Pegulas announce Rex and Whaley will return in 2016

[Freddie's Dead]

 

...and it won't because of keeping Rex. It will because of the front-office won't be able to improve the roster because they will be handcuffed because of the cap....any way they try to attack free agency and re-signing their own, the cap is going to haunt them and they will end up realizing the trade offs they will have to make...to fill one hole they will have to create another....

Interesting angle. The last coach we had when we tried to retool the D with salary cap issues....Greggggg. I see a similar fate. Santayana goodbye.

[apuszczalowski]

 

You in particular as well as others always talk about the tanking of the Sabres ("planned", no less). Can you link to any specific declaration by Pegula or anyone else that they were losing games for years to improve the future roster?

their GM came pretty close to just coming out and saying they were losing on purpose for McDavid

[PromoTheRobot]

You in particular as well as others always talk about the tanking of the Sabres ("planned", no less). Can you link to any specific declaration by Pegula or anyone else that they were losing games for years to improve the future roster?

God, WEO are you really that obtuse??

 

No team officially declares they are tanking. Even you know that simply isn't allowed. But you have to be a special kind of dense to not know when a team liquidates their roster at the trade deadline for draft picks they are rebuilding. Especially when two franchise grade players are coming available.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

 

I'm willing to see if they can make the necessary adjustments to the scheme and personnel to see if they can make things work because historically Ryan's defenses have been very good. We'll see.

 

See, here is where I question "history". They've been good on yards, but on points (which win football games) they've been lower-tier 1 of 3 years in Baltimore and for the last 4 of 6 years in NY (19-24th). I use words precisely - I don't say I refute "history", but top defenses are good on both so it begs looking into as to why they were good on yds and poor on points. There might be a legitimate reason - if the offense was a turnover machine or ST sucked and they were routinely handed a short field to defend, for example - that would also make them look better than they were on yards, right, if opponents only had to make 30 or 40 yard drives? Or, they might allow the opponent only effective drives or 3-and-outs, nothing in the middle (gambling kind of D). Need to look under the hood

 

Everyone keeps saying Rex is a defensive genius, historically has great D - but as HC, that never turned into wins. Sometimes that kind of reputation just perpetuates itself and doesn't get scrutinized.

[simpleman]

So no acknowledgement that the Sabres are considered one of the most talented young teams in the NHL?

 

No acknowledgement that Pegula's only season of ownership in the NFL resulted in a winning record?

 

Let's gloss over all of it so that you can be snarky.

Let's look at the facts. Not that some people "consider the Sabres one of the most talented young teams in the NHL", strictly opinion not backed up by the only fact that counts, your record.

 

Pegula took over a Sabres team in mid season with a 43-29 record that went to the Quarter Finals that year.

 

10-11 43 -29

 

Pre Pegula 5 years

 

05-06 52-21 Conference Finals

06-07 53-22 Conference Finals

07-08 39-31

08-09 41-32

09-10 45-27 1st in NE Quarter Finals

 

 

Since he has had the team for a full year, the record: 5 years

 

11-12 39-32

12-13 21-21

13-14 21-51

14-15 23-51

15-16 At present, 3rd worst team in the league

 

Took control of Bills late in the season last year. Team finished the year top 5 defense and had first winning season in years. Players and coaches were already in place when he took control of team.

 

First full year control of Bills. Defense falls drastically with almost same players. (Short of the decision to release Spikes)

Team fails to have a winning record.

 

Facts count, not hopes,opinions and excuses.

 

That Gentle People is the record.

Edited January 1, 2016 by simpleman

[Mr. WEO]

God, WEO are you really that obtuse??

 

No team officially declares they are tanking. Even you know that simply isn't allowed. But you have to be a special kind of dense to not know when a team liquidates their roster at the trade deadline for draft picks they are rebuilding. Especially when two franchise grade players are coming available.

 

 

Isn't allowed...by whom?

 

It's not allowed, yet the whole world saw they were tanking? Does that include intentionally losing games (that's what tanking is after all)?

[thebandit27]

Let's look at the facts. Not that some people "consider the Sabres one of the most talented young teams in the NHL", strictly opinion not backed up by the only fact that counts, your record.

 

Pegula took over a Sabres team in mid season with a 43-29 record that went to the Quarter Finals that year.

