hondo in seattle Posted January 5, 2016 Posted January 5, 2016 I had dinner with DePodesta once. He was very cool - and a very smart dude. If Haslam truly lets him run the show, he'll get things on track. Lots of cool, smart guys fail. This is an interesting experiment.
LeGOATski Posted January 5, 2016 Posted January 5, 2016 You have no idea what you are talking about. I know analytics only works as a tool. Not as the entire vehicle.
Chuck Wagon Posted January 5, 2016 Posted January 5, 2016 I hesitate to say it can't work, it's clearly worked to some degree in baseball (though Moneyball does conveniently omit a MVP shortstop and 3 CY Young winning pitchers) and it's in the process of completely changing how the NBA is played. That being said, as others have mentioned football is just so subjective. You can take measurables such as size, 40 times and lifting scores and try to apply them to find players, but that's nothing new to football and usually fails more often than it works. College teams do completely different things so comparing someone from Georgia Tech's offense to someone from Texas Tech's is about as apples to oranges as it gets. Good for the Browns if they discover some magic formula to find better players who are bigger / stronger / faster than other teams uncover, but right now it feels like trying to reinvent the wheel and grasping at straws.
May Day 10 Posted January 5, 2016 Posted January 5, 2016 Football's sample size doesn't lend well to analytics IMO.
YoloinOhio Posted January 5, 2016 Author Posted January 5, 2016 (edited) Lots of cool, smart guys fail. This is an interesting experiment. Exactly. And, I feel for Browns fans. Because they, like us, don't really have the patience for experiments. But, at least the Browns are doing something differently than they have been because THAT definitely did not work. daniel kaplan @dkaplanSBJ Browns EVP football ops Sashi Brown used 2 b w/ Jags, where Tony Khan's analytics company, TruMedia, counted Mets and DePodesta as client. Edited January 5, 2016 by YoloinOhio
TheFunPolice Posted January 5, 2016 Posted January 5, 2016 It works in baseball because baseball is just a bunch of numbers and stats. It's barely a sport. It's more of a game than a sport IMO (like bowling). Can you hit a ball? Can you throw a ball very fast? That's about it. You'll most likely be good at baseball. There is very little strategy or teamwork to speak of. You stand there with your sunglasses on in the outfield watching foul ball after foul ball go backwards into the stands. Once every 20 minutes you actually have to move to catch or pick up and throw the ball in the event it actually gets hit into the field of play. I'm falling asleep just describing it. Football is so much more complicated. How many guys had every measurable yet failed in the NFL? According to analytics Big Mike Williams should have been a 15 year starter at tackle for us. You can't measure desire. Or the effect of team chemistry. Or the effect of coaching. Or choice of scheme (see Williams, Mario). Or ability to grasp the complex principles of NFL defense/offense. It will be interesting to see how it works out though.
YoloinOhio Posted January 5, 2016 Author Posted January 5, 2016 Albert Breer @AlbertBreer 21s21 seconds ago The heavy emphasis on analytics makes me wonder if Patriots DC/rocket scientist Matt Patricia might have an edge in the Browns coach search.
26CornerBlitz Posted January 5, 2016 Posted January 5, 2016 Browns fans, here's everything you need to know about Paul DePodesta Paul DePodesta is leaving the Mets front office for an upper management position with the NFL's Cleveland Browns. Here's everything you need to know about him.
LeGOATski Posted January 5, 2016 Posted January 5, 2016 Albert Breer @AlbertBreer 21s21 seconds ago The heavy emphasis on analytics makes me wonder if Patriots DC/rocket scientist Matt Patricia might have an edge in the Browns coach search. Well, I think that would ruin my 2016 bold prediction of the Bills trading for Barkevious Mingo.
Chuck Wagon Posted January 5, 2016 Posted January 5, 2016 Albert Breer @AlbertBreer 21s21 seconds ago The heavy emphasis on analytics makes me wonder if Patriots DC/rocket scientist Matt Patricia might have an edge in the Browns coach search. I think he makes the most sense out of any of the candidates they are on tap to interview. Whoever takes that job is taking a giant leap of faith, I wouldn't think Patricia is feeling any sort of desperation for a head job.
JoeF Posted January 5, 2016 Posted January 5, 2016 The Browns Players with ugly girlfriends/wives just breathed a sigh a relief....
