Bleeding Bills Blue Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 On third and one? Yeah. That was a major one. He was a nut. Oh, go ahead and claim he had Donald Jones and David Nelson. That makes him even more of a freaking clown to put those guys on third and one instead of an RB. According to BC, HC careers end after Buffalo because no one realizes how great they were. The fact that we wanted to run 5 wide... and had 2 starters who were UDFAs - just amazes me.
mannc Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 According to BC, HC careers end after Buffalo because no one realizes how great they were.Obviously.
Gordio Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 The OBJ thing is BS hindsight. Maybe so but these are the types of moves fair or unfair that GMs are judged on. Bottom line is our GM paid a hefty price to move up to draft a receiver in a receiver rich draft.
dezertbill Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 After the train wreck Rex created this year I think more credit should be given to Schwartz. He lived up to his word despite taking over a defense different than his and played to the players strengths rather than trying to make them fit into his system. At the end of the day I feel this is going to boost Schwartz value due to his flexibility and ability to adjust based on talent.
abc Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 You know it's funny that I agree with both perspectives here. My initial gut reaction is that you don't simply draft a QB to take a shot that you might have a future HOF'er. Then when I go back and look at the Bills draft history, I can see that in the last 20 years, the Bills have drafted exactly 2 quarterbacks in the first or second round. E.J. Manuel and J.P. Losman. To boot, neither of these guys were really high draft picks where there were a ton of expectations out of the box. So for 2016, what do I really want? Well, I don't want to see a forced pick of a QB in round 1, just for the sake of trying. But....if the front office thinks there's a guy that has that potential to be that guy, then I'm good with it. I like what Tyrod has done. He's been the best QB the Bills have had since Jim Kelly. But his biggest flaw is that he doesn't make decisions quickly or makes them too quick. He's got two moves. Lock onto the first read and throw a 1-3 yard pass or wait 3-4 seconds for the deep ball. That won't cut it long term. Some of it is play calling too. How many slant routes have we seen Sammy run mid-field? I don't recall any. Anyway, on the fate of Rex and Whaley, I don't know how I feel. Whaley isn't calling plays. Should he be the fall guy for failed defensive schemes and play calling? I don't see how quite frankly. None the less, there's always going to be someone to blame. Rex won't be a 1-year and done coach here in Buffalo. I think there's almost no chance of that. The Pegula's would look like complete idiots if that were the case. It looks bad now, but I don't believe for a second that starting over completely is the answer. Wait you are forgetting about Todd Collins in the 2nd round in 1995
Manther Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 I honestly haven't come up with any lists, but I sort of have the feeling that Whaley has followed a long parade of suits at 1 Bills Drive who generally value players off other teams over the players developed in-house. Then there is the Chris Kelsay enigma. If there are countless examples and you can't come up with one?! WTF! And, what does Chris Kelsay have to do with Whaley?
boyst Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 2016 GM Cowher Head coach Jim Schwartz QB EJ Manuel WR Goodwin and Hogan
jahnyc Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Schwartz is the big winner here. He looks good compared to Rex in terms of how the defense performed when he was the DC. The other winner (shockingly) is Marrone. He coached the team to a better record with arguably less talent and his issues with the front office now seem to be more about the front office than him.
Sisyphean Bills Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 If there are countless examples and you can't come up with one?! WTF! And, what does Chris Kelsay have to do with Whaley? You might want to read the thread again. I never said "countless examples" and the question wasn't directed at me. But it's a message board and I commented.
blitzboy54 Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 (edited) 2016 GM Cowher Head coach Jim Schwartz QB EJ Manuel WR Goodwin and Hogan Dear God, this is sarcasm rigt? Please? Edited December 21, 2015 by blitzboy54
Rico Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 One thing is for sure: you don't need a Czar if you have a strong GM in place to straighten things out. Maybe all this Twitter chatter is wrong after all. Maybe Pegs is so impressed with the stellar work that DW has done that DW will be getting a promotion, with a big fat raise and control over Rex. Then again, maybe not.
xsoldier54 Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 The Legend of Doug Whaley > The Legend of Kiko Alonzo. He's had his moments, taken some risks, and made a lot of the kind of moves we as fans have wanted to see for a while, but he's done nothing worthy of the praise he gets from the fans (or at least a sizeable chunk of the fan base.) The extent to which people go to defend him is amusing too. I get that Rex has been a disappointment, but to hear some of you talk one would think he'd taken over a dominating squad rather than a glorified .500 team. He took over a really good defense and completely ruined it.
