BradRiter Posted February 18, 2005 Share Posted February 18, 2005 http://www.newsday.com/sports/hockey/ny-sp...ports-headlines BY ALAN HAHN STAFF WRITER February 18, 2005 On the day after, there was quiet all around the NHL. No dueling faxes, no posturing and definitely no one talking -- publicly, anyway -- about the faction of players and agents working to put together a proposal to somehow save their sport, if not this season. According to a person with knowledge of the situation, the group is forming an offer it hopes to soon present to the NHL. The proposal, the source said, involves a $46-million cap with a 100 percent luxury tax that starts at $42 million. There also is a provision that drops the cap to $42 million should more than eight teams hit the $46-million cap in the same season. "This is not being done with the union," the source said. It is not known whether the group will first approach NHL Players Association executive director Bob Goodenow to see if he will agree to present it to the league. If not, the group might circumvent Goodenow and offer it directly to NHL commissioner Gary Bettman. A source familiar with labor negotiations said such a "back channel" communication violates labor law but is a generally accepted tactic. The motivation behind this stems from hints Bettman dropped during his news conference Wednesday, when he canceled the NHL season. The NHL's final proposal was a $42.5-million hard salary cap, while the NHLPA offered a $49- million soft cap. Bettman said if the union had brought a $44-million cap offer, the league would "have had to look at that very, very seriously." Bettman also said, "If they wanted 45 , they should have told us." The source said it was "crystal clear the league would be willing to entertain another offer." The NHLPA continually denied there were any proposals under consideration within the union. NHL chief counsel Bill Daly said he has not been in contact with anyone. The Hockey News, however, reported "veteran players are believed to be involved in a movement to resurrect the season." The publication quoted Detroit captain Steve Yzerman as saying there still is time to save the season. "I don't know if it's necessarily tonight, tomorrow morning, Friday night or Saturday," Yzerman said. "I know the season has been canceled, but it's not too late to un-cancel it." With the cancellation came a warning. ESPN executive vice president Mark Shapiro told the Chicago Tribune, "God forbid [for the league] we find something successful that takes the place of hockey." Copyright © 2005, Newsday, Inc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted February 18, 2005 Share Posted February 18, 2005 Thanks for the info, Brad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BradRiter Posted February 18, 2005 Author Share Posted February 18, 2005 I'm the only person I know who thought "hey, this isn't over" when listening to Bettman the other day. Well, I guess I wasn't the ONLY one. So did the players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BradRiter Posted February 18, 2005 Author Share Posted February 18, 2005 More... http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/sport...10929381.htm?1c By TIM PANACCIO Philadelphia Inquirer PHILADELPHIA - There was considerable speculation on Thursday among players and general managers that a small group of players is attempting to formulate a new proposal that would be delivered to the National Hockey League Players Association's executive committee in hopes of reviving the 2004-05 season, which was canceled by commissioner Gary Bettman Wednesday. Several players and GMs said they heard discussions were taking place, but had no direct knowledge of who might be involved. "There's a deal there at $45 million if the union offers it," said one league management official. Bettman took the historic, ignominious step because he was unable to get a new collective bargaining agreement. The league's last offer was $42.5 million and the union countered at $49 million. Both the NHL and NHL Players Association on Thursday denied any new offer was coming from the union. Ted Saskin, the senior director of the union, said, "I suspect one person started an uninformed rumor and it spreads as most rumors do. I certainly do not suspect anyone broke any ranks or is negotiating on our side. All negotiations came to a crashing halt with (Bettman's) cancellation. "I'm hearing the owners want to continue negotiations. But we have had no contact with the league office. Will they accept $45 million? I don't know. It's not coming from the players' side. We made an offer and Gary canceled the season. Some of the owners recognize the strength of our offer and now they are questioning whether shutting down was the best course of action." Bill Daly, the league's chief legal counsel, said he had not received any offers from the union. "I'm not prepared to speculate on what the internal dynamics and reaction of the union and its membership might be following (Wednesday's) announcement," he said. "I consider that to be the union's business, not ours. We still need to negotiate a new CBA with the union, and we're prepared to return to the table to achieve that objective any time they are." Neither Bettman nor Daly has ruled out the possibility that they would revive the season if a deal were reached rather quickly. One management source said that Daly advised some players not to contact the league office directly until they had a deal to present through their own executive committee. "There's no chance we will present something to them," union president Trevor Linden said Thursday night from Vancouver. "If Gary wants to pick up the phone and call me, we'll talk. If Gary wants to engage us, he should. I'm hearing from ownership that some still want to find a deal. There are owners still trying to talk how a deal could get done. The players are comfortable