Nanker Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 Harvin won't be back. Aaron Williams may not be back. Leodis might not, but he will restructure according to his words. Anthony Dixon could be replaced by a rookie. Same thing with Marquise the Olympian. Clay's deal will be restructured IIRC from all the pre-snagging deal talk hub-bub about his deal. Where there's a will, there's a way people.
Dr. Fong Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 Chris Williams is the mystery of the Bills. What did they see in him? Why did they give him that contract? He's clear and away the biggest failure of Whaley's tenure as GM, bar none. The Director of Pro Personnel when Williams was signed, Tom Gibbons, got the ax after the season, and smart money might guess Williams is one reason why. We can only hope the failure in offensive pro scouting has been addressed. Brown - taking a flyer on a 4th round pick on a fast guy. Risk/reward if he worked out. Kouandjio - taking a flyer on a guy who fell from the 1st round due to medical concerns. Risk/reward. Again, flyer, and one does wonder how good the Bills medical staff is at scouting (Williams again). But Williams was a straight out head-scratcher. I agree with the overall assessment. As far as what they saw in him, I think it was that they were just that truly desperate at offensive line.
thebandit27 Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 here is up to the day Salary Cap info from the NFLPA https://www.nflpa.com/public-salary-cap-report it ain't pretty for Buffalo Why? There's $12M coming from Mario's release alone. McKelvin release or pay cut is another $3M alone. That's $15M in cap room before guys like Urbik, Lawson, and either of Graham or Aaron Williams (one won't be here most likely) are addressed. Boobie Dixon is another easy $1M in savings that has virtually no impact on the field. I know they want to keep Kyle, but he's another $5.5M to save and a guy that isn't a great fit for what they're doing defensively; they can sign a true NT for less than they save by cutting him. Plenty sif ways to create cap space without gutting the roster
KD in CA Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 Harvin won't be back. Aaron Williams may not be back. Leodis might not, but he will restructure according to his words. Anthony Dixon could be replaced by a rookie. Same thing with Marquise the Olympian. Clay's deal will be restructured IIRC from all the pre-snagging deal talk hub-bub about his deal. Where there's a will, there's a way people. Yup. You notice that deep pocketed owners rarely if ever have big cap problems.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 Why? There's $12M coming from Mario's release alone. McKelvin release or pay cut is another $3M alone. That's $15M in cap room before guys like Urbik, Lawson, and either of Graham or Aaron Williams (one won't be here most likely) are addressed. Boobie Dixon is another easy $1M in savings that has virtually no impact on the field. I know they want to keep Kyle, but he's another $5.5M to save and a guy that isn't a great fit for what they're doing defensively; they can sign a true NT for less than they save by cutting him. Plenty sif ways to create cap space without gutting the roster Bandit, all respect, but some would say releasing Mario Williams, Kyle Williams, Aaron Williams, and McKelvin would be a pretty deep cut if it's not a gut. That's like 4 of 11 starters on D. It may be a needed path, but it would be mightly hard to replace those 4 adequately AND upgrade at LB, rt side of the OL, and WR.
nucci Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 No. Any cap savings from releasing him won't be available until June 1st then and it moves dead money into the 2017 season, pretty much negating any benefit from cutting him. The only thing I would say regarding the Bills is that we have little cap room, but have 53 players signed to the roster. When we release Mario we will be $12 million under the cap with 52 guys signed. The Saints, Dolphins, Ravens, Steelers, Jets, and Lions will all be around the same free space figure with roughly 40 guys signed. I don't think we have been great at managing the cap, but we are not in situations like the Saints or Dolphins. This off-season may be the 1st time in many years we are tight against the cap, so explain the bolded part, please
YoloinOhio Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 The Bills will find a way to keep the guys they want to keep. It will mean letting go of some guys they feel they can replace at a cheaper rate. They are very creative with contracts under Pegula. They are aware of their situation and have already been pretty open about how they will deal with it (signing their own, not going after big FA names, leak of releasing Mario). Steelers and Pats always up against cap too. Not worried frankly unless we lose Glenn or Incognito because of it. Gilmore is going to be extended before the start of 2016 season IMO like Dareus was last year.
thebandit27 Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 Bandit, all respect, but some would say releasing Mario Williams, Kyle Williams, Aaron Williams, and McKelvin would be a pretty deep cut if it's not a gut. That's like 4 of 11 starters on D. It may be a needed path, but it would be mightly hard to replace those 4 adequately AND upgrade at LB, rt side of the OL, and WR. I don't think that replacing their production from 2015 is difficult at all. You sign a NT to replace Kyle (saves $$) Grab a traditional 3-4 OLB to replace Mario--guys like Pace would come cheap McKelvin most likely takes a pay cut and stays Safety was going to be addressed in the draft regardless as soon as we hired Rex (most likely anyway), so that's not really an additional expense.
