DrDawkinstein Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Question for everyone.... If it took Whaley getting let go in order for Rex to be let go, would you be ok with that? CBF Good question. No, I probably wouldnt be ok with that. Rex will most likely coach himself out of town with another season like this one. Id rather stick it out and keep Doug, than clean house now just to get rid of Rex. The new coach should report directly to the GM anyways. So keep Doug and get him a coach to boss around.
vorpma Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 I'm pretty sure he still has other land and active wells, etc. He does!
BuffaloBillsForever Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 You pay money for big parts of your offense. Clay is a big part of our offense. Outside of McCoy, he's probably our highest use offensive player. He's also a good blocker, and can run well after the catch. Both things Chandler struggled with. As far as 'running from every thread', I do have responsibilities and interests outside of TBD, even with my fairly high post count. But I will be running away again, have a happy holidays and all that jazz. Clay's YAC is like in the top 70. There isn't an aspect of his game that shows he should be a top 3 paid TE in the NFL.
Lenigmusx Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 I agree with this. Whaley has assembled a better roster than we have had previously. I question a lot of rexs decisions this year but I don't know if changing coaches again is the right answer either. Ugghh we are stuck in purgatory Not if they Bring in Schwartz and go back to last years Defense
DrDawkinstein Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Not if they Bring in Schwartz and go back to last years Defense Can you fire Rex, bring back Schwartz, and keep Roman? (I dont really care about Crossman and hope he is replaced either way) I really dont want to see an entire coaching staff change, but I'd take parts of it being re-done. Even with the valid criticisms of Roman, I'd like to see Taylor, Watkins and Co. with another year to grow in the same system.
GG Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 (edited) Not if they Bring in Schwartz and go back to last years Defense The vaunted Schwartz defense folded like a cheap suit when it lost one player to injury. What would it look like if it had similar injuries to this year's team? Schwartz success was because he had four pro bowl worthy players on DL. How sustainable is that? Edited December 21, 2015 by GG
YoloinOhio Posted December 21, 2015 Author Posted December 21, 2015 Can you fire Rex, bring back Schwartz, and keep Roman? (I dont really care about Crossman and hope he is replaced either way) I really dont want to see an entire coaching staff change, but I'd take parts of it being re-done. Even with the valid criticisms of Roman, I'd like to see Taylor, Watkins and Co. with another year to grow in the same system. schwartz as HC? Do you think he was a good HC? I understand the beefs with Rex, but is Schwartz a better choice as HC? Poor record, 1 playoff berth in 6 years, undisciplined team, surliness to fans and media, etc..
JohnC Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 There's nothing to make me believe that haley and Ryan can't get on the same page at this point, as it seems that Rex felt that the players on hand could execute his scheme and was simply wrong in his belief. If, however, the two can't get on the same page, no additional voice in the room is going to make that happen IMO. Too many people are emphasizing that the main problem with this team had to do with the scheme and the players suitability to fit within the scheme. No doubt that was a major factor that contributed to the regression of the defense. But for me that doesn't deal with the core of the problem associated with Rex as a HC. No one is going to associate a Rex team with being a disciplined team. No one is going to associate a Rex team with being an intelligent team. No one is going to associate a Rex team with being a cohesive team. No one is going to associate a Rex team with being a mature team. No one going to associate a Rex team that pays attention to detail. Those issues have little to do with scheme and everything to do with how he coaches. He is a sloppy coach so it is not surprising that his team is a sloppy team on the field. In the NFL of today players come and go due to cap reasons, injuries, free agency acquisition and departures. What Rex has demonstrated is a poor ability to adjust to roster changes and rapid changes in game situations. The issue of scheme is the focal point for many people. That isn't the issue I am most concerned with. My sense of him is that as a coach he simply doesn't have the wherewithal to compete against the better coaches in the league. With him at the helm there is always going to be a lot of "noise" that distracts from the task of coaching. Rex entered the western NY scene with a lot of fanfare. He literally parachuted in and drove around in his souped up truck painted with team colors. At the podium he blustered about what he was going to do. The reality is that the act didn't match his grand declarations. Do you want to know why? He's simply not competent enough. Next year the roster will be changed to better match his specifications. What does it matter when you still can't coach? The difference between a good coach and a mediocre coach isn't always demonstrated by the record. A good coach gets his team to play to its talent level (good or bad roster) and a mediocre coach gets his team to play below its talent level (good or bad roster). Can anyone say that Rex's team didn't grossly underachieve relative to its talent level? That's the heart of the problem.