YoloinOhio Posted January 5, 2016 Author Posted January 5, 2016 I think he makes the most sense out of any of the candidates they are on tap to interview. Whoever takes that job is taking a giant leap of faith, I wouldn't think Patricia is feeling any sort of desperation for a head job. Looks like he is straight out of the Muni Lot...
dave mcbride Posted January 5, 2016 Posted January 5, 2016 It works in baseball because baseball is just a bunch of numbers and stats. It's barely a sport. It's more of a game than a sport IMO (like bowling). Can you hit a ball? Can you throw a ball very fast? That's about it. You'll most likely be good at baseball. There is very little strategy or teamwork to speak of. You stand there with your sunglasses on in the outfield watching foul ball after foul ball go backwards into the stands. Once every 20 minutes you actually have to move to catch or pick up and throw the ball in the event it actually gets hit into the field of play. I'm falling asleep just describing it. Football is so much more complicated. How many guys had every measurable yet failed in the NFL? According to analytics Big Mike Williams should have been a 15 year starter at tackle for us. You can't measure desire. Or the effect of team chemistry. Or the effect of coaching. Or choice of scheme (see Williams, Mario). Or ability to grasp the complex principles of NFL defense/offense. It will be interesting to see how it works out though. You don't watch much baseball.
TheFunPolice Posted January 5, 2016 Posted January 5, 2016 Red Bull AND Mt. Dew! What's the third can? Why don't these guys just get some sleep? You don't watch much baseball. That's not true! When I need a nap I put it on. Works like a charm!
YoloinOhio Posted January 5, 2016 Author Posted January 5, 2016 ya think Daryl Ruiter @RuiterWrongFAN 12m12 minutes ago Joe Banner said on NFL Live Doug Marrone, Adam Gase & other coaches tied to the #Browns search don't fit w/ advanced analytics structure
hondo in seattle Posted January 5, 2016 Posted January 5, 2016 (edited) It works in baseball because baseball is just a bunch of numbers and stats. It's barely a sport. It's more of a game than a sport IMO (like bowling). Can you hit a ball? Can you throw a ball very fast? That's about it. You'll most likely be good at baseball. There is very little strategy or teamwork to speak of. You stand there with your sunglasses on in the outfield watching foul ball after foul ball go backwards into the stands. Once every 20 minutes you actually have to move to catch or pick up and throw the ball in the event it actually gets hit into the field of play. I'm falling asleep just describing it. Football is so much more complicated. How many guys had every measurable yet failed in the NFL? According to analytics Big Mike Williams should have been a 15 year starter at tackle for us. You can't measure desire. Or the effect of team chemistry. Or the effect of coaching. Or choice of scheme (see Williams, Mario). Or ability to grasp the complex principles of NFL defense/offense. It will be interesting to see how it works out though. This is a little harsh on baseball but dead-on when it comes to football. It's hard to quantify individual performance when football is such a team sport. Especially when you're a lineman, the play of the guy next to you effects your decision-making and performance. And good coaches make average players look good while bad coaches often make good players look bad. There are probably things football can learn from Moneyball but it can never import the whole package. But that's probably not DePodesta's intent. Curiously, his title is "Chief Strategy Officer." I guess that implies others will be making the more tactical decisions. Edited January 5, 2016 by hondo in seattle
YoloinOhio Posted January 5, 2016 Author Posted January 5, 2016 This is a little harsh on baseball but dead-on when it comes to football. It's hard to quantify individual performance when football is such a team sport. Especially when you're a lineman, the play of the guy next to you effects your decision-making and performance. And good coaches make average players look good while bad coaches often make good players look bad. There are probably things football can learn from Moneyball but it can never import the whole package. But that's probably not DePodesta's intent. Curiously, his title is "Chief Strategy Officer." I guess that implies others will be making the more tactical decisions. he is more than just an analytics guy - I think he's well respected in building culture and team. But until the full picture of the GM and HC come into play it's kind of hard to see the forest for the trees. Right now, they cleaned house and so far have a lawyer and a baseball guy running a football team.
Heitz Posted January 5, 2016 Posted January 5, 2016 I'm falling asleep just describing it. lol - so true, baseball is so...zzzzzzzzz...zzzzzzzzz...zzzzzzzz Browns fans, here's everything you need to know about Paul DePodesta Soooo, the Browns will have the best Bullpen in the NFL?
White Linen Posted January 5, 2016 Posted January 5, 2016 Who knows whether it will or not. Can't hurt to try at this point. You don't think it could hurt if this doesn't work? Or do you really mean - because we're a perennial mess why not try this?
May Day 10 Posted January 5, 2016 Posted January 5, 2016 This is a little harsh on baseball but dead-on when it comes to football. It's hard to quantify individual performance when football is such a team sport. Especially when you're a lineman, the play of the guy next to you effects your decision-making and performance. And good coaches make average players look good while bad coaches often make good players look bad. There are probably things football can learn from Moneyball but it can never import the whole package. But that's probably not DePodesta's intent. Curiously, his title is "Chief Strategy Officer." I guess that implies others will be making the more tactical decisions. Especially with things like "garbage time", playing hobbled, bad matchup, etc. Its a short 16 game season full of outliers and variables. Baseball works because the sample size is huge and the variables are limited.
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