 

10-11 43 -29

 

Pre Pegula 5 years

 

05-06 52-21 Conference Finals

06-07 53-22 Conference Finals

07-08 39-31

08-09 41-32

09-10 45-27 1st in NE Quarter Finals

 

 

Since he has had the team for a full year, the record: 5 years

 

11-12 39-32

12-13 21-21

13-14 21-51

14-15 23-51

15-16 At present, 3rd worst team in the league

 

Took control of Bills late in the season last year. Team finished the year top 5 defense and had first winning season in years. Players and coaches were already in place when he took control of team.

 

First full year control of Bills. Defense falls drastically with almost same players. (Short of the decision to release Spikes)

Team fails to have a winning record.

 

Facts count, not hopes,opinions and excuses.

 

That Gentle People is the record.

So look at numbers and ignore context?

 

Gotcha.

[FireChan]

 

Ohhh I don't know, maybe selling a home game to another city for profit for 5 years?

 

I already know what the short-sighted reply is to that. "One game wasn't going to make a difference for those teams." Yeah, right.

 

I changed my mind, the Stockholm Syndrome for a level 5 Scientologist has nothing on a member of the Church of Brandon. He's the Teflon President. Seven years as CEO/President and he can't be held accountable for anything that happens to the team? Maybe he is a genius.

 

Ahh well, Happy New Year.

I would actually give you that one, but the Toronto series was instrumental to the BB's remaining in the green. Edited January 1, 2016 by FireChan

[Hapless Bills Fan]

 

Why does this always come up?

 

A guy working the phones does not mean he is involved in the decision of who to draft. It means he is literally working the phones. Does a secretary get involved with the work his/her boss is doing? Hell, Whaley himself has said, multiple times, that he worked the phones for the Steelers.

 

It comes up because I personally find it hard to watch that film clip and believe that Russ wasn't integrally involved in the Sammy Watkins trade up decision.

 

I don't understand why "working the phones" comes up because in fact, Brandon is not working the phones in that video.

[CodeMonkey]

God, WEO are you really that obtuse??

 

No team officially declares they are tanking. Even you know that simply isn't allowed. But you have to be a special kind of dense to not know when a team liquidates their roster at the trade deadline for draft picks they are rebuilding. Especially when two franchise grade players are coming available.

I have never believed the Sabres started off the season tanking on purpose. But instead were smart enough at some point in the season to realize how horrifically bad they were already, and held the fire sale. Maybe you tank for one season in professional sports, maybe. But not for as long as the Sabres have been bad. To do so for that long, on purpose, would be a criminal fleecing of everyone who purchased tickets to games. Particularly season ticket holders. But regardless, hopefully enough of the draft picks of recent years become quality players and the Sabres can become relevant again within a couple more years.

Edited January 1, 2016 by CodeMonkey

[TPS]

 

Danny Crossman and Dennis Thurman are not good at their jobs and holdovers from his Jets staff like Sanjay Lal and David Lee should not been brought over imo, Rex is way too loyal to guys who haven't contributed to a winning team in recent years for him.

Last year Crossman had them in the top 5. The wide receivers have nothing but good things to say about Lal--Sammy specifically stating he's learning how to really run routes now. I have no clue why you'd put Lee in the group? Thurman and Rex are the DC, so if you blame Thurman, then you also blame Rex.

Edited January 1, 2016 by TPS

[Chilly]

Last year Crossman had them in the top 5. The wide receivers have nothing but good things to say about Lal--Sammy specifically stating he's learning how to really run routes now. I have no clue why you'd put Lee in the group? Thurman and Rex are the DC, so if you blame Thurman, then you also blame Rex.

Usually a head coach who is involved in one side of the team is responsible for the playcalling and scheme while the coordinator is responsible for teaching it. Given all the confusion this year on defense I think it's fair to place blame on the coordinator for the poor job on teaching the defense.

 

Crossman has a history of generally terrible special teams with last year being an anomaly.

 

Agreed in Lal and Lee, they're doing a great job.

Edited January 1, 2016 by BlueFire

[Little Dog]

his coaching was downright horrible this year and he deserves nothing. He isnt some unknown first time head coach that is starting over a rebuild of a team. He is an estate listed coach who took over a team that only need some tweaking to improve and decided to fix something that wasn't broke just because it wasn't his. Don't think anyone outside of maybe a few media personalities close to Rex that would look at this move and say its a bad one after what happened to the team this year. This isn't Cleveland dumping a first time HC just because they liked someone else better and he didn't turn around a dumpster fire franchise in one year.