RealityCheck Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 The vaunted Schwartz defense folded like a cheap suit when it lost one player to injury. What would it look like if it had similar injuries to this year's team? Schwartz success was because he had four pro bowl worthy players on DL. How sustainable is that? They weren't all Pro-Bowlers the year before last, and they were a million miles away from that this year. So, I gotta give Pepper Johnson and Jim Schwartz some credit for getting these guys up to being all that they could be. The Bills' four man front coached by Pepper Jonson last year was the bomb. The biggest problem with Rex's scheme is that really good 2-gap players are more rare than ever. Bellicheat moved to a 4-3 years age, and has adapted to the availability of these players and how much easier it is to plug news guys in.
DrDawkinstein Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 schwartz as HC? Do you think he was a good HC? I understand the beefs with Rex, but is Schwartz a better choice as HC? Poor record, 1 playoff berth in 6 years, undisciplined team, surliness to fans and media, etc.. Doesnt matter what he was, only matters what he can be. And yes, seeing how the players reacted to both Schwartz leaving and Rex coming in, I think he could have been (and maybe still could be) a good HC here in Buffalo, for this current team, in its current situation. I think a strong argument could be made that if all other moves stayed the same (Roman/Taylor/Incognito/Clay/McCoy/etc), and we simply swapped Schwartz for Rex, we most likely make the playoffs. Additionally, 1 in 6 years is still better than 0 in 16, haha. Sometimes it's not about looking at the coach in a vacuum, but looking at him in the specific situation. Otherwise, Belichick would never have gotten a 2nd chance.
GG Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 No one is going to associate a Rex team with being a disciplined team. No one is going to associate a Rex team with being an intelligent team. No one is going to associate a Rex team with being a cohesive team. No one is going to associate a Rex team with being a mature team. No one going to associate a Rex team that pays attention to detail. Those issues have little to do with scheme and everything to do with how he coaches. He is a sloppy coach so it is not surprising that his team is a sloppy team on the field. In the NFL of today players come and go due to cap reasons, injuries, free agency acquisition and departures. What Rex has demonstrated is a poor ability to adjust to roster changes and rapid changes in game situations. The issue of scheme is the focal point for many people. That isn't the issue I am most concerned with. My sense Rex entered the western NY scene with a lot of fanfare. He literally parachuted in and drove around in his souped up truck painted with team colors. At the podium he blustered about what he was going to do. The reality is that the act didn't match his grand declarations. Do you want to know why? He's simply not competent enough. Next year the roster will be changed to better match his specifications. What does it matter when you still can't coach? The difference between a good coach and a mediocre coach isn't always demonstrated by the record. A good coach gets his team to play to its talent level (good or bad roster) and a mediocre coach gets his team to play below its talent level (good or bad roster). Can anyone say that Rex's team didn't grossly underachieve relative to its talent level? That's the heart of the problem. Your disdain for Rex cloud your acceptance of history. Rex's jets and Ravens teams were not an undisciplined mess. Rex's reputation as a players coach are very similar to how Marv was perceived as a coach by league insiders when he first joined the Bills. It's easy to judge Marv in retrospect because he had a nucleus of hall of famers, but they certainly didn't perform like that early on and it took Marv and Polian three seasons to clean up the roster Everyone acts as if Rex inherited a superstar team that he tanked as opposed to inheriting a bunch of guys who eeked out a 9-7 finish and could have just as easily been 6-10. Bottom line is that the roster is still filled with a bunch of idiots who are prone to making a boneheaded play once a game. The purge will continue.
reddogblitz Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Schwartz success was because he had four pro bowl worthy players on DL. How sustainable is that? Why can't Rex do the same if it's so easy? He's got the same line. Actually, only 3 of them were in the Pro Bowl last year. How many will be this year? I would say it's sustainable for the next 3 or 4 years at least. And, we can always bring new defensive lineman in if needed.
YoloinOhio Posted December 21, 2015 Author Posted December 21, 2015 Doesnt matter what he was, only matters what he can be. And yes, seeing how the players reacted to both Schwartz leaving and Rex coming in, I think he could have been (and maybe still could be) a good HC here in Buffalo, for this current team, in its current situation. I think a strong argument could be made that if all other moves stayed the same (Roman/Taylor/Incognito/Clay/McCoy/etc), and we simply swapped Schwartz for Rex, we most likely make the playoffs. Additionally, 1 in 6 years is still better than 0 in 16, haha. Sometimes it's not about looking at the coach in a vacuum, but looking at him in the specific situation. Otherwise, Belichick would never have gotten a 2nd chance. he could be, but based on his past, no one would bet on that. Again, Rex aside.... Just looking at Schwartz. He had a #1 overall pick at QB, a #2 overall pick at WR, a #2 overall pick at DT, he had players. He had a poor track record as a HC at many levels. It is hard to say he would be any better than Rex. There are players who wish he was still the DC. That's different from being the HC. I just don't think it's a slam dunk that he is the right guy for HC.
