machine gun kelly Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 Fred wasn't himself last season anyway after he ripped his groin. His durability is shot despite being one tough SOB. He wasn't worth keeping around as a 3rd string RB who didn't play ST. I wish him the best this postseason. Your critical point was ST. If Fred could have played ST, I would have preferred him over Dixon just for the leadership role on the team. But, it was a smart move in the end, and both Karlos, and Gilleslie are excellent depth behind McCoy. I never want to see dixon outside of ST, but your 4th RB like your 6th WR are ST guys.
Gray Beard Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 I like the way Karlos runs, but I'm a little concerned about him. He may have a short career because of recurring concussions. Fred is a great blocker and outlet receiver. I don't know if Karlos fills that role. McCoy may be better in those situations. I'm not bitter about releasing Fred, I think it was a logical business decision based on his salary and limited role primarily as a third down back. I wish he could still be on the Bills, and I'm glad he was picked up by another team. I hope he get to make some plays in the playoffs.
JM57 Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 It was a stupid move. Glad Fred gets to go to the playoffs, but I have yet to hear a coherent argument explaining why he wasn't worth a roster spot. Not reading the rest of the thread before this reply. Here we go, it's very simple. Karlos Williams beat him out for the the #2 role behind McCoy. Just about every NFL team expects to get Special Teams value out of their #3 RB, whether that be as a returner or a gunner. Fred Jackson did not play special teams. Boobie Dixon, while not as good at RB, does play special teams, and does so at a decent level. Therefore, he had more value to the team. Fred may not have even dressed if they kept him, again going back to not playing special teams.
Dr. K Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 I was never bitter about the Bills releasing Fred. I loved him as a player for the team but it was time to move on. The thing that annoyed me was the Pegulas forcing Whaley to keep Fred after Whaley had cut him last spring.
CSBill Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 After i heard of the release i was upset, but it seems they made the correct choice. Carlos has had a nice season despite injury. Maybe they could have kept Fred as #3, but he wouldnt go for it. We could have used him no doubt, but i like the youth and Gillesea looks like a keeper. Yes, he should not have been let go the way he was. It will be great day when he is placed on the ring of honor at the Ralph. Nonetheless, glad that Freddie will get to do something he never would have here: play a play-off game, maybe even a super bowl. And I am excited about the prospects of the Bills backfield next year.
starrymessenger Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 I agree Boobie over Fred made no sense. Herron over Fred maked no sense either. But turning the page our stable of backs looks great for 2016. I really hope Karlos is able to avoid concussion related problems that could threaten his career. IMO he is a gem with a higher ceiling than given credit for. I first thought of him as a good change of pace north south one cut and go kinda guy. I think he is more than that. He has really good vision and can cut sharply more than once a carry. Plus of course he is a load and fast enuf to turn the corner as well as run inside. I love seeing DBs and LBs shy away from that big train comin!
HamSandwhich Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 I like Gilislee a ton. I was pissed about Fred but we're deeper than ever Is it just me or does he remind you of a young Fredex? I think his running style is very similar.
Rob's House Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 It's interesting to me how the Whaley faithful glaze over the leadership aspect as if it has no more value on Sunday than it does in Madden. On a team like the Patriots his leadership value would be minimal. But on a team like the Bills who have a dearth of leadership, especially on the offensive side of the ball, it could be extremely valuable.
34-78-83 Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 Not reading the rest of the thread before this reply. Here we go, it's very simple. Karlos Williams beat him out for the the #2 role behind McCoy. Just about every NFL team expects to get Special Teams value out of their #3 RB, whether that be as a returner or a gunner. Fred Jackson did not play special teams. Boobie Dixon, while not as good at RB, does play special teams, and does so at a decent level. Therefore, he had more value to the team. Fred may not have even dressed if they kept him, again going back to not playing special teams. Winner winner chicken dinner. There is some good and interesting discussion in this thread but this is what happened note for note.
xsoldier54 Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 Never was bitter. I completely understood at the time that they were going with younger guys. Didn't need to see Karlos to understand why they did it.