with our position." Linden said that because Bettman canceled the season, he feels Bettman has to make the next move and reach out to the players. Asked if some faction of players was trying to get something done on the side, he said, "Absolutely untrue." There's considerable anger being expressed right on the union's secured Web site from players who first felt betrayed that the union agreed to a salary cap, then felt outraged that the league flatly turned them down on a $49 million cap when the two sides were just $6.5 million apart. The rumored players' group is not breaking from the union's ranks but trying to get executive director Bob Goodenow to make another offer at $45 million. "We'd have to vote on this," said Flyer captain Keith Primeau. "It would not fly unless this went through our executive committee. I've checked into these rumors myself. I have heard some names of who might be involved and those names don't surprise me." One NHL player said that he had been getting phone calls about the matter and that he believed there were owners, GMs and players who still hoped that a settlement could be reached. Detroit captain Steve Yzerman told the Hockey News on Thursday that he thinks there is still time to save the season. "I don't know if it's necessarily tonight, tomorrow morning, Friday night or Saturday," he said. "I know the season has been canceled, but it's not too late to un-cancel it." The Hockey News said that Phoenix owner Wayne Gretzky had been in contact with the union's executive committee, urging it to make another offer. Speaking on the CBC, Gretzky said, "It's absolutely not true." Some players believe that Phoenix GM Mike Barnett had offered advice to the group as well. "This does not involve me and nobody has come to me," Barnett said Thursday night. Barnett did say, however, he has heard rumors that some players have encouraged the union to make another offer. Flyers president Ron Ryan said he also heard the same rumors. Ryan said he placed a call to the league office on Thursday to find out if there were any truth to them. He said he had not received an answer. Flyers GM Bob Clarke said his peers have been asking themselves the same question. "The knowledge I have is the same as others," he said. "I heard from talking to other GMs that there were rumors of this going on. I don't have any confirmation that it is real, though." Tampa Bay GM Jay Feaster, whose Lightning won the Stanley Cup last year, added, "I've heard this myself today but I don't have any independent confirmation." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweet baboo Posted February 18, 2005 Share Posted February 18, 2005 just let it die...do they really think people are actually going to show up for a few pathetic games at this point? go amerks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalomike Posted February 18, 2005 Share Posted February 18, 2005 OK Brad what happens if they start to play and the sabres make the playoffs. Does that mean you will almost never have to work because of sabres playoff games and yankee regular season games on WGR? SWEET GIG! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jester43 Posted February 18, 2005 Share Posted February 18, 2005 my concern about this deal is that it would resume hockey under terms within which the sabres STILL cannot be competitive. isn't 46million (or 42 million) way over what the sabres can pay and still turn a profit? if that's so, i don't see what good it does. i'm for cap that all the teams can afford, so that our team has a shot to buy some decent talent once in awhile (since it can't seem to draft any). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Gross Posted February 18, 2005 Share Posted February 18, 2005 my concern about this deal is that it would resume hockey under terms within which the sabres STILL cannot be competitive. isn't 46million (or 42 million) way over what the sabres can pay and still turn a profit? if that's so, i don't see what good it does. i'm for cap that all the teams can afford, so that our team has a shot to buy some decent talent once in awhile (since it can't seem to draft any). 244524[/snapback] For one thing, the team salary for the sabres was heading into the high 30's this off-season. For another, it isn't mandatory that teams spend the cap amount. What it will do is bring the Red Wing, Rangers, etc down closer to our salary level. If the two teams with salaries under $40M can go to the Stanley Cup in 2004 without a cap, what do you think the chances are with a cap? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadBuffaloDisease Posted February 18, 2005 Share Posted February 18, 2005 The NHL needs a HARD cap. Not this luxury tax crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seq004 Posted February 18, 2005 Share Posted February 18, 2005 They'll still screw it up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jester43 Posted February 18, 2005 Share Posted February 18, 2005 For one thing, the team salary for the sabres was heading into the high 30's this off-season. For another, it isn't mandatory that teams spend the cap amount. What it will do is bring the Red Wing, Rangers, etc down closer to our salary level. If the two teams with salaries under $40M can go to the Stanley Cup in 2004 without a cap, what do you think the chances are with a cap? 244529[/snapback] but aren't the sabres hemorraging (sic?) cash with that payroll? i don't think golisano ever intended to put up with annual losses of $10million just for the privilege of owning the sabres. maybe i'm wrong, but i think he was biding his time until the league could impose a hard cap that was much much less than the owners last offer...something the sabres could afford to pay every year and still break even. