Maury Ballstein Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 Um no offense but I'm pretty sure Shady, and most NFL players, would dismantle 98% of dudes in a "real fight" in "your father's home town", whatever that means. I think I'd put my money on the world class professional athlete over dad any day lol. I'd take any 4 random Pitt Panthers over "the olde country".
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 I'm in Philly this week for work and hearing a lot of chatter about this case. Â One thing that keeps coming up: Apparently it's a known practice among less than savory cops and friends of those less than savory cops (i.e. bouncers) in the club scene here to order bottles of champagne and put it on the tab of VIPs there partying, in the hopes that they don't notice. If they do notice and make a stink, vaya con dios, nobody in charge will take your side. Â Hearing that combined with the fact that the security cameras were "not working" makes me think there's a lot more to this case than we can possibly know. Â And in general, cell phone videos are notorious for starting up well after a situation has escalated, providing zero context. Â There was probably more than enough bad decision-making to go around that night, but I know I'm reserving judgement and not kicking anyone off the team quite yet. Â Interesting, Lends a possible different perspective to what sounded like an act of thuggery (taking the cop's champagne bottle).
BarleyNY Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 Definitely holding on judgement against Shady until we know more. Seems like this was a fight, not an assault on unsuspecting victims. Sounds like the other dudes lost the fight. Â Shouldn't they be charged too if there are charges being levied for fisticuffs? Â The lack of evidence that the cops hit anyone would be the problem there. McCoy and his friends should have gone to the police department to show their injuries if they had any. It didn't seem like they did judging by what people who saw them later that evening have said. At least nothing obvious. The video footage only shows McCoy & Co. beating and stomping on a guy on the ground. All of the reported injuries - which are severe - are on the two cops, not the four on the other side. There also doesn't seem to be a dispute that this started over a bottle of champagne that was served to the cops, but forcibly taken by one of McCoy's friends. That doesn't look good. That looks like four guys started things with two off duty cops, beat the crap out of them and didn't stop after one of them was unable to defend himself.
Not at the table Karlos Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 I worked security at a few clubs on chippewa a couple years ago. Off duty police were hired on sat night (sometimes other days depending on anticipated crowd) most of the time they were checking ID at the door. When they were checking IDs they would allow any half naked girl that smiled at them in didn't matter if they were 13 or 100. The police knowingly let in underage girls. They also weren't allowed to drink. So they would have one of the bouncers sit near them and act like their drinks were his. Once they get to drinking they think they are invincible because they are police and start hitting on girls that are with other guys and boom big fight. Of course the people the police started with were arrested and the off duty police would continue to "work" until close then drive home plastered. Â !@#$ the police. I don't wish harm to anyone but !@#$ them.
YoloinOhio Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 (edited) This is Shady's attorney, Jack McMahon  Edited February 10, 2016 by YoloinOhio
Not at the table Karlos Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 Â Interesting, Lends a possible different perspective to what sounded like an act of thuggery (taking the cop's champagne bottle). how much money do these officers make that they can afford a bottle of champagne at an exclusive club?
BarleyNY Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 Like I said, I'm not making any definitive assumptions about what did or didn't happen, or who the dumbest people alive are. From what we do know, there's so much we don't know. Did the off duty cops ever identify themselves as such? Why didn't they call 911 immediately? Why did they drive themselves to the hospital with such serious injuries and not file any sort of report until the next morning? Why weren't the security cameras functioning? As good ol' Donny Rumsfeld would say, we've got both known unknowns and unknown unknowns. Didn't seem like there would be much time to call 911 while a guy was swinging a champagne bottle at you or you were getting chucked out of a club. This happened at 2:45 AM and was in the news that morning so it seems like the police report was filed pretty damn quick. As for identifying themselves as police, who knows? There will be testimony to that effect, but in a noisy club could anyone hear them anyway? should it matter? The club cameras are only there to protect the club. Whether or not they were "working" probably only depends on whether or not their footage would help or hinder a lawsuit against the club. Don't kid yourself, they aren't there for the public good.
YoloinOhio Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 Didn't seem like there would be much time to call 911 while a guy was swinging a champagne bottle at you or you were getting chucked out of a club. This happened at 2:45 AM and was in the news that morning so it seems like the police report was filed pretty damn quick. As for identifying themselves as police, who knows? There will be testimony to that effect, but in a noisy club could anyone hear them anyway? should it matter? The club cameras are only there to protect the club. Whether or not they were "working" probably only depends on whether or not their footage would help or hinder a lawsuit against the club. Don't kid yourself, they aren't there for the public good. It happened at 2:45am Sunday (basically Saturday night). It actually didn't hit the news until Monday late morning, which I found a bit odd with Twitter.
