stony Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 Just rob the drug dealers and prostitutes. It's not hard. Yup, just watch Training Day or American Hustle. Easy to get rich being a cop.
Mr. WEO Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 (edited) Â And how do you prove that? Â Â See above. How do you prove he assisted or encouraged them? Â Â The victim's testimony. Â He didn't run out as the fight started. He didn't try to break it up. So that leaves the following possibilities: he physically participated, he verbally encouraged or he stood by passively and simply observed the human condition unfolding before him. Â I'll bet you know which he didn't do of the three... Edited February 9, 2016 by Mr. WEO
JohnC Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 Not to make this a football conversation but they traded an injured LB who was one of the worst in the NFL for a Pro Bowl RB. There is no doubt that McCoy is a premier talent but in hindsight was it smart to invest so much money in a back when a good back can be had for a reasonable price? He had a rich contract with the Eagles when he was acquired.. The GM then boosted that contract to make him more amenable to coming to Buffalo. Â All the facts in the Philly bar altercation haven't come out yet but from what has already come out he looks to be in serious legal and league trouble. This guy has been associated with a string of questionable incidents that paint a picture of a person who not only has bad judgment but has a hostile attitude. Â I don't want to come off as a revisionist because I was in favor of acquiring such a play making back. But I was troubled when his contract was reworked and I was also very troubled when he called his former coach a racist and then cowardly refused to take his phone call. He has also been associated with a string of troubling incidents. Â I'm not prejudging.the bar fracas just yet because all the facts haven't come out yet. But if you ask me what my premature opinion is on how this is going to turn out from what I already know I would say that he is in serious legal trouble. In cases such as this regardless who the individual is I say the person should be held accountable for his/her actions.
eball Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 Â Why do you feel the Bills will obtain cap relief? Â I don't have any idea and haven't investigated it -- I'm (perhaps) talking out of turn for those who do believe there would be some relief if a player is convicted of a violent crime.
truth on hold Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 Â I don't have any idea and haven't investigated it -- I'm (perhaps) talking out of turn for those who do believe there would be some relief if a player is convicted of a violent crime. Didn't pats do that with Hernandez?
Maury Ballstein Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 Didn't pats do that with Hernandez? How many people did McCoy kill?
Doc Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 In Pennsylvania, proving conspiracy requires an agreement to engage in criminal conduct and an overt act in furtherance of that agreement. If McCoy was merely present while his friend started beating someone up he is not culpable for assault or conspiracy. However, if he assisted in the assault he can be found guilty as an accomplice, even without an agreement, which is a different standard than a co-conspirator  The victim's testimony.  He didn't run out as the fight started. He didn't try to break it up. So that leaves the following possibilities: he physically participated, he verbally encouraged or he stood by passively and simply observed the human condition unfolding before him.  I'll bet you know which he didn't do of the three...  The victim's testimony is worthless and any halfway decent lawyer would destroy it. And see the above post. Doing nothing doesn't make him an accomplice. As I said, there needs to be better video of the incident showing him hitting someone.
Kirby Jackson Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 There is no doubt that McCoy is a premier talent but in hindsight was it smart to invest so much money in a back when a good back can be had for a reasonable price? He had a rich contract with the Eagles when he was acquired.. The GM then boosted that contract to make him more amenable to coming to Buffalo.  All the facts in the Philly bar altercation haven't come out yet but from what has already come out he looks to be in serious legal and league trouble. This guy has been associated with a string of questionable incidents that paint a picture of a person who not only has bad judgment but has a hostile attitude.  I don't want to come off as a revisionist because I was in favor of acquiring such a play making back. But I was troubled when his contract was reworked and I was also very troubled when he called his former coach a racist and then cowardly refused to take his phone call. He has also been associated with a string of troubling incidents.  I'm not prejudging.the bar fracas just yet because all the facts haven't come out yet. But if you ask me what my premature opinion is on how this is going to turn out from what I already know I would say that he is in serious legal trouble. In cases such as this regardless who the individual is I say the person should be held accountable for his/her actions. The point that I was making with character is the guy the Bills traded had more character concerns at the time. At worst, that part was a wash (at least at the time). If you count in the injuries they traded for the safer and better player. In terms of the contract, I don't love it but he is still elite when healthy. He was great last year when he played. You pay for top end talent. What separates him from someone like Demarco (virtually the same contract) is that he can make plays on his own. He can make the people around him look good not the other way around. I have no issues with what the Bills did to get and keep McCoy.  The troubling part is that he acts before he thinks. I don't know how this will all play out but if I had to guess he gets a game or maybe 2 (and more bad PR). At the end of the day if the Bills want to get to the top they need the talent to do it even if some of the headaches are involved. How many people did McCoy kill?I believe 3 that we know of but he was "quenstioned" on 1 or 2 more in college. He's a serial killer!!
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 Â Â The victim's testimony is worthless and any halfway decent lawyer would destroy it. And see the above post. Doing nothing doesn't make him an accomplice. As I said, there needs to be better video of the incident showing him hitting someone. Â The trial wouldn't be for quite a while if there is a trial - which there most likely won't be. Since the trial would be in a few months - testimony gets grey since no one really remembers what happened.