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 Fred became a legend here because he was the only thing of any consistency over close to the past ten years. But the main reason for his consistency was the rest of the team was so bad so long. If guys like A Smith, and Lynch had stuck around, and Spiller had played like the level he was drafted at; it's highly likely there never would have been much of a Fred Jackson career in Buffalo. Fred kind of became the martyr of the cause, the cause being the lousy years.
starrymessenger Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 Fred was'nt good just because he played for a lousy team. Fred would have stood out on lots of teams, especially better one's I would think where Ds wouldn't have keyed on him as much. In the year he broke his leg, he was pretty much top three or so of all purpose backs in the league. Heck of a player. Did everything well. Wishing him well in theplayoffs.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 (edited) After i heard of the release i was upset, but it seems they made the correct choice. Carlos has had a nice season despite injury. Maybe they could have kept Fred as #3, but he wouldnt go for it. We could have used him no doubt, but i like the youth and Gillesea looks like a keeper. At the time of the cut, it made sense, because of Karlos, Shady, Roman wanting to keep a FB Felton noted for his blocking and pass protection skills, and Roman wanting to keep what was it, 4 TE we started the season with (Clay, Gray, Mulligan, Gragg) and Dixon for ST. In hindsight, the release of FredEx was a mistake when we cut Bryce Brown after the 1st game, Karlos and Shady both went down, and we were scraping guys off the street. (The timing of the Bryce Brown release still puzzles me mightily - if he wasn't taking coaching and making the changes you want to see, why not cut him much sooner?). Mulligan and Felton did not work out as well for blockers as they hoped, and none of the vets filled Fred's leadership role. It has worked out very well for FredEx though so I'm happy for him, and the problem is GMs have to make decisions as they see them at the time, not in hindsight. There were several issues this season (penalties, lack of mental concentration, etc) that didn't crop up last year. With this year's talent, I have to think that a veteran leader would have been worth 1-2 additional wins. The thing is, the plan (at the time of the cut) called for McCoy, Karlos, Felton, and Dixon (for ST) to be game-day actives. If kept instead of Brown, FredEx would have had to be a healthy scratch, which would be hard for him, and also limit his leadership role. There's kind of an unwritten limit to the leadership a player in street clothes can provide - he can be a good cheerleader and spirit lifter but he can't exhort or call guys out. Edited January 1, 2016 by Hopeful
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 It was a stupid move. Glad Fred gets to go to the playoffs, but I have yet to hear a coherent argument explaining why he wasn't worth a roster spot. You've heard several coherent arguments explaining this, actually. You're just apparently unable or unwilling to process them.
The Frankish Reich Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 A bit off topic, but ... wouldn't Karlos be a total beast as a safety? I read some of the FSU media when we drafted him, and it seems that he just couldn't get the concept of coverage packages and where he was supposed to be. Physically, I see a Kam Chancellor v. 2.0. As a RB? I'm still worried (as are the Bills it seems) that he won't ever be up to a full workload given his running style and size. I'm not saying we should switch him back to safety; I'm just saying that I think he might have had a shot at a better NFL career if he had stayed there.
billsfan_34 Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 It was time for a change so I wasnt upset at all and pleasantly surprised how well Karlos played- I am concerned with his durability.
hmsmystic Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 Good teams release older players before their skills decline below their value. Fred was awesome, but being bitter about his release is silly
Rob's House Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 You've heard several coherent arguments explaining this, actually. You're just apparently unable or unwilling to process them. I haven't. The best I've heard is this garbage about special teams. Dropping your 3rd down RB and locker room leader, on a team that desperately needs both, so you can save that roster spot for a special teamer is patently absurd. Especially considering his combination of blocking and receiving ability when you've got a pourous O-line and inexperienced QBs. I hear no coherent arguments. I hear Whaley fanboy excuses.
26CornerBlitz Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 (edited) I haven't. The best I've heard is this garbage about special teams. Dropping your 3rd down RB and locker room leader, on a team that desperately needs both, so you can save that roster spot for a special teamer is patently absurd. Especially considering his combination of blocking and receiving ability when you've got a pourous O-line and inexperienced QBs. I hear no coherent arguments. I hear Whaley fanboy excuses. The same porous OL has the team as the NFL's rushing leader. The same porous OL that has allowed for the deep passing game to succeed. Try again! Edited January 2, 2016 by 26CornerBlitz
Rob's House Posted January 1, 2016 Posted January 1, 2016 The same porous OL has has the team as the NFL's rushing leader. The same porous OL that has allowed for the deep passing game to succeed. Try again! How does competent run blocking equate to good pass blocking? And how many 300 yd passers did we have this year? Try again!
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