John from Riverside Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 hmmm where have I heard that excuse before... The difference is Tyrod has played much better then the player you are indicating.
reddogblitz Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 (edited) In effect he is. It is his first year as a starter and he missed 2 games due to injury. He has had 12 starts in the league now. Still not a full season even after this year. Based on what, your infallible opinion? Statistics agree with me. I do agree with you to a degree. But, a couple of things. Very rare is the rookie QB that comes in and plays all 16 games. Most don't. So to say a guy is a rookie until he gets 16 starts is stretching it a little. And, Tyrod has already had 4 off season programs, 4 training camps, 16 more pre season games, and even thrown 2 more interceptions than a true rookie coming into his first season. True it's not playing, but it's still a huge head start. I think we should expect at least modestly better than rookie play. I think he has given us that. I wanted us to sign Tyrod even before FA started BECAUSE he already had this head start on someone else's dime. He is what he is, a 5 year veteran. Edited December 21, 2015 by reddogblitz
3rdand12 Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 Bravo sir, well said who is this guy we are drafting ? When did I say he was better than Cam this yr? I'd take Tannehill, Bortles and Osweiler over TT, but wait I no nothing. Cook, Lynch, Goff. All going first round and your obsession with me is sad, you really need to do something with your life. I dont follow college so i must trust in folks like you that know their business. First round? like at nineteen? ready to play NFL ball ? need a year or two ? what are we talking about here? always draft one because you cannot get one worth a hoot in FA realistically Yes, but here at TBD, it's always the bread in the toaster that starts the house on fire. thats because we butter it before dropping in the toaster. again and again : ) Plays through pain, for one. This team is filled with guys who are done in every week with strains and sprains. TT is the single tough guy on a team full of whirlpool wonders. Don't need a first year starting QB yelling at his teammates (witness the idiotic Jameis Winston for that). one of your gentler efforts. and rather spot on
Section242 Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 He can get better but I think he is probably the best he'll be right now. Which maybe ok if the goal is to get to the playoffs. If the goal is the SB I don't see it.
3rdand12 Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 He can get better but I think he is probably the best he'll be right now. Which maybe ok if the goal is to get to the playoffs. If the goal is the SB I don't see it. If we can agree he can improve, which we mostly cannot, then we could talk about playoffs maybe next year. How have you decided he cannot take us to the superbowl at some point? Honest question. to me getting to the super bowl takes a completely dialed in team effort and some very good luck. not just a QB. : )
Big74Mac Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 All things considered Taylor might not be the next Manning or Brady but is probably about the best thing we have seen since Flutie and given the choices to fix it last summer and the 2015 draft I think they did OK in this area. I look for a much better backup with starting potential in the draft and give Taylor another year to see if he can grow. If he takes a step forward in his second year as a starter we might have something there. I doubt this years draft produces a starter anyways.
John from Riverside Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 I do agree with you to a degree. But, a couple of things. Very rare is the rookie QB that comes in and plays all 16 games. Most don't. So to say a guy is a rookie until he gets 16 starts is stretching it a little. And, Tyrod has already had 4 off season programs, 4 training camps, 16 more pre season games, and even thrown 2 more interceptions than a true rookie coming into his first season. True it's not playing, but it's still a huge head start. I think we should expect at least modestly better than rookie play. I think he has given us that. I wanted us to sign Tyrod even before FA started BECAUSE he already had this head start on someone else's dime. He is what he is, a 5 year veteran. I prefer the term "experienced rookie starter"
keepthefaith Posted December 21, 2015 Posted December 21, 2015 It's reasonable to think that Tyrod can improve his play in future years. His numbers say he's already good.
BADOLBILZ Posted December 22, 2015 Posted December 22, 2015 (edited) Tyrod has done enough to merit entering the offseason as this team's starting QB. They should also be looking for their long-term answer at the position in the upcoming draft, as well as for a veteran backup that can play from off the bench. Is there anyone, on this board or otherwise, that doesn't agree with BOTH of the above two statements? If so, I would like to hear your reasoning. Their reasoning is either that Tyrod hasn't earned that and should be competing with another vet next summer or that the Bills should not risk damaging Tyrod's fragile ego by drafting a QB early. I think ownership has to make it an organizational directive to always be looking to improve at QB....be it at the top or second or third string. If you do so......and it's understood.......then there is neither reason for complacency or distrust from the QB at the top of your depth chart. I enjoy watching Tyrod and I think he has shown enough at this point to say that "maybe" he can evolve into a Russell Wilson-esque franchise QB.......but that's hardly enough reason to let up in the search for a great QB. Edited December 22, 2015 by #BADOL
John from Riverside Posted December 22, 2015 Posted December 22, 2015 I think there is something to be said about an incombant starter getting starter reps in training camp.....working on things that are deficiencies in game at that time before heading into the season. Then you draft a QB and let the QB coach tutor that clipboard holder.....allowing him to get the other reps and run scout team offense.