Name a coach who would come here thinking he has 1 yr to fix this team

[PromoTheRobot]

 

 

Isn't allowed...by whom?

 

It's not allowed, yet the whole world saw they were tanking? Does that include intentionally losing games (that's what tanking is after all)?

Saying out loud your team is trying to lose games. THAT is not allowed! If you recall just a few posts back you asked if the Sabres made such a declaration.

 

Obtuse as ever.

[John from Riverside]

 

Ohhh I don't know, maybe selling a home game to another city for profit for 5 years?

 

I already know what the short-sighted reply is to that. "One game wasn't going to make a difference for those teams." Yeah, right.

 

I changed my mind, the Stockholm Syndrome for a level 5 Scientologist has nothing on a member of the Church of Brandon. He's the Teflon President. Seven years as CEO/President and he can't be held accountable for anything that happens to the team? Maybe he is a genius.

 

Ahh well, Happy New Year.

hyperbole much?

[BillsVet]

I have never believed the Sabres started off the season tanking on purpose. But instead were smart enough at some point in the season to realize how horrifically bad they were already, and held the fire sale. Maybe you tank for one season in professional sports, maybe. But not for as long as the Sabres have been bad. To do so for that long, on purpose, would be a criminal fleecing of everyone who purchased tickets to games. Particularly season ticket holders. But regardless, hopefully enough of the draft picks of recent years become quality players and the Sabres can become relevant again within a couple more years.

 

What is striking about the Bills and Sabres is how many similarities exist between the two in how they're rebuilding. Both teams tried to spend their way to success initially with GMs the Pegulas inherited and then retained. Neither attempt worked and the Sabres eventually had to fire the GM and HC.

 

After the game this Sunday one has to hope Whaley and Rex build and agree on a strategy where both get on the same page. Because they clearly weren't in 2015 and both were equally at fault for their lackluster result.

[Nihilarian]

You mean aside from the entirety of information from the organization regarding the draft process?

 

I've seen a total of one person that's occasioned to have a scoop say anything like that about Russ.

 

I've also seen several others that have had good info in the past say the opposite...that even when Russ was GM in title, he wasn't making personnel decisions.

 

You want proof of who's running football operations? Go read the account of how the Watkins trade went down:

 

http://bills.buffalonews.com/2014/05/09/inside-draft-room-buffalo-made-trade-land-sammy-watkins

 

Who's running this army?

 

Like I said: criticize away, but do it on some actual grounds (for example, the Toronto series)

 

Also, use your intuition: would Rex come to a situation where a financial guy is making personnel decisions after what he went through with Idzik?

 

You need only point to Seattle and Peter McLaughlin's role on draft day to see that what Russ is doing is not in any way uncommon.

 

He's simply the target because fans need to place 16 years of blame on one guy for reasons I'll never understand.

 

Personally, I've heard that the same janitor has been cleaning the war room for the last 16 years; I think he's the real issue. I mean, he's a holdover from the previous regime. It makes sense

The proof that you have that Russ Brandon isn't involved in the acquisition of player personnel is because of the way the Sammy Watkins trade went down? So nothing of what you say that are "facts" are actually facts because you have no more inside actual proof that Russ Brandon isn't involved then I have that he is.

 

Now, I would think that any trade involving three draft picks from Buffalo and two of those to be first round picks for one player would need to be authorized from someone at the top. Since the owner stepped down from the team president's job and handed it to Brandon I would think that Whaley would have needed the OK or consent by the team president (Brandon) to allow a trade of that magnitude to happen. Whaley would have had to present it to him and Brandon would have had to have given his acceptance.

 

So, he is involved. Just not to the extent that he makes all the draft choices or makes all the free agent choices. I don't think any Bills fan thinks that, but he has to accept some responsibility for the teams failure to make the playoffs the last seven years. He has been helping guide a ship that has done nothing but flounder his entire time as de facto GM, CEO, and team president. There really is no question about it.

 

Russ Brandon is not without blame and according to some of the Buffalo Bills employees who post here stating that Brandon has been heavily involved in all forms of player acquisition. Then with him and Whaley both wanting these new owners to hire Rex Ryan shows me that nobody knows what they are doing in the FO. Now the defense is in basically full rebuild mode again to fit Ryan's 3-4. Here we go back to 2010-2011.