Prickly Pete Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 Lack of team cohesion is because of a lack of continuity. The team has not been together long. It's progressing in fits and starts. Chill. Darby is the only new starter on the defense. Ryan's Scheme has never yielded many sacks, so that is just a continuation. They could place last in the division, and will likely finish 7-9, with a schedule that included 4 teams from the worst division, and 2 teams from the bottom of the worst AFC division. They have ONE win against a team with a winning record. That's not progress to me. With the offense, I can accept the lack of continuity, but not the defense. And lack of continuity shouldn't lead to ridiculous amounts of penalties, and pitiful Special Teams play. That's not progress Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fansince88 Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 We're not talking about on-field play, we're talking about locker room leadership. And Spikes played a major role in that last year. Yep, Aaron being gone definitely reduced the leadership (at least on D) drastically. I've said all season the LB play struggled and it was solely because of Spikes. Is it not possible to bring him back next year. Everyone talks about the Flutie Curse. We started loosing again when they cut him. He was a leader. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
machine gun kelly Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 Team cohesion starts with leadership, and we have a lack of it with Rex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted December 16, 2015 Author Share Posted December 16, 2015 Darby is the only new starter on the defense. Ryan's Scheme has never yielded many sacks, so that is just a continuation. They could place last in the division, and will likely finish 7-9, with a schedule that included 4 teams from the worst division, and 2 teams from the bottom of the worst AFC division. They have ONE win against a team with a winning record. That's not progress to me. With the offense, I can accept the lack of continuity, but not the defense. And lack of continuity shouldn't lead to ridiculous amounts of penalties, and pitiful Special Teams play. That's not progress Only one new starter on defense this year? Well that's odd considering Spikes was gone, Searcy was gone, Aaron Williams has been injured for 10.75 of our 13 games so far, Kyle Williams has been out for 7 games, Bradham has missed 3 games, McKelvin missed the first 8 and Graham is playing a different position. This fallacy that this year's defense is a personnel carbon copy of last year's simply must end. @ChrisTrapasso Perspective: In 2014: #Bills D starters missed total of 13 games due to injury. In 2015 thru Week 14: #Bills D starters have missed 29 games http://twitter.com/C...445403626115073 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 (edited) Only one new starter on defense this year? Well that's odd considering Spikes was gone, Searcy was gone, Aaron Williams has been injured for 10.75 of our 13 games so far, Kyle Williams has been out for 7 games, Bradham has missed 3 games, McKelvin missed the first 8 and Graham is playing a different position. This fallacy that this year's defense is a personnel carbon copy of last year's simply must end. @ChrisTrapasso Perspective: In 2014: #Bills D starters missed total of 13 games due to injury. In 2015 thru Week 14: #Bills D starters have missed 29 games http://twitter.com/C...445403626115073 It's true, I was wrong about them being starters (they all had playing time, and Graham has Safety experience), but Darby is the only starter that wasn't with the team last season. I was responding to the poster's assertion that "this team hasn't been together long". And what about my other points? (crickets...) Edited December 16, 2015 by HoF Watkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DriveFor1Outta5 Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 Pegula cant change this. The players have to want to change this. So many of the SB Bills wanted to be the best. We had offensive and defensive players of the year on both sides of the ball, a special teamer who wanted to be the best special team player ever. Kelly wanted to be as good as Elway and Marino, Bruce shredded stair masters. quickly went from an overweight slug to a stud. I just dont see that desire/pride with the non playoff Bills. I agree, but I do think Pegula can change that. I also don't believe the players can. The players we have on the roster now are what they are. We need to do a better job drafting players that fit your description. That is a change that can be made from the top down. We draft tons of talent, but never create a complete cohesive team. We lack direction, and attempt to stockpile talent with no regard to how the parts fit together. We don't keep a system long enough to build around it. We need players who are smart with a strong drive to succeed. Not simply a collection of former big time college players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted December 16, 2015 Author Share Posted December 16, 2015 It's true, I was wrong about them being starters (they all had playing time, and Graham has Safety experience), but Darby is the only starter that wasn't with the team last season. I was responding to the poster's assertion that "this team hasn't been together long". And what about my other points? (crickets...) I actually have addressed your other points in other threads, but it's very much worth revisiting here since you, like the