Ngata and Wilkerson to Buffalo in 2016??

[GG]

He actually has used 4-3 packages quite a bit. Of course, he's most famous for his 3-4 packages in Denver and Buffalo. The biggest time that sticks out to me was in the late 90's when the Bills lost Speilman and Covington in the same week, moved to a primarily 4-3 defense and beat Miami 9-6

That was an emergency lineup. When has he ever run a base 4-3?

[Adam]

That was an emergency lineup. When has he ever run a base 4-3?

He has always based personnel and alignment on what talent was there. If he can prepare a makeshift unit like that on a week's notice, I think he can do pretty well over a season and offseason. The only area where Ryan has him (or anyone) beat is press conferences.

[llyolf]

The D has come so far from last year when no QB wanted to face them... remember KWilliams tossing down Johny football like he was a ragdoll.... it makes me sick to think they'd go out and get more players to play this incredibly stupid scheme... not that anybody would want to come except for the $$$.

[YoloinOhio]

The Bills have also lined up in 4-3 many times this season. It is a 4-3 Under that is designed to look like a 3-4 until the ball is snapped. It's a hybrid that lines up the 5 tech on the strong side. Rex has never run a 3-4 2-gap exclusively and I don't think anyone does? The team is in base D less than half the time. The issue isn't 4-3 or 3-4 as much as it is that the scheme is very complicated with all the disguise and different personnel packages and needs players who understand it and can lead it, and are very versatile. There is certainly question as to why it needs to be so complicated? But that's his D and it has worked for him his whole career. He's not changing, he's going to get the players to run it right. Whether people agree with this or not. The whole 4-3/3-4 base thing is overrated though in today's NFL IMO.

Edited December 26, 2015 by YoloinOhio

[BarleyNY]

Size and experience gives him a ton of versatility when it comes to techniques... Ngata works almost anywhere.

He's on the wrong side of 30.

 

But every time I read Haloti's name, I shake my head and think Donte Whitner and John McCargo, and the presser where Tom Modrak explained how he had McCargo and Ngata rated the same.

Just find it funny that people who are pimping him don't even know where he typically plays. Or that he's getting toward the end of his career (as is pointed out above).

[BADOLBILZ]

When has Wade ever run a 4-3?

 

 

Wade is technically a 3-4 guy but he favors 1 gap personnel.

 

Best example was 280 pound nose tackle Jay Ratliff in Dallas.

 

That was basically 4-3 personnel that he adjusted his D to fit.

[nucci]

He's run both over the years and adjusts well to utilize personnel and disrupt the opposing offense

No, he hasn't. He was Texans DC who moved Mario to LB

[Mikie2times]

If we got anybody who fits into the DL it would the Jets NT Harrison. He's a beast 3-4 NT and very young.

[BADOLBILZ]

No, he hasn't. He was Texans DC who moved Mario to LB

 

 

Mario was very much HOPING to play the same role as he did in Wade's D.

 

Contrary to a what a few under-informed people on this board have stated........Mario was on his way to a huge season in Houston under Wade before he was injured.

 

There is this weird myth floating around here that he left Houston because he didn't want to play in a 3-4........he left Houston because they weren't going to pay him anything close to the equivalent of the best defender in the NFL.

 

In part because of cap issues but also because they had a bunch of young prospects who played well in his absence.

 

They didn't pan out so they expended the #1 overall pick on Clowney.

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

You'd think Pegula himself and maybe in discussion with Whale at a very high level would have to ask long and hard, OK if we make moves like this and the team doesn't play any better, still lead the league in penalty's, no discipline etc, if at the end of next season I did want to fire Rex, how much would these moves set the team back in regards to flexibility moving forward. You'd likely be eating contracts at the expense of giving Rex the team he wants, now if you bring someone else in as coach, you could be looking at dumping even more.

 

Is it better to bail out now before digging yourself such a deep hole, it could take even more years to dig out from. (rather fitting WRT Terry's comments about digging another well I suppose)

 

 

Pegula? Shouldn't it be Whaley?

[iinii]

Ngata is long in the tooth

[BADOLBILZ]

Ngata is long in the tooth

 

He could be had for a shorter term deal though.

 

I really don't know what Harrison's market is.....but being a younger player he might be in line for a 5 year or longer deal which is a big commitment for a scheme specific player when you aren't really sure if your head coach and his scheme is going to be around for more than one more season.

 

Personally, I think they should be able to patch the NT hole pretty easy. Terrence Knighton couldn't find a job last offseason and signed a 1 year $4M deal. Nose tackles aren't particularly valuable in this league. That's why playing Dareus there is bat-sh*t crazy.

[John from Riverside]

 

He could be had for a shorter term deal though.

 

I really don't know what Harrison's market is.....but being a younger player he might be in line for a 5 year or longer deal which is a big commitment for a scheme specific player when you aren't really sure if your head coach and his scheme is going to be around for more than one more season.