Mr. WEO Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 Â Â The victim's testimony is worthless and any halfway decent lawyer would destroy it. And see the above post. Doing nothing doesn't make him an accomplice. As I said, there needs to be better video of the incident showing him hitting someone. Â Â So if both victims testify that Shady was hitting them or encouraging others, his lawyers will be able to "destroy" that testimony in front of a jury? How? Why is an eyewitness in this case uniquely "worthless"? Â Do you think that a jury will believe him if McCoy testifies that he neither ran away, tried to stop the fight, participated nor encouraged? And THAT'S not indestructible testimony?
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 (edited) Â The victim's testimony. He didn't run out as the fight started. He didn't try to break it up. So that leaves the following possibilities: he physically participated, he verbally encouraged or he stood by passively and simply observed the human condition unfolding before him. I'll bet you know which he didn't do of the three... Â Thing is Weo, if there is evidence or question that the victim was "f**ked up" (ie drunk) and he's down, it's hard for an objective person to believe he has a clear, unbiased vision of what happened. And there can be alternate explanations. He was part of the pile? Hey, I was trying to pull my friend off. His foot went forward? A la Ndamakong Suh, he lost his balance being pushed and was trying to step. He was heard saying "C'mon, man, C'mon man", he meant "C'mon, don't do this, stop it". Same for bystanders. Â Our legal system is based on innocent until proven guilty, and reasonable doubt. A good lawyer is good at creating these in the minds of the jury, and that's all that's needed. Â NFL players tend to get into trouble when they go back to their old homes and hang with their old guys. It's good for the ego - get to go back and be 'local boy makes good' and be the big man and treat all your friends. Problem is if trouble erupts and if you're there, you're part of the trouble. Or to put it another way, **** happens when you got a bunch of young fit testosterone-laden males getting ****-faced. Â The only way to change it is to change your habits and associates. Troubling that McCoy hasn't figured this yet. Edited February 9, 2016 by Hopeful
papazoid Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 what was the name of the champagne ? Â could be adding grand theft charges.
Doc Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 The trial wouldn't be for quite a while if there is a trial - which there most likely won't be. Since the trial would be in a few months - testimony gets grey since no one really remembers what happened. Â I doubt they remember much just after it considering the time and state of inebriation.
JohnC Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 Â Â The victim's testimony is worthless and any halfway decent lawyer would destroy it. And see the above post. Doing nothing doesn't make him an accomplice. As I said, there needs to be better video of the incident showing him hitting someone. The victims' testimonies are not worthless if they match up with what other witnesses say, such as employees and patrons at the club. If the bartender or server confirms the claim that the off-duty cops were served the champagne before the others that certainly is material if it was taken from them. Witness statements are very often inconclusive and contradictory. But if statements are taken from a number of people who were at the event and for the most part they are consistent with each other then there is certainly a clarity to what happened. Â Just because there is a video it doesn't always tell you what the full story of the situation of how it started and the verbal exchanges were between the parties. So not having the video isn't necessarily fatal to making a case one way or another.
ALF Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 The bouncers breaking it up should be sober and credible , enough for Roger anyway.
CommonCents Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 Â Thing is Weo, if there is evidence or question that the victim was "f**ked up" (ie drunk) and he's down, it's hard for an objective person to believe he has a clear, unbiased vision of what happened. And there can be alternate explanations. He was part of the pile? Hey, I was trying to pull my friend off. His foot went forward? A la Ndamakong Suh, he lost his balance being pushed and was trying to step. He was heard saying "C'mon, man, C'mon man", he meant "C'mon, don't do this, stop it". Same for bystanders. Â Our legal system is based on innocent until proven guilty, and reasonable doubt. A good lawyer is good at creating these in the minds of the jury, and that's all that's needed. Â NFL players tend to get into trouble when they go back to their old homes and hang with their old guys. It's good for the ego - get to go back and be 'local boy makes good' and be the big man and treat all your friends. Problem is if trouble erupts and if you're there, you're part of the trouble. Or to put it another way, **** happens when you got a bunch of young fit testosterone-laden males getting ****-faced. Â The only way to change it is to change your habits and associates. Troubling that McCoy hasn't figured this yet. Well written. I think it's more about embarrassing Shady and the gang now and the case will dissolve into some kind of settlement. The statement made by a member of the Philly PD was something to the affect of going to Buffalo and act like a fool don't do it here. Sounds like they have seen/heard enough of the local kid and are going to send him a message. Â My guess is all 4 get arrested then in a month or so they will drop charges and settle with Shady. The guy swinging the bottle on the video may see a trial. If it pans out as such I wonder if the league or team will discipline him, that's all that really matters to me. Can he play or not? He is not a guy I cheer for off the field.
JohnC Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 The bouncers breaking it up should be sober and credible , enough for Roger anyway. You bring up a good point. The establishment has a stake in cooperating with the authorities because their liquor license and ability to operate is at stake.
HT02 Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 #bluelivesmatter Where do you think the protests will take place to protest the beatings.... oh wait its the police who cares
Kirby Jackson Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 You bring up a good point. The establishment has a stake in cooperating with the authorities because their liquor license and ability to operate is at stake. The issue is that this doesn't look good for the NFL or the police department. Neither side wants this. Let's not forget that the cameras were already "not working."
BuffaloBaumer Posted February 9, 2016 Posted February 9, 2016 Time to bring up that Kiko trade thread when it happened. What do the Bills need most again right now........You can pretty much guarantee McCoy is toast for the first 4 games of the season and one year older.
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