vast majority of Internet Bills fans fail to understand the correlation between lack of continuity which leads to scheme upheaval which leads to learning curves which leads to players playing with a lack of certainty which leads to compromised focus and concentration which leads to being a half step behind which leads to overcompensation which leads to errors and/or penalties. When we just call them "mental errors" or we decide that penalties and miscues are simply symptomatic of being "undisciplined" we're not taking the time necessary to really explore the causes of our problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 Talley can't expect teams to have the same cohesion as the 90's Bills in this era of the salary cap where players do not get to spend the bulk of their careers with one team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 I actually have addressed your other points in other threads, but it's very much worth revisiting here since you, like the vast majority of Internet Bills fans fail to understand the correlation between lack of continuity which leads to scheme upheaval which leads to learning curves which leads to players playing with a lack of certainty which leads to compromised focus and concentration which leads to being a half step behind which leads to overcompensation which leads to errors and/or penalties. When we just call them "mental errors" or we decide that penalties and miscues are simply symptomatic of being "undisciplined" we're not taking the time necessary to really explore the causes of our problems. They are on pace to break the all time record for penalties. I realize the NFL is calling more penalties too, but that's no consolation. Are these Bills lacking continuity at an all time level? Has there never been another team with more changes? It's not continuity, that's a poor excuse. I saw it coming around week 3 of the season, and THEY HAVEN'T IMPROVED. If it's just continuity, wouldn't it get better as the season progresses? Nope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted December 16, 2015 Author Share Posted December 16, 2015 They are on pace to break the all time record for penalties. I realize the NFL is calling more penalties too, but that's no consolation. Are these Bills lacking continuity at an all time level? Has there never been another team with more changes? It's not continuity, that's a poor excuse. I saw it coming around week 3 of the season, and THEY HAVEN'T IMPROVED. If it's just continuity, wouldn't it get better as the season progresses? Nope. Well, one thing has been constant during the playoff drought and it's the one thing fans want more of. So bring on the changes. Let's blow the !@#$ing thing up. Take a page straight from the Cleveland playbook. If you're aruging against continuity, this is what you're arguing for. And to answer your question, I think it could actually be argued that few teams in the history of the NFL have complicated their schemes more so in 12 months than the Bills just have. From Hackett to Roman--you really want to argue this one?--and from Schwartz to Ryan--players past and present have called Rex's scheme intricate and complicated and Schwartz, by his own admission, runs a very simple one. So, yeah, it's quite plausible that no other team has been asked to learn more between seasons. It's not an excuse. There is empirical evidence to support the merits of continuity. It's not an excuse. And no, the defense that's been out it's pro bowl DT, the unit's unquestioned leader, it's starting SS, a starting linebacker and now it's CB1 has not improved as the season has gone on. You can ignore other factors to make your point all you want, that doesn't mean they've gone away. Likewise, to argue that the Bills are on pace to set a record in penalties due entirely to their own stupidity, that each and every call against them has been right and just is just plain obstinant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 And no, the defense that's been out it's pro bowl DT, the unit's unquestioned leader, it's starting SS, a starting linebacker and now it's CB1 has not improved as the season has gone on. You can ignore other factors to make your point all you want, that doesn't mean they've gone away. I don't disagree with your overall point. However, the D still sucked even before Kyle and Aaron Williams and Nigel now Gilmore went out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted December 16, 2015 Author Share Posted December 16, 2015 I don't disagree with your overall point. However, the D still sucked even before Kyle and Aaron Williams and Nigel now Gilmore went out. No it didn't. Aaron Williams played for all of seven quarters which included the suffocating win over the Colts. Kyle Williams went out during the Cincy game, meaning Patriots game aside, the defense had stout performances in all the games he played in: Indy, Miami, NYG, Ten. And Nigel Bradham's injury literally opened up the middle of the field for KC to march up and down the field willy nilly in that game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 (edited) Well, one thing has been constant during the playoff drought and it's the one thing fans want more of. So bring on the changes. Let's blow the !@#$ing thing up. Take a page straight from the Cleveland playbook. If you're aruging against continuity, this is what you're arguing for. And to answer your question, I think it could actually be argued that few teams in the history of the NFL have complicated their schemes more so in 12 months than the Bills just have. From Hackett to Roman--you really want to argue this one?