted it's too many if's but... if TT takes the next step, if Sammy lives up to his awesome potential, and if Shady stays healthy, this offense could be very productive in '16. good post hondo !
mannc Posted March 27, 2016 Posted March 27, 2016 (edited) Yes, it was a good trade. I thought Watkins was the best player in that draft class.........and my guess is that OBJ will fade and Sammy will be the better player over the long haul. It's interesting to note that Watkins didn't overwhelm in the 40 pre-draft but was arguably the fastest receiver in pads in the NFL last year. His skill level is under-appreciated nationally because he plays on a bad team that has been one of the worst passing teams in the league in his first couple seasons. Their mistake at the WR position has been passing over talented players at the position while reaching for need with the picks they've had since. After coming out strongly against the trade, I am coming around to this view. Look how helpless the offense was last year when Sammy was sidelined (or simply ignored). Like other stud WRs, he opens up the whole field and makes his teammates better. It's why high-end WRs are the second most valuable players in the game today. Edited March 27, 2016 by mannc
Buffalo Barbarian Posted March 27, 2016 Posted March 27, 2016 @TyDunne Sammy Watkins panel: Andre Reed, Tim Brown, James Lofton, Cris Carter, Eric Moulds analyze the #Bills WR, the trade: https://t.co/2kbiR4zvEF considering it was a good yr for WRs we should not have traded up, Plus we would have had our 2015 1st rd pick. Yes, of course it was. It wasn't in the sense that ok, we could've stayed at 9 and taken Beckham. But a) according to most, we probably wouldn't have taken Beckham and b) everybody had Watkins ahead of Beckham going into the draft; in fact, a lot of people had Watkins as the #1 overall player in the whole draft. Bottom line, Watkins is worth a 9th overall pick and a 20th overall pick or whatever we would've picked last year. Just imagine if we had Ebron and some guard instead of Watkins. I liked the move at the time and I still do today. Sit back relax and marvel at the season he is going to have this year now that the Bills finally realized you have to get the ball in his hands even when he's not wide open. And believe me, if Beckham was on the Bills the last two years and Watkins was on the Giants, we'd think about these two players very differently. Watkins is a complete beast just like everyone knew he would be. Ok just read the article. What the hell is James Lofton talking about when he tries to make the analogy involving an appetizer at a restaurant? because they couldn't figure that out last yr, I'll believe it when I see it.
metzelaars_lives Posted March 27, 2016 Posted March 27, 2016 Measured against optimal draft picks with the benefit of hindsight? No. Measured against almost anything else? Yes. Exactly. Couldn't have said it any better. considering it was a good yr for WRs we should not have traded up, Plus we would have had our 2015 1st rd pick. because they couldn't figure that out last yr, I'll believe it when I see it. Uhh where did he rank in the league the last 8 weeks of the season?
Buffalo Barbarian Posted March 27, 2016 Posted March 27, 2016 Exactly. Couldn't have said it any better. Uhh where did he rank in the league the last 8 weeks of the season? I was referring to our QB finding him open in the middle
The Jokeman Posted March 27, 2016 Posted March 27, 2016 (edited) I bet if asked Cleveland fans if they'd prefer to have Justin Gilbert, Cameron Irving and Ibraheim Campbell or Sammy Watkins I'm pretty sure most would side with us. Edited March 27, 2016 by The Jokeman
Augie Posted March 27, 2016 Posted March 27, 2016 I bet if asked Cleveland fans if they'd prefer to have Justin Gilbert, Cameron Irving and Ibraheim Campbell or Sammy Watkins I'm pretty sure most would side with us. That's a good way to look at it. But someone might argue, what would a competent team do with those picks? It's all a crap shoot, and we got a great player.
hondo in seattle Posted March 28, 2016 Posted March 28, 2016 That's a good way to look at it. But someone might argue, what would a competent team do with those picks? It's all a crap shoot, and we got a great player. It would be interesting to know what the Bills draft board looked like the past couple of years. I'd love, for instance, to know who we would have drafted if we hadn't traded up for Sammy. For the longest time, I thought the price we paid for Sammy was too high. But the recent thread suggesting that even top 5 picks have only a 50% hit rate lately made me rethink my position a little. Probabilistically, if we hadn't traded up for Sammy we wouldn't be any better off than we are now. One of the first round picks would likely have been a miss, if not both. Even the top of the 1st round is a crap shoot. Two 1st draft picks netted us one really good player. That seems to be a reasonable expectation and not an altogether bad deal.