Canadian Bills Fan Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 Easy fix.....Pegula give most of the contract money as a signing bonus. Problem solved CBF
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 Harvin won't be back. Aaron Williams may not be back. Leodis might not, but he will restructure according to his words. Anthony Dixon could be replaced by a rookie. Same thing with Marquise the Olympian. Clay's deal will be restructured IIRC from all the pre-snagging deal talk hub-bub about his deal. Where there's a will, there's a way people. Restructuring Clay would help a lot. He's got 20% of the O cap money just by himself - $1.5M in salary and a $10M signing bonus, all guaranteed. But what player would give up $10M of guaranteed $$ in his pocket in favor of deferred gratification? McKelvin will help. Aaron Williams doesn't help us cap wise. Dixon is $1M with $.17 dead money, buh-bye! Marquise Goodwin and on down are chump change, though frankly if he's gonna do this Olympic thing I'd like us to free him to follow his dreams, so to speak. HIs football career has staked him to enough money to put up his girlfriend and himself at hotels with decent weight rooms for the rest of their track careers. Basically I don't see how we do it without cutting Mario. What I see as a bit of a scapegoat campaign does bother me, but if you aren't going to drive a Ferrari correctly why keep it?
ALF Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 No. Any cap savings from releasing him won't be available until June 1st then and it moves dead money into the 2017 season, pretty much negating any benefit from cutting him. cut pre June 1 ( Mario) dead money $7M cap saving $12.9M cut post June 1 dead money $5.4 M cap saving $14.5M http://overthecap.co.../buffalo-bills/ not sure what date you believe is better to release Mario, thanks , never paid much attention to cap before
thebandit27 Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 Restructuring Clay would help a lot. He's got 20% of the O cap money just by himself - $1.5M in salary and a $10M signing bonus, all guaranteed. But what player would give up $10M of guaranteed $$ in his pocket in favor of deferred gratification? McKelvin will help. Aaron Williams doesn't help us cap wise. Dixon is $1M with $.17 dead money, buh-bye! Marquise Goodwin and on down are chump change, though frankly if he's gonna do this Olympic thing I'd like us to free him to follow his dreams, so to speak. HIs football career has staked him to enough money to put up his girlfriend and himself at hotels with decent weight rooms for the rest of their track careers. Basically I don't see how we do it without cutting Mario. What I see as a bit of a scapegoat campaign does bother me, but if you aren't going to drive a Ferrari correctly why keep it? That's actually the advantage to restructuring; Clay gets his guaranteed base salary converted to a signing bonus--which he gets right now. That said, I'd prefer they didn't touch Clay's deal. If they can survive his and Dareus' cap hits this year, they'll have a LOT of space moving forward.
BrooklynBills Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 cut pre June 1 ( Mario) dead money $7M cap saving $12.9M cut post June 1 dead money $5.4 M cap saving $14.5M http://overthecap.co.../buffalo-bills/ not sure what date you believe is better to release Mario, thanks , never paid much attention to cap befo If we hang on to Mario until June 1, the 14.5 million that we save is not available until then, which is after the free agent period when we will need to re-sign Glenn and Incognito or sign a few low priced free agents to replace them as their replacements are not on the roster. If cut Mario now and designate him a post June 1 cut, again, the 14.5 million does not become available until June 2, when there will be little left to sign and our own guys will have signed elsewhere. This designation was designed to help players who were going to be cap casualties in camp sign on with team during FA to increase the chance they could sign somewhere. If we cut Mario now, specifically before March(I think) when he is due a roster bonus, we save the 12.9 million right away and can use it to improve the team or re-sign our own guys.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 I don't think that replacing their production from 2015 is difficult at all. Well, erm, no, you're right with regard to their 2015 production. The question is can the D overall be successful with that level of production? More production is needed from somewhere. That's actually the advantage to restructuring; Clay gets his guaranteed base salary converted to a signing bonus--which he gets right now. That said, I'd prefer they didn't touch Clay's deal. If they can survive his and Dareus' cap hits this year, they'll have a LOT of space moving forward. Hey, Bandit, I wrote in error - Clay's cap hit this year is $1.5M salary and $10M roster bonus, not signing bonus. The difference is the roster bonus is one lump and can't be pro-rated across the contract as a signing bonus can. So restructuring to give him the same $$ as a signing, not roster, bonus and spreading it out could in theory give the Bills maybe $6.6M in cap space this year at the expense of $3.3 less in 2017 and 2018. It should have no impact on Clay, he gets the roster bonus and the signing bonus up-front in Feb.