Best Player Available Posted December 22, 2015 Posted December 22, 2015 Their reasoning is either that Tyrod hasn't earned that and should be competing with another vet next summer or that the Bills should not risk damaging Tyrod's fragile ego by drafting a QB early. I think ownership has to make it an organizational directive to always be looking to improve at QB....be it at the top or second or third string. If you do so......and it's understood.......then there is neither reason for complacency or distrust from the QB at the top of your depth chart. I enjoy watching Tyrod and I think he has shown enough at this point to say that "maybe" he can evolve into a Russell Wilson-esque franchise QB.......but that's hardly enough reason to let up in the search for a great QB. You make some fair observations. IMO TT has done easily enough to be the undisputed starter next season. because he earned it. And not because he was a first round reach. there should be no distracting QB " competition". but it is also fair to draft early a prospect that in the very least could come in and compete when TT goes down. Today that is lacking big-time. Tyrod is one of the few bright spots this year. can he improve? yea, but after years of utter disaster this guy seems to be able to learn, Improve his game and, with some great coaching lead a team deep into the playoffs. The guy has big play potential.
3rdand12 Posted December 22, 2015 Posted December 22, 2015 Their reasoning is either that Tyrod hasn't earned that and should be competing with another vet next summer or that the Bills should not risk damaging Tyrod's fragile ego by drafting a QB early. I think ownership has to make it an organizational directive to always be looking to improve at QB....be it at the top or second or third string. If you do so......and it's understood.......then there is neither reason for complacency or distrust from the QB at the top of your depth chart. I enjoy watching Tyrod and I think he has shown enough at this point to say that "maybe" he can evolve into a Russell Wilson-esque franchise QB.......but that's hardly enough reason to let up in the search for a great QB. This post and John's following post are a rather intelligent way to look forward ! You make some fair observations. IMO TT has done easily enough to be the undisputed starter next season. because he earned it. And not because he was a first round reach. there should be no distracting QB " competition". but it is also fair to draft early a prospect that in the very least could come in and compete when TT goes down. Today that is lacking big-time. Tyrod is one of the few bright spots this year. can he improve? yea, but after years of utter disaster this guy seems to be able to learn, Improve his game and, with some great coaching lead a team deep into the playoffs. The guy has big play potential. shout out to BPA also. I don't want to be totally screwed by injury at the QB pos. Its too Billsian, and do , just bound to happen that we get on a roll and the starter goes down
Solomon Grundy Posted December 22, 2015 Posted December 22, 2015 I'm so sick of "Tyrod's not the reason we lost" crap. True, Tyrod has played well enough for us to win games we've lost. But in those games he didn't play well enough to win them. And that's why we will never be good with Tyrod. Yes, we can beat teams without great QB's like the Texans if everything goes to plan. But when things don't go as planned we don't have a guy who can sling it and win. I'm watching the Steelers right now. Tyrod is no where near Rothlisberger and he never will be. Tyrod will never be able to out duel Rothlisberger, Brady, Rogers, Brees, Newton, Wilson, and so on...and those are the guys that are always scrapping for the Lombardi. Tyrod can get us to the playoffs if all things go according to plan. But that's it. We're not winning much else with him. That is why we don't resign Tyrod, we let him play out next year while the QB we should draft in the 1st or 2nd round sits a year. That HAS to be the plan. If it isn't, then shame on OBD. That's why you are THE DUDE!! Tyrod is the equivalent of Frank Reich. We need a "Jim Kelly"!!
Section242 Posted December 22, 2015 Posted December 22, 2015 If we can agree he can improve, which we mostly cannot, then we could talk about playoffs maybe next year. How have you decided he cannot take us to the superbowl at some point? Honest question. to me getting to the super bowl takes a completely dialed in team effort and some very good luck. not just a QB. : ) I think it's a passing league and the Bills have a poor passing attack with Taylor. His numbers aren't bad. 300 yards is an arbitrary number that guys like Blaine Gabbert have hit this year and Taylor has not. It's as likely he can regress like Bob Griffin, Josh Freeman, Colin Kaepernick, or even Bills QB's of past like Losman, Edwards, and Fitzpatrick. If the Bills wanna be a team like KC who looks like they'll make the playoffs and have a nice season but IMO have no shot at a SB than Taylor can be the guy.
