Rico Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 Doug Whaley is a very good scout. Doug Whaley has not yet proven that he is a good GM. Some fans don't understand the difference, at all. I'm fine with giving him another year (although it takes two to tango, and he's a FA). But he should be on a short leash until he demonstrates a better understanding of team-building. Prior to this year he did a terrible job addressing the offensive line, QB, TE and #2 WR positions and we're still not settled in those areas. And he'd better start finding decent linebackers on the cheap, because we need like six of those. Yep. I also think he needs to fully accept the mistakes that he (or Nix before him) have made, cut his losses, and move on; no GM is perfect, but the best one's are able to do that. He's done that a few times (eg. Chris Williams), let's see what he finally does with EJ.
Fan in Chicago Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 LOL its harder to bring in players when the schemes keep shifting ? recall not long ago Nix was drafting/reaching for a NT? next year we go 4-3. hybrid, 4-3, and most recently hybrid. Quite a dance to succeed i bet. and hell yes bring the LBs draft and FA But isnt that exactly what keeping RR would do ? The running thought is that he will need to extensively re-tool the D to make his scheme work. This is a faulty strategy with today's NFL. You cannot have all starters under contract for the exact same time. The scheme has to be flexible to accomodate players as they become available. Do we need better players ? Sure we do. But, so does every team in the NFL. And not too many great players become available in free agency. Key is drafting well, and building the team - things that take time and which we seemed to be on the right path till suddenly this year we weren't.
3rdand12 Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 To me? I believe that more is needed. If they have a consultant, a majordomo, then I'm not sure he/she is doing a successful job. I would like to see the entire coaching staff jettisoned and a new one brought in, but, that a'int happening (IMO) so bring in someone to start putting fingers in the dikes before Buffalo becomes Johnstown. ah i see your point now. I suggest that Pegulas are smart enough to gather quality opinion and perspective. The Czar thing seems a bit over the top to me. But Terry surely is learning he needs another set of eyes upon this team. I do NOT think they have made use of much of that advice or acted yet. That is going to influence and show up this offseason. Rex certainly knows he is under the microscope internally, as he well should be. Hope thats makes sense buddy : )
Mr. WEO Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 (edited) I agree 100% Thanks. What about a part time former czar who consults on larger football matters? If you're Whaley, what would you think about this? Thank God they didn't fire me? Just happy to have work? What are the larger football matters that your GM doesn't get involved with or control? Where are all the playoff teams that got there with the assistance of a football czar? The Jets fired Rex and their GM and instantly got better...with Bowles as coach! Edited December 27, 2015 by Mr. WEO
BrooklynBills Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 This stuff changes from week to week. I for one just don't get all the fan love for a man who has made a bunch of mistakes during his time as GM. Who actually drafted EJ? The guy that went and personally scouted him was Whaley. Bryce Brown for a fourth. Mike Williams replacing Stevie Johnson because Stevie didn't mesh well with EJ who as to be benched after three games and Kyle Orton could have used that always open WR. Replacing Andy Levitre with Chris Williams for 5.5 in guaranteed money! Doug Legurski, Colin Brown all = Rex Ryan vouched for Richie Incognito. Whaley didn't sign Richie Incognito on his own either as he could have signed him for the 2014 season and didn't. That offensive line which has never been properly upgraded in the entire time Whaley has been GM is headed for some serious changes this offseason if the team fails to sign Glenn, Incognito. The right side still has serious issues with the players Whaley obtained. Henderson, Kounandjio, Miller, Urbik all stink in their own way. Just think what that line would look like again this season without Incognito in probably battling for near worst again this year. Another serious fault with Whaley is his choice for QB in EJ as It was all Rex Ryan who wanted Tyrod Taylor for QB! Taylor has been such a bright spot for the offense this year he is also pro bowl alternate and so is Richie Incognito. Rex Ryan also wanted to sign certain linebackers in the offseason this year, and Whaley didn't get that done. Bill Polian wants the Bills to get rid of EJ, and I doubt Whaley would let that happen. Some say Whaley wants to fire Greg Roman. Is there a rift between the current HC & GM like there was last year between Marrone and others say there is no rift. http://www.buffalorumblings.com/buffalo-bills-rumors/2015/12/20/10629580/doug-whaley-butting-heads-with-buffalo-bills-coaches-per-report http://www.buffalorumblings.com/buffalo-bills-rumors/2015/12/27/10669238/doug-whaley-not-on-the-hot-seat-per-report?