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zow2 Posted February 18, 2005 Share Posted February 18, 2005 my concern about this deal is that it would resume hockey under terms within which the sabres STILL cannot be competitive. isn't 46million (or 42 million) way over what the sabres can pay and still turn a profit? if that's so, i don't see what good it does. i'm for cap that all the teams can afford, so that our team has a shot to buy some decent talent once in awhile (since it can't seem to draft any). 244524[/snapback] I was listening to my local radio station this morning and they had Ted Leonsis on (Capitals owner and one time free wheeling spender). Ted told Betteman that $44M is too high. He said some of the owners are desperate to get hockey back and agreed to it but he feels $44M gives an average of $1.8M per player and revenues do not justify it. He already has many players on his team calling him and wanting to play for whatever is offered at this point. He said if they get this thing done over the spring/summer they will get a hard cap in and it will be less than $40M. He went on to say that no matter how the players spin it, the owners are not out to screw them. They will be paid handsomely to play a game and will be treated better than any hockey players on the planet....but the golden goose (i.e. the last CBA agreement) is over and the new agreement will be in line with the type of cash that NHL hockey generates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IndyJay1234 Posted February 18, 2005 Share Posted February 18, 2005 I was listening to my local radio station this morning and they had Ted Leonsis on (Capitals owner and one time free wheeling spender). Ted told Betteman that $44M is too high. He said some of the owners are desperate to get hockey back and agreed to it but he feels $44M gives an average of $1.8M per player and revenues do not justify it. He already has many players on his team calling him and wanting to play for whatever is offered at this point. He said if they get this thing done over the spring/summer they will get a hard cap in and it will be less than $40M. He went on to say that no matter how the players spin it, the owners are not out to screw them. They will be paid handsomely to play a game and will be treated better than any hockey players on the planet....but the golden goose (i.e. the last CBA agreement) is over and the new agreement will be in line with the type of cash that NHL hockey generates. 244623[/snapback] He is absolutely right. A cap at 46 million is similar to a NFL cap at 80-85 million. 23 players vs 50. The NFL makes a ton more than the NHL. How can they survive? YOU PLAY HOCKEY!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevestojan Posted February 18, 2005 Share Posted February 18, 2005 the group might circumvent Goodenow best idea anyone has had to date in this whole situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevestojan Posted February 18, 2005 Share Posted February 18, 2005 It's funny to me that everyone keeps using the salary cap as if EVERY team will reach it... you guys keep saying "$46 million is too high, hockey doesn't bring that in"... It's a CAP... many teams won't even come CLOSE to that. We can always hope... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammered a Lot Posted February 18, 2005 Share Posted February 18, 2005 OK Brad what happens if they start to play and the sabres make the playoffs. Does that mean you will almost never have to work because of sabres playoff games and yankee regular season games on WGR? SWEET GIG! And have to take a pay cut due to lack of air time? Or if there is no hockey= poorer book=less advertising $$$$=Entercom goes to the Red Budget= Pay Cut I noticed last night (Thursday around 7) you had a lot of Canadian callers. With the increased interest in Canada with Cricket will you be hosting a regular Cricket segment??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jester43 Posted February 18, 2005 Share Posted February 18, 2005 It's funny to me that everyone keeps using the salary cap as if EVERY team will reach it... you guys keep saying "$46 million is too high, hockey doesn't bring that in"... It's a CAP... many teams won't even come CLOSE to that. We can always hope... 244637[/snapback] detroit...rangers...philly...those teams will spend to the cap and still gain an unfair advantage over teams like buffalo. not that sabres don't share some of the blame with their sh------- drafting over the years, but it sucks when your favorite team already has 2 strikes against it like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerJ Posted February 18, 2005 Share Posted February 18, 2005 Has there ever been a union that botched negotiations so badly? I don't know about anything meaningful happening this season. If they can do something that would bring some long term stability to the NHL that does not leave small market teams like Buffalo virtual farm clubs to the larger market teams, I'll be happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted February 18, 2005 Share Posted February 18, 2005 As Bucky Gleason stated in his column in the Buffalo News yesterday.... "I'm not sure what was more disturbing, Bettman's final offer that included a $42.5 million salary cap or Goodenow's refusal to accept it. You know how much $42.5 million equates to when sliced up for a 23-man roster? About $1.8 million per player, which was the average salary last season when teams were drowning in red ink." Earlier in the column he mentions that owners wanted to get the average salary down by about 500k. Offering 42.5 doesn't make sense from an owners perspective. http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20050217/1067357.asp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snorom Posted February 18, 2005 Share Posted February 18, 2005 screw them. just start a new league next year and build it from there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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