3rdand12 Posted December 22, 2015 Posted December 22, 2015 I think it's a passing league and the Bills have a poor passing attack with Taylor. His numbers aren't bad. 300 yards is an arbitrary number that guys like Blaine Gabbert have hit this year and Taylor has not. It's as likely he can regress like Bob Griffin, Josh Freeman, Colin Kaepernick, or even Bills QB's of past like Losman, Edwards, and Fitzpatrick. If the Bills wanna be a team like KC who looks like they'll make the playoffs and have a nice season but IMO have no shot at a SB than Taylor can be the guy. first season under Roman. and first season starting. be patient : )
PromoTheRobot Posted December 22, 2015 Posted December 22, 2015 I love people who act like they won't settle for anything less than a Tom Brady clone. Like if you hold your breath long enough, daddy will get you a franchise QB. They don't realize that no one comes out of the box ready to play. There is a learning curve all players go though. It takes 3-5 years.
corey g Posted December 22, 2015 Posted December 22, 2015 What is it about everybody acting like two things are true, 1. That world beater, all time great QB's grow on trees? You've only seen TWO truly all time outstanding QB's in the last twenty years, Brady and Manning. Not that easy to find 2. And most importantly, blame always falls on the QB during poor stretches, this often isn't warranted, neither is giving a QB all the credit for a teams success. In the same breath you will use to tell me we can't win games because of Tyrod, you won't mention that in 5 of the 7 Super Bowls won by Brady and Big Ben, they were not the driving force behind them. Big Ben gets called all time great now, without mentioning that he may be surrounded by the most outstanding core of weapons EVER. Nobody would care to mention that since both Brady and Ben (Especially Ben) became elite statistical passers, their teams have been less successful. You can't have it both ways, it can't be all TT's fault because his numbers aren't gaudy, if those QB's with gaudy numbers don't win what's the point?
Meatplow Posted December 22, 2015 Posted December 22, 2015 (edited) I'm so sick of "Tyrod's not the reason we lost" crap. True, Tyrod has played well enough for us to win games we've lost. But in those games he didn't play well enough to win them. And that's why we will never be good with Tyrod. Yes, we can beat teams without great QB's like the Texans if everything goes to plan. But when things don't go as planned we don't have a guy who can sling it and win. I'm watching the Steelers right now. Tyrod is no where near Rothlisberger and he never will be. Tyrod will never be able to out duel Rothlisberger, Brady, Rogers, Brees, Newton, Wilson, and so on...and those are the guys that are always scrapping for the Lombardi. Tyrod can get us to the playoffs if all things go according to plan. But that's it. We're not winning much else with him. That is why we don't resign Tyrod, we let him play out next year while the QB we should draft in the 1st or 2nd round sits a year. That HAS to be the plan. If it isn't, then shame on OBD. Are you !@#$ing high? Apparently I shouldn't have created an account and started posting here. For every 20 people that post on this board about real issues, like defense, O-line, discipline, schemes and coaching across the board, there are at least a quarter of them that still point at the QB spot as a position of concern. I clearly DON'T belong in the dumpster fire that is the fan base on TBD. Edited December 22, 2015 by Meatplow
Maury Ballstein Posted December 22, 2015 Posted December 22, 2015 Are you !@#$ing high? Apparently I shouldn't have created an account and started posting here. For every 20 people that post on this board about real issues, like defense, O-line, discipline, schemes and coaching across the board, there are at least a quarter of them that still point at the QB spot as a position of concern. I clearly DON'T belong in the dumpster fire that is the fan base on TBD. Feel better ? Yes the .500 qb who disappears for long stretches is not an issue. As Kirk Cousins would say. "YOU LIKE THAT!"
NOVABillsFan Posted December 22, 2015 Posted December 22, 2015 (edited) The difference is Tyrod has played much better then the player you are indicating. Not to continue these redundant arguments, but that may be pure speculation on your part. Feel better ? Yes the .500 qb who disappears for long stretches is not an issue. As Kirk Cousins would say. "YOU LIKE THAT!" Sorry to intrude and I hope I am not missing the point here.... Like Tyrod at 6-6? Edited December 22, 2015 by NOVABillsFan
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