KOKBILLS Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Polian and Lafontaine were the two people that Pegulas wanted last time. Who I can name has no bearing. Sure it does...Because if there are better candidates it's actually evidence supporting the potential move...I just don't see the logic in assuming a guy as smart as Pegs will not learn from his mistakes... And if he does make a stupid move the chances are it's not going to be any worse than what we have now... So...Anyway...
boyst Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Dear God, this is sarcasm rigt? Please? DC daryl TalleyOC Gabe gilbert
MarkyMannn Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 2016 GM Cowher Head coach Jim Schwartz QB EJ Manuel WR Goodwin and Hogan Too much time on the tractor
Big Turk Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 He took over a really good defense and completely ruined it. In fairness how could Whaley have done a better job? Dude had a tremendous defense for the last 2 years and had the best defensive mind in the game as HC...he made some great moves and draft picks to add much needed talent to the offensive side of the ball which has been the strength of the team this year, and a great pick in Darby in the second round that was laughed at by everyone and he has played at a pro bowl if not all pro level most of the year... Whaley had no reason to expect the defense would regress this much. It is completely unfair to put this on him. He fixed the offensive side of the ball and the Bills are in the top 10 in the NFL in scoring, what else can he do? He can't help a defensive mastermind ruined our defense nor should he have expected it to happen...nobody could have foreseen this big of a drop... I think this whole Whaley bashing is just taking the easy way out. You want to bash him for Manuel? Who would he have drafted in that draft that was better? Geno Smith? Mike Glennon? It was the worst QB draft in a long time and it just happened to coincide with when the Bills and Nix decided they needed to draft a QB...bad timing. We sit here and say the Bills could have drafted a franchise QB but yet there were none available to be drafted in that draft... Whaley has upgraded this roster with a lot of talent both through the draft and through FA signings and some of his best ones are guys like Baccari Rambo and other waiver wire pickups that seem to be pretty good players...
FireChan Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 In fairness how could Whaley have done a better job? Dude had a tremendous defense for the last 2 years and had the best defensive mind in the game as HC...he made some great moves and draft picks to add much needed talent to the offensive side of the ball which has been the strength of the team this year, and a great pick in Darby in the second round that was laughed at by everyone and he has played at a pro bowl if not all pro level most of the year... Whaley had no reason to expect the defense would regress this much. It is completely unfair to put this on him. He fixed the offensive side of the ball and the Bills are in the top 10 in the NFL in scoring, what else can he do? He can't help a defensive mastermind ruined our defense nor should he have expected it to happen...nobody could have foreseen this big of a drop... I think this whole Whaley bashing is just taking the easy way out. You want to bash him for Manuel? Who would he have drafted in that draft that was better? Geno Smith? Mike Glennon? It was the worst QB draft in a long time and it just happened to coincide with when the Bills and Nix decided they needed to draft a QB...bad timing. We sit here and say the Bills could have drafted a franchise QB but yet there were none available to be drafted in that draft... Whaley has upgraded this roster with a lot of talent both through the draft and through FA signings and some of his best ones are guys like Baccari Rambo and other waiver wire pickups that seem to be pretty good players... I believe he meant Rex.
boyst Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Too much time on the tractor we coach don beebeOl coach incognito Special teams coach Jimmy!
jeffismagic Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Sure it does...Because if there are better candidates it's actually evidence supporting the potential move...I just don't see the logic in assuming a guy as smart as Pegs will not learn from his mistakes... And if he does make a stupid move the chances are it's not going to be any worse than what we have now... So...Anyway... I just don't like the idea of a washed up NFL guy leading the charge. Even great football minds look bad as they age. Parcells was awful in Miami and Holmgren in Cleveland. Polian was a bullet just dodged based on luck and now you want to try that again?!
boyst Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Things like cutting Thigpen and signing Cassel will be major factors on what happens to who. Wy did we cut Thigpen? Why did we sign ik? Whatbwas up with Cassel?
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