Kirby Jackson Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 There is no analysis, context, facts, it basically any type of reason applied here Just a single statement of opinion from one person with no quantifiable data attached I'm yet to here a good argument for a supposed cap issue for this team I actually think that they have done a pretty good job manipulating the cap. Things like the Clay deal structured in a way that Miami couldn't match but easy to restructure are cap wins IMO.
thebandit27 Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 Well, erm, no, you're right with regard to their 2015 production. The question is can the D overall be successful with that level of production? More production is needed from somewhere. I think they can get better provided that they spend the money they save wisely. They need to get an edge defender like Pace or Upshaw to replace Mario. I would prefer Upshaw, but Pace makes more sense since he'll be less costly and knows Rex's system. The ILB position needs to be addressed. I'm hoping for a guy like Vincent Rey or Rolando McClain. Either can be had for David Hawthorne-type money IMO, and would make a huge difference filling run gaps and covering the short zones the way that Bradham and Brown haven't been able to do. I do like Ty Powell as a backup option if he can get healthy. NTs generally come cheap, and any of Damon Harrison, Terrence Knighton, or Brandon Mebane can do the job. Add a safety in round 2 (either AJ Stamps or Justin Simmons preferably), and you've got the makings for a much better defense. Hey, Bandit, I wrote in error - Clay's cap hit this year is $1.5M salary and $10M roster bonus, not signing bonus. The difference is the roster bonus is one lump and can't be pro-rated across the contract as a signing bonus can. So restructuring to give him the same $$ as a signing, not roster, bonus and spreading it out could in theory give the Bills maybe $6.6M in cap space this year at the expense of $3.3 less in 2017 and 2018. It should have no impact on Clay, he gets the roster bonus and the signing bonus up-front in Feb. No sweat--I knew what you were getting at anyway. Like I said, if they can "survive" Clay's cap hit this year, they'll be in a much better spot with his contract down the road. Restructuring it will bump his cap figure from $6.5M per year in the final 3 years to $9M per year. Of course, there's always the chance that they only convert--say--$6M of his roster bonus to a signing bonus, which would save $4.5M this year, but bump his final 3 years cap figure up to $8M.
BrooklynBills Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 This off-season may be the 1st time in many years we are tight against the cap, so explain the bolded part, please We are this close to the cap ceiling while pay our QBs a combined ~6-7 million. We are still paying Chris Williams almost 2 million against the cap next season. We are paying Charles Clay the 4th highest paid TE. Aaron Williams is paid $500,000 less than Kam Chancellor. We have 2 of the top 4 and 3 of the top 17 highest paid contracts for DL at a combined $41.8/yr(and that's if you count Hughes as a OLB). No one else is even close to this. And not one of these contracts is going to expire before we need to cut one of them at minimum. We are paying a FB a 2.3/yr contract.
Big Turk Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 Does he realize the Jets have less cap space than the Bills next year currently?
Deranged Rhino Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 Yup. You notice that deep pocketed owners rarely if ever have big cap problems. 100%, give the Bills fans who are conditioned by Ralph's penny pinching a few seasons to get used to this idea and they'll come around. The modern NFL cap is about keeping flexibility, which the Bills have plenty of despite the fear mongering / pining for Greenbay Executives going on in this thread. The cap is going up 10 million, they're freeing up 13 with Mario, another 4 with Leodis, probably another 5-6 by restructuring Clay's wonky cap number... that's close to 30 million right there. People need to take a deep breath and realize every competitive team in the NFL is going to be right up against the cap each and every year. They still find ways to get done what they want to get done, the Bills will be no different. I actually think that they have done a pretty good job manipulating the cap. Things like the Clay deal structured in a way that Miami couldn't match but easy to restructure are cap wins IMO. Agreed.
ALF Posted January 7, 2016 Posted January 7, 2016 If we hang on to Mario until June 1, the 14.5 million that we save is not available until then, which is after the free agent period when we will need to re-sign Glenn and Incognito or sign a few low priced free agents to replace them as their replacements are not on the roster. If cut Mario now and designate him a post June 1 cut, again, the 14.5 million does not become available until June 2, when there will be little left to sign and our own guys will have signed elsewhere. This designation was designed to help players who were going to be cap casualties in camp sign on with team during FA to increase the chance they could sign somewhere. If we cut Mario now, specifically before March(I think) when he is due a roster bonus, we save the 12.9 million right away and can use it to improve the team or re-sign our own guys. Thanks Brooklyn , now I understand the June 1
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