_ga=1.179569380.1389375532.1449156100 What we heard earlier was that the Pegula's was to hire a senior NFL adviser / czar and Whaley would be taking a back seat to whomever that is. If this is true then Whaley may or may not choose to stay in Buffalo. The only people that really know what will happen after the season ends are the new owners and I hope they hire a brilliant team president of football operations. Then step back and let him make all the football decisions. /end thread
3rdand12 Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 (edited) But isnt that exactly what keeping RR would do ? The running thought is that he will need to extensively re-tool the D to make his scheme work. This is a faulty strategy with today's NFL. You cannot have all starters under contract for the exact same time. The scheme has to be flexible to accomodate players as they become available. Do we need better players ? Sure we do. But, so does every team in the NFL. And not too many great players become available in free agency. Key is drafting well, and building the team - things that take time and which we seemed to be on the right path till suddenly this year we weren't. Great point. The running narrative is not what i believe honestly. Rex has never said such a thing. But i mentioned I expect some meeting in the middle in the offseason. Not a wholesale defensive rebuild. Dialing in the communication and terminology to the players would be wise to start. I dont believe this hard line talk about switching. I think he realizes his plan for this year went poorly. and is more flexible and intelligent than folks allow him I am gonna jump out for the game. Thanks for the good dialogue folks. and as always GO BILLS ! Starting to feel like no changes will be made this offseason in the front office or coaching staff, not even a football czar. That would be unfortunate. oh there will be changes, just not as dramatic as some hoped Edited December 27, 2015 by 3rdand12
Beerball Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 Thanks. If you're Whaley, what would you think about this? Thank God they didn't fire me? Just happy to have work? What are the larger football matters that your GM doesn't get involved with or control? Where are all the playoff teams that got there with the assistance of a football czar? The Jets fired Rex and their GM and instantly got better...with Bowles as coach! No argument from me on the coaching front. Read my first post on the hire, or the last one above. I really don't give a rip what Whaley or Rex or Brandon (or anyone else in the organization you care to name) would think about this. I don't believe that any of those 3 have proven to be able to put together an honest to goodness NFL football team. Would any of the 3 walk? Would you, at the end of the day, care? /end thread god, I love these posts
Nihilarian Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 LOL its harder to bring in players when the schemes keep shifting ? recall not long ago Nix was drafting/reaching for a NT? next year we go 4-3. hybrid, 4-3, and most recently hybrid. Quite a dance to succeed i bet. and hell yes bring the LBs draft and FA I find it very difficult to believe that the GM & HC are in any kind of lockstep if the team didn't make any effort to bring in the players that Rex Ryan needed to properly run his defense. Defenses are usually the first part of the team to gel in training camp and if anyone in the FO has an actual brain it should have been easy to recognize that the defense was going to have difficulties this season. I know Ryan didn't get the two linebackers he wanted before the season started, and of those two players, they could have made a big difference if one could have been calling the defensive signals. I also think of Rex Ryan flying down south to wine and dine, OG La'el Collins who Ryan recognized would have had a tremendous impact for the line this season. I watched him pancake player after player for the Clownboys this year and we get to see him up close this Sunday. I know he chose to sign with Dallas but we don't know what Buffalo offered.
MDH Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 Yep. I also think he needs to fully accept the mistakes that he (or Nix before him) have made, cut his losses, and move on; no GM is perfect, but the best one's are able to do that. He's done that a few times (eg. Chris Williams), let's see what he finally does with EJ. I never understood why he needs to cut EJ just because he didn't pan out as a starter. He's fine as a backup and he doesn't cost a lot. He's a good kid who doesn't whine or complain and works hard. Why cut him? Because fans don't like him?