jeffismagic Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Why can't Rex do the same if it's so easy? He's got the same line. Actually, only 3 of them were in the Pro Bowl last year. How many will be this year? I would say it's sustainable for the next 3 or 4 years at least. And, we can always bring new defensive lineman in if needed. How did Rex injure Kyle Williams? Mario Williams might not be in his preferred scheme but he was the one who couldn't beat scrubs all year in one one one matchups. I'll give you Dareus as a lineman that Rex messed around with. If Rex needed Dareus as a NT why didn't he insist on getting a real NT in free agency?
DrDawkinstein Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 (edited) he could be, but based on his past, no one would bet on that. Again, Rex aside.... Just looking at Schwartz. He had a #1 overall pick at QB, a #2 overall pick at WR, a #2 overall pick at DT, he had players. He had a poor track record as a HC at many levels. It is hard to say he would be any better than Rex. There are players who wish he was still the DC. That's different from being the HC. I just don't think it's a slam dunk that he is the right guy for HC. Well, the basis for my argument is the fact that the only way we were going to keep Schwartz (or hire him back) is at HC. That is his rule. And if that's how it has to be, then fine. It can't really get much worse. Edited December 21, 2015 by DrDareustein
May Day 10 Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Just heard rex on the radio gushing over Whaley and his moves for awhile. Sounds like someone at the top is pushing an agenda
Coach Tuesday Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 (edited) Your disdain for Rex cloud your acceptance of history. Rex's jets and Ravens teams were not an undisciplined mess. Rex's reputation as a players coach are very similar to how Marv was perceived as a coach by league insiders when he first joined the Bills. It's easy to judge Marv in retrospect because he had a nucleus of hall of famers, but they certainly didn't perform like that early on and it took Marv and Polian three seasons to clean up the roster Everyone acts as if Rex inherited a superstar team that he tanked as opposed to inheriting a bunch of guys who eeked out a 9-7 finish and could have just as easily been 6-10. Bottom line is that the roster is still filled with a bunch of idiots who are prone to making a boneheaded play once a game. The purge will continue. Good post. Say what you will about Nix but at least he drafted guys who were team captains, four year starters, and high IQ athletes. This team needs brains and integrity. Edited December 21, 2015 by Coach Tuesday
bbb Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 He sold 76,000 acres...he's got additional lands in Pennsylvania, West Virginia, and Colorado. He's sitting on plenty of assets. Indeed.
FireChan Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 he could be, but based on his past, no one would bet on that. Again, Rex aside.... Just looking at Schwartz. He had a #1 overall pick at QB, a #2 overall pick at WR, a #2 overall pick at DT, he had players. He had a poor track record as a HC at many levels. It is hard to say he would be any better than Rex. There are players who wish he was still the DC. That's different from being the HC. I just don't think it's a slam dunk that he is the right guy for HC. He had players, but he also took over the 0-16 Lions, the worst team in NFL history. Not as though he took a 9-7 team and ruined it.
zonabb Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 (edited) An earlier post mentioned these guys as great executives or coaches or something to that point. All this complaining about Rex and Whaley and the Pegulas and Wilson as garbage or some form of fecal matter ignores the only key issue.... you don't win as a GM, Owner, or Coach without a franchise QB. If you get lucky and find one (and a lot of it is circumstances and luck, let's be honest) you win and look like a genius, you don't find one, you're a failure. You can fire Whaley and Rex, or any coach every single year and without a QB this will continue unabated. A GM doesn't produce quality college QBs and get sole rights to them. They have to be available in the draft and fall to you. I've stated a lot in recent posts that the demand far outstrips the supply and it results in those demanding a QB to overbuy, selecting QBs with marginal talent in the hopes that they can be "fixed." Doesn't happen. So the best best is find a good talent evaluator (Whaley is that guy I think, yes there are misses but all GMs have lots of misses) and commit to a coaching staff for the longrun that keeps some continuity of schemes. We're seeing now what happens when you constantly change, your players don't align with the ever changing schemes. So now what? Go backwards, fire Rex after a draft where he took players to fit his schemes and find a new coach that does what exactly? Firing everyone never works, look at the last generation of Bills team. Bottom line, No QB, no winning. Period. End. Of. Story. Polian - Kelly Wolf - Favre Holmgren - Favre Policy - Montana, Young Edited December 21, 2015 by zonabb
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