Kirby Jackson Posted March 28, 2016 Posted March 28, 2016 (edited) It would be interesting to know what the Bills draft board looked like the past couple of years. I'd love, for instance, to know who we would have drafted if we hadn't traded up for Sammy. For the longest time, I thought the price we paid for Sammy was too high. But the recent thread suggesting that even top 5 picks have only a 50% hit rate lately made me rethink my position a little. Probabilistically, if we hadn't traded up for Sammy we wouldn't be any better off than we are now. One of the first round picks would likely have been a miss, if not both. Even the top of the 1st round is a crap shoot. Two 1st draft picks netted us one really good player. That seems to be a reasonable expectation and not an altogether bad deal. We would have taken Ebron if not for the trade up. We did like Beckham too but Ebron was going to be the pick. Ironically, Darby may have been the pick last year if they had a 1st. I don't know that one to be for sure but he was by far the highest player on their board when they got him last year. Edited March 28, 2016 by Kirby Jackson
dave mcbride Posted March 28, 2016 Posted March 28, 2016 We would have taken Ebron if not for the trade up. We did like Beckham too but Ebron was going to be the pick. Ironically, Darby may have been the pick last year if they had a 1st. I don't know that one to be for sure but he was by far the highest player on their board when they got him last year. Good stuff, Kirby. Amd Badol, good take above. I personally supported the trade from day one.
Nihilarian Posted March 28, 2016 Posted March 28, 2016 Saying the move was worth it, because if we didn't do it we'd draft bums, is an interesting argument. That is correct, though. Whaley stated his choice would have been TE Eric Ebron who went 10th to Detroit. While not really a bum the guy hasn't done much so far. Someone mentioned the other WR's in the draft and the next years were lacking. Like Odell Beckham Jr, Brandin Cooks, Kelvin Benjamin, Allen Robinson? Then Tyler Lockett, Arami Cooper in 2015's draft. The Bills lost their 2015 first round pick and a fourth. Then the biggest issue I have is that if all the team needed was a superstar WR, then 100% yes! But the team still had holes and still doesn't have a solid for sure franchise QB to even throw to him. By the time TT evolves into that elite QB (if ever) Watkins could be leaving Buffalo after his four years are up. JMO
Deranged Rhino Posted March 28, 2016 Posted March 28, 2016 But the team still had holes and still doesn't have a solid for sure franchise QB to even throw to him. By the time TT evolves into that elite QB (if ever) Watkins could be leaving Buffalo after his four years are up. JMO He could, but I'll be SHOCKED if he doesn't play through at least a second contract in Buffalo. The money won't be an issue and there's room (ahead) in the cap to get a deal done. The franchise has too much invested in him to let him walk after his rookie deal. Figure he gets tagged (twice if needs be) as a worst case scenario.
Tipster19 Posted March 28, 2016 Posted March 28, 2016 Watkins could be leaving Buffalo after his four years are up. JMO He has a 5 year contract if Buffalo wants to rightfully exercise the 5th year of the contract. If only 57%, or whatever that stat is, of 1st rid picks hitting then using two 1st rd picks to insure that we get a bonafide star makes it a bit more palatable for me. Of course one cannot ignore that we also threw in a 4 th rder but I'll chalk that up to being Buffalo just being, well, just Buffalo being Buffalo. When it's all said and done I'm very happy that we made the trade now, especially that Sammy is from Fort Myers (239 baby!) and I just got done living there for the last 21+ years, it only made it sweeter.
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