Rico Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 No argument from me on the coaching front. Read my first post on the hire, or the last one above. I really don't give a rip what Whaley or Rex or Brandon (or anyone else in the organization you care to name) would think about this. I don't believe that any of those 3 have proven to be able to put together an honest to goodness NFL football team. Would any of the 3 walk? Would you, at the end of the day, care? god, I love these posts
Beerball Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 I never understood why he needs to cut EJ just because he didn't pan out as a starter. He's fine as a backup and he doesn't cost a lot. He's a good kid who doesn't whine or complain and works hard. Why cut him? Because fans don't like him? Because he is undependable to do what a backup QB is supposed to do? Cutting him before this season makes no sense (& I think that's what you were getting at). Keeping him after this season makes no sense.
Rico Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 I never understood why he needs to cut EJ just because he didn't pan out as a starter. He's fine as a backup and he doesn't cost a lot. He's a good kid who doesn't whine or complain and works hard. Why cut him? Because fans don't like him? Maybe because 2 coaching staffs don't agree?
MDH Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 Because he is undependable to do what a backup QB is supposed to do? Cutting him before this season makes no sense (& I think that's what you were getting at). Keeping him after this season makes no sense. Yeah, I don't see the need to cut him before next season either. Keep him in training camp, bring in another guy who can challenge TT for a starters spot and EJ for the backup spot. If EJ can't beat him out cut him. If he does keep him. Maybe because 2 coaching staffs don't agree? Don't agree with what? He's been the backup here for 2 different coaching staffs. Seem they agree he's a capable backup...
Big Turk Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 Thanks. If you're Whaley, what would you think about this? Thank God they didn't fire me? Just happy to have work? What are the larger football matters that your GM doesn't get involved with or control? Where are all the playoff teams that got there with the assistance of a football czar? The Jets fired Rex and their GM and instantly got better...with Bowles as coach! And Brandon Marshall, and Fitz, and Revis, and Cromartie and Leonard Williams...but yeah it was just Bowles and the same team...
Mr. WEO Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 No argument from me on the coaching front. Read my first post on the hire, or the last one above. I really don't give a rip what Whaley or Rex or Brandon (or anyone else in the organization you care to name) would think about this. I don't believe that any of those 3 have proven to be able to put together an honest to goodness NFL football team. Would any of the 3 walk? Would you, at the end of the day, care? god, I love these posts I wouldn't care if Whaley left, but he won't because there is no other GM job waiting for him. So if you are going to bring in someone to tell him how to do this job, just fire him and call the new guy the GM. None of this makes any sense at all otherwise. If the Pegulas bring in a "czar", to me that means they don't know what in the world to do. You pick one guy to be in charge and hire no one else.
Beerball Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 Yeah, I don't see the need to cut him before next season either. Keep him in training camp, bring in another guy who can challenge TT for a starters spot and EJ for the backup spot. If EJ can't beat him out cut him. If he does keep him. OK, it's done! (Isn't there a sizable cap savings by cutting him? If there is, about 2.8M then he's cut.)
MDH Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 OK, it's done! (Isn't there a sizable cap savings by cutting him? If there is, about 2.8M then he's cut.) Yeah, I don't know about the cap. If there is a sizable chunk saved then yeah, cut him.
Beerball Posted December 27, 2015 Posted December 27, 2015 I wouldn't care if Whaley left, but he won't because there is no other GM job waiting for him. So if you are going to bring in someone to tell him how to do this job, just fire him and call the new guy the GM. None of this makes any sense at all otherwise. If the Pegulas bring in a "czar", to me that means they don't know what in the world to do. You pick one guy to be in charge and hire no one else. Not if you do see potential in Whaley. If The Family Pegula do bring in someone it means that they're smart enough to realize that they need some guidance.
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