 

Personally, I think they should be able to patch the NT hole pretty easy. Terrence Knighton couldn't find a job last offseason and signed a 1 year $4M deal. Nose tackles aren't particularly valuable in this league. That's why playing Dareus there is bat-sh*t crazy.

Agreed

 

Patch Ngata into the NT position and move Marcel out to DE

[Not at the table Karlos]

Wade runs a 3-4, correct?

yes but it is more of a one gap scheme for the lineman. Jay Ratliff played nose tackle for the Cowboys at 300 lbs. I think wades 34 would fit our players much batter than rexs 2 gap 34

 

 

Wade is technically a 3-4 guy but he favors 1 gap personnel.

 

Best example was 280 pound nose tackle Jay Ratliff in Dallas.

 

That was basically 4-3 personnel that he adjusted his D to fit.

yup. Was he here for Jeff wright? I think he brought it Ted Washington as our nose when he came but can't remember. Basically wade will fit his scheme to the players

[Max997]

where have you been the last couple weeks? We are supposedly transitioning to a 3-4. 3 down lineman. Mario has been complaining all season and is most likely going to be released. Kyle is iffy to return as well but they did say they want him back. Hughes will be a hybrid DE/OLB in a 3-4 leaving Dareus as the only starting D-lineman. Not the way I would like but the way it looks to be going.

 

IF. If we signed ngata and Wilkerson. Wilkerson and dareus are our ends and ngata the NT. I could see the three of them rotating because they all can do basically everything well.

Exactly, they are going to be running a 3-4 and already hv Marcel, Hughes, and most likely Kyle so don't see where two additional starters would play

 

Hughes is not an OLB especially with the way Rex uses his LBs so even if Kyle doesn't come back there still isn't room to add two starters to the Dline

 

Doesn't matter though bc Wilkerson who I'm a big fan of isn't going anywhere and will get a similar contract to Dareus so even if he did hit the market it simply wouldn't happen

[Dragonborn10]

Yep... That seems to be the blue print Seattle used

Decent point. Except Seattle had three Pro Bowlers in the secondary. Their D-line is ok (Dareus > Bennett) and their LB's are much better than the Bills.

 

Buffalo has three very good to exceptional players in the secondary when healthy.

 

They need to score earlier and more often and force teams to throw the ball to catch up. Spend the money on the offensive line and the line backers.

Dareus is a 3-4 DE

Yes and no. The Bills like every team play more than 50% of their defensive snaps in the nickel which put Dareus at DT. Yes he gets a ton of snaps at DE and even a few at NT, but regardless of the base defense he is mostly a 4-3 DE.

Now what his responsibilities are might be different. With Scwartz I think he was asked to penetrate along with KW. With Rex it looks like he is asked to maintain the point of attack. This is probably because Rex knows what we all know. The linebackers on this team suck.

[GoBills!]

Im sorry what coach with those two and Gilmore and Darby wouldn't be succesful ? I look at the succes in KC for their D,they are on the right track and are a top notch unit keeping games close. If Rex can't do it with these guys and this years soft schedule I don't believe in him at all.

 

A winning team D allows under 20 points a game which makes almost any game a possible win. Look at the team who allow over 20 points per game, almost all are not contenders this year..

[Lenigmusx]

Decent point. Except Seattle had three Pro Bowlers in the secondary. Their D-line is ok (Dareus > Bennett) and their LB's are much better than the Bills.Buffalo has three very good to exceptional players in the secondary when healthy.They need to score earlier and more often and force teams to throw the ball to catch up. Spend the money on the offensive line and the line backers. Yes and no. The Bills like every team play more than 50% of their defensive snaps in the nickel which put Dareus at DT. Yes he gets a ton of snaps at DE and even a few at NT, but regardless of the base defense he is mostly a 4-3 DE.Now what his responsibilities are might be different. With Scwartz I think he was asked to penetrate along with KW. With Rex it looks like he is asked to maintain the point of attack. This is probably because Rex knows what we all know. The linebackers on this team suck.

I think it is the gap-assignment and lack of aggression that has lost these defensive linemen. Can you imagine how Bruce Smith would have responded if he were asked to hold a gap for Preston Brown??? I think the linebackers responded better last year when the D-line attacked and all they had to do is respond and react. I think the linebackers are being asked to think and read and it exposes their physical limitations because it slows already slow linebackers down. Schwartz was able to mask some of their limitations by creating pressure with the defensive line and attacking with the greatest physical strength of the Bills defense.

Edited December 27, 2015 by Lenigmusx

[BuffaloBillsMagic1]

With Rex as the coach Bruce Smith would be a coverage lb. these two guys would be average n Rex defense. No need as he would waste them. Hope is to load up offense to win games 35-30

Edited December 27, 2015 by BuffaloBillsMagic1

[Uffalo Ills]

Why do we need 2 nose tackles?