--and from Schwartz to Ryan--players past and present have called Rex's scheme intricate and complicated and Schwartz, by his own admission, runs a very simple one. So, yeah, it's quite plausible that no other team has been asked to learn more between seasons. It's not an excuse. There is empirical evidence to support the merits of continuity. It's not an excuse. And no, the defense that's been out it's pro bowl DT, the unit's unquestioned leader, it's starting SS, a starting linebacker and now it's CB1 has not improved as the season has gone on. You can ignore other factors to make your point all you want, that doesn't mean they've gone away. Likewise, to argue that the Bills are on pace to set a record in penalties due entirely to their own stupidity, that each and every call against them has been right and just is just plain obstinant. I'm all for continuity. In fact, that is my whole point, they shouldn't have changed the defensive scheme so radically. I'm not for starting up some new continuity after they had already built some up. I don't believe that it is a lack of continuity from the players, but a lack of continuity from the coaches. Edited December 16, 2015 by HoF Watkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted December 16, 2015 Author Share Posted December 16, 2015 I'm all for continuity. In fact, that is my whole point, the shouldn't have changed the defensive scheme so radically. I'm not for starting the continuity after they had already built some up. Then they shouldn't have hired Rex. Do you have a link to where you voiced this concern last January? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddogblitz Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 No it didn't. Aaron Williams played for all of seven quarters which included the suffocating win over the Colts. Kyle Williams went out during the Cincy game, meaning Patriots game aside, the defense had stout performances in all the games he played in: Indy, Miami, NYG, Ten. And Nigel Bradham's injury literally opened up the middle of the field for KC to march up and down the field willy nilly in that game. I think it did. And how was the Giants game a stout performance? Eli threw 3 TD passes in that game. Nigel's missed Tackle turned what should have been a loss into the dagger TD. In the Patsies** game which you toss out, poster boy Aaron Williams put us in a huge hole with his poor play/immature shenanigans. As far as the injuries I disagree there as well. Every team has injuries. And as far as seasons usually go, injuries have been light on D IMHO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Big Cat Posted December 16, 2015 Author Share Posted December 16, 2015 I think it did. And how was the Giants game a stout performance? Eli threw 3 TD passes in that game. Nigel's missed Tackle turned what should have been a loss into the dagger TD. In the Patsies** game which you toss out, poster boy Aaron Williams put us in a huge hole with his poor play/immature shenanigans. As far as the injuries I disagree there as well. Every team has injuries. And as far as seasons usually go, injuries have been light on D IMHO. A missed tackle does not an overall poor defensive performance make. Had he made the tackle, Eli would have been held under 200 yards on the day. Okay, fine, that does virtually nothing to take away from any of my points. Quantifiably false: @ChrisTrapasso Perspective: In 2014: #Bills D starters missed total of 13 games due to injury. In 2015 thru Week 14: #Bills D starters have missed 29 games http://twitter.com/C...445403626115073 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UBBullsfan Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 A missed tackle does not an overall poor defensive performance make. Had he made the tackle, Eli would have been held under 200 yards on the day. Okay, fine, that does virtually nothing to take away from any of my points. Quantifiably false: @ChrisTrapasso Perspective: In 2014: #Bills D starters missed total of 13 games due to injury. In 2015 thru Week 14: #Bills D starters have missed 29 games http://twitter.com/C...445403626115073 Can't count on players not getting injured. It's better to design your team so that you don't need luck to be successful Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 Can't count on players not getting injured. It's better to design your team so that you don't need luck to be successful All good teams are lucky. It's often the biggest difference maker in the NFL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 (edited) Then they shouldn't have hired Rex. Do you have a link to where you voiced this concern last January? I will find it. I had doubts about Ryan from the start. And as far as the current situation is concerned, I think a new DC should be brought in, and Rex should learn some new tricks, adapting to the players he has. http://forums.twobillsdrive.com/topic/177042-more-jerks-on-the-bills-equals-more-victories/?hl=trashy&do=findComment&comment=3501043 Edited December 16, 2015 by HoF Watkins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UBBullsfan Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 All good teams are lucky. It's often the biggest difference maker in the NFL. Well I'm pretty darn sure the Patriots will find a way to overcome their injuries (there's been a ton of them), and at least play in the Superbowl. So injuries aren't everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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