Maury Ballstein Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 This is Shady's attorney, Jack McMahon  Scott Van Pelts father ?
SectionC3 Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 Â Not sure how the legal system works with regards to that but, to me, it all comes down to who started the violence. They should be charged. The other guys were just defending themselves. Granted, "defending" has it's limits. A group of guys kicking a guy on the floor goes well beyond "defending." The concept you're alluding to is called justification. Basically, if you're not the aggressor in a fight you can respond with like force to protect yourself. Assuming that the football layers here didn't start the fight, the question might become whether the response was appropriate. Based on the videos I have my doubts on that point, but a complete picture of the events is needed to make that call.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 (edited) This is Shady's attorney, Jack McMahon   He looks as if he could go in the ring with Mike Vick's former dogs and the dogs would get the worst of it how much money do these officers make that they can afford a bottle of champagne at an exclusive club?  Don't have to make much if the club practice is "stick the VIPs in the club for the cops' tab" Edited February 10, 2016 by Hopeful
Best Player Available Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 Â Â Don't have to make much if the club practice is "stick the VIPs in the club for the cops' tab" Objection your honor: Hearsay
Nanker Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 This is Shady's attorney, Jack McMahon  Better Call Saul!
jimmy10 Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 Didn't seem like there would be much time to call 911 while a guy was swinging a champagne bottle at you or you were getting chucked out of a club. But, if you're a police officer getting the sh*t kicked out of you, wouldn't you want your assailants cuffed and the back of a cruiser, like, instantly? And don't you have the power to make that happen? Â (I feel it sounds like I'm attacking cops with a broad brush here, and I'm not. I have two close friends that are cops. And I'm an Irish Catholic guy from the northeast, so obviously my family has had a cop or two in it.)
BarleyNY Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 It happened at 2:45am Sunday (basically Saturday night). It actually didn't hit the news until Monday late morning, which I found a bit odd with Twitter. Right. Okay, so the incident happened at 2:45AM Sunday and was a thread here late Monday morning. About 32 hours. In that time, the officers had to be treated, file a report about the incident with unknown people, those people had to be identified and it had to hit the news wire. Let's face it, we'd never know about this incident if McCoy - or another NFL player - hadn't been identified at some point. It doesn't seem like there was any delay. It just want newsworthy until McCoy was identified, which took less than 32 hours.
eball Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 Well, it appears Bucky stole Sully's editorial before he could get his name on it -- check out today's TBN.
Gordio Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 I worked security at a few clubs on chippewa a couple years ago. Off duty police were hired on sat night (sometimes other days depending on anticipated crowd) most of the time they were checking ID at the door. When they were checking IDs they would allow any half naked girl that smiled at them in didn't matter if they were 13 or 100. The police knowingly let in underage girls. They also weren't allowed to drink. So they would have one of the bouncers sit near them and act like their drinks were his. Once they get to drinking they think they are invincible because they are police and start hitting on girls that are with other guys and boom big fight. Of course the people the police started with were arrested and the off duty police would continue to "work" until close then drive home plastered. Â !@#$ the police. I don't wish harm to anyone but !@#$ them. Â Â I got a honest question. If the point of having off duty cops at your bar I assume was to keep the peace & prevent bar fights, why in the world would a bar owner hire these off duty cops if they basically were doing the exact opposite & instigating the fights. If I was the bar owner & as you described happened one time I would tell them your services are no longer needed here.
stony Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 Well, it appears Bucky stole Sully's editorial before he could get his name on it -- check out today's TBN. You think they flipped a coin for the honor of penning that POS?
YoloinOhio Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 (edited) Well, it appears Bucky stole Sully's editorial before he could get his name on it -- check out today's TBN.Bucky and Sully prefer the type that are "friends" with cops, and employ an off duty cop as his driver of girls picked up after late night prowling, and therefore get away with whatever they want *cough* Pat Kane *cough* Edited February 10, 2016 by YoloinOhio
BarleyNY Posted February 10, 2016 Posted February 10, 2016 But, if you're a police officer getting the sh*t kicked out of you, wouldn't you want your assailants cuffed and the back of a cruiser, like, instantly? And don't you have the power to make that happen? (I feel it sounds like I'm attacking cops with a broad brush here, and I'm not. I have two close friends that are cops. And I'm an Irish Catholic guy from the northeast, so obviously my family has had a cop or two in it.) Not if you're on the ground getting stomped. How does someone make a 911 call during something like that? You'd hope someone would make the call, but I'm not sure how you would. And it's not like the other guys aren't going to scatter immediately. There were three cops, one of whom did not seem to be around the incident. One got stomped and one was trying to pull him out of the melee. Then they all got tossed. There's no time for a call up until then and even if one was made at that point, what good would it